I've been looking for quite a while and can't find anyone in the San Diego area that teaches White Eyebrow. I need help in finding a school. Any suggestions??
THANKS
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I've been looking for quite a while and can't find anyone in the San Diego area that teaches White Eyebrow. I need help in finding a school. Any suggestions??
THANKS
Man, I don't know why they are so few and far between.:mad:
I don't know about BM schools. What about Soujourn Past? That is a school in San Diego. They teach Dragon there, and Mok Gar?
I think that you are talking about Sifu Steve Martin. To the best of my knowledge he has moved his school to either Arizona or New Mexico. I can't remember which. The school that is there now teaches Baguazhang last time I heard.Quote:
Originally Posted by TAO YIN
I know that they have White Tiger in the San Diego area. :D
Also there is pretty good CLF/Five Animals/Five Family out that way in Oceanside if you don't mind the drive. The Sifu's name is Mario Figueroa and while I have never seen him teach, his understanding is quite good. Food for thought.
If you are still set on BM and dont mind the drive. We are two hours north of SD in Palm Desert(palm springs area).
I would agree that Sifu Martin has moved his school. I tried contacting him a few weeks ago and no reply. Still looking for White Eyebrow instruction in the San Diego area. That's White Eyebrow, not Tiger. Hoping somebody can steer me in the right direction.
its an hakka art and like the other hakka arts its traditionally kept in the family, its actually quite surprising to me that there are so many public schools these days its a good sign.Quote:
Originally Posted by kfson
Frost, I don't think its just the Hakka thing. In the past, perhaps, but currently, less so.Quote:
Originally Posted by Frost
There is a tradition in Pak Mei not to be commercial, to pass the art only to people who have demonstrated commitment and diligence. Thus, not a lot of advertising.
Also, in the US you have mostly Futsan Pak Mei, with the exception of NYC, and some stuff in Florida, and I've heard Chicago, but not much info available to me on that. That branch is much more commercial than others.
Futsan style centers around Zhoung Luo in SF and Eddie Chong in LA (or the surrounds). Both have trained a lot of students over the years, and they have likely dispersed into smaller schools...
Perhaps if you contacted Luo Sifu's school, they might have someone down in San Diego.
You also have the 'mixed' schools, where somebody has some level of Pak Mei training, and mixes it with something else, and adds it to their 'product range'. This is pretty suspect in most cases, as would be buying a Ferarri at Joe's Used Buicks. We should have established by now that just memorising a form or two is not learning Pak Mei.
Canada, due to its commonwealth relationship with Hong Kong, has the best Pak Mei in North America, Vancouver, Toronto, Calgary, Edmonton, and perhaps more - some are obviously better than others, but these come from the mainstream line.
Vietnam, Taiwan, Holland, Belgium, Spain, South America, England, NZ, Australia all have at least one school, some have now begun to add more as students have matured.
Pak Mei is being lost, there were a lot of Sifu's who thought they knew better and added their stuff to the style, but they didn't.
There are a lot of students that started teaching before they had the skills or understanding.
There are a lot of teachers that closed their hands because they couldn't get students who showed the commitment or the discipline, or their students abused the art.
I've heard it said that even in China, it is lost in all but a few locations as the Chinese embrace both capitalism and MMA with equal fervour.
In a nutshell, its a hard style to find because its a hard style to learn, and most people want a quick fix for fighting, or a beautiful style for forms. A lot of people like the idea of learning Pak Mei, but very few have what it takes.
That's well put Mr Cha. :-)
I agree about the hakka 'thang', overplayed, overhyped and not necessarily true.
I am also of the school that dictates Pak Mei can only be learned by the learned.
Very unfortunate.Quote:
Originally Posted by Yum Cha
I'm assuming that since the White Eyebrow style group is so small, there must be a leading (orthodox) school in Hong Kong or someplace in China. If it's possible, without stepping on anyone's toes, could someone post the leading school(s) in China and any associated schools in North America? If not, a pm would be appreciated, although public info would be better for others to see.
With a minimum amount of Google, you will be able to figure this all out. The Dutch school has the best website for links, btw.Quote:
Originally Posted by kfson
There are some complicating issues, like friendship and association does not equal talent.
There are many quality Sifu's who you'll never see advertising or promoting. Pak Mei has a tradition of being taught for free, informally.
There are lots of wanna bes who talk the Pak Mei talk, but can't walk the walk, but unless you know something about the style, you'd never know.
There are basically 3 versions, HK, Guangzhou and Futsan.
HK is where Cheng Bing Lam (5th generation), the last son of Cheng Lai Cheun has his school. He has an association. They are the standard bearers for Pak Mei worldwide, by default.
There is another Association in HK as well, lower profile from some other 5th generation sifus.
Guangzhou style (mine) starts at the beginning and then continues after CLC left for HK at the end of WWII. It is very informal, and still rather underground.
Futsan Pak Mei is an offshoot from Guangzhou Pak Mei developed by a student of Har Hon Hong. Someone there has political issues with HK, and is trying to create an alternatie lineage to explain the significant differences between their modern style, and the modern style of the other lineages.
There are also branches in Vietnam, Singapore and Taiwan, south america, that date back to the time before and during WWII when CLC's students (5th generation) were distributed to different parts of Asia during the great changes that happened then. These have all now spun off students that have gone all over the world to teach.
Canada has a split of HK and Guangzhou Pak Mei.
US has Man Kwong Fong in NY, from the HK lineage, but for some reason, he never appears on the HK lineage register. They have skillz, for sure, but. Not sure what the reason for the drama is.
There is another HK stylist teaching in Jacksonville that I know.
US has lots of Futsan Pak Mei, some much better than others. Its a lot different to what I do.
Guangzhou forms are simpler and to my mind free flowing, some may say sloppier, HK forms are more rigid and technical and have more small detail, Futsan are more complicated and longer, and I won't add any personal opinions beyond that.
Something to remember about Pak Mei, almost every 5 generation teacher was a master of one style or another when they followed CLC (called himself 4 generation). Afterwards, they all added to the style, more or less depending. It is a style that can take lots of superficial change as long as the core principles are applied.
Some masters added and re-built substantial amounts of it, i.e. Futsan
Some masters just created and added a signature form(s) - Vietnam, Hap Ging Do in Gunagzhou.
Some masters never learned but the advanced forms at the top of the ladder...
And, there are heaps of people that learned a form or two, and added "Pak Mei" to their menu of arts that they teach...
The big American schools are in NY (Man Kwong Fong - HK) and SF (Zhoung Luo - Fatsan) They might tell you where their decendents are teaching in the US.
Eddie Chong is in LA, but he mixes a lot of Futsan and Wing Chun.
A decendent from Chan Dor is in Jacksonville FL, but I don't know if he takes students or not.
That's about it.
Pretty good Yum Cha. Thanks for that. From what I understand (waht was basically told to me), there are twelve lines of Bak Mei. I suppose that the 3 that you've named are perhaps the biggest. Perhaps the rest are offshots of the 3 or perhaps exist outside of the that are known. Who can say? I, for one, would love to see them.
Thanks for taking the time to post that info.Quote:
Originally Posted by Yum Cha