http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z_Nk4...eature=related
What's the lineage of this Sup Gee?...looks a lot different than what I'm being shown in Vancouver through Yip Chi Sum lineage.
More questions to follow.
Peace
Printable View
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z_Nk4...eature=related
What's the lineage of this Sup Gee?...looks a lot different than what I'm being shown in Vancouver through Yip Chi Sum lineage.
More questions to follow.
Peace
doesn't look like any Sup Ji-for that matter Bak mei, that I've ever seen.
His structure seems to not be in alignment with BMP theory.
It might be futsan pak mei... hard to tell... Not like Sek Sze that I know.
I read the headlines but had no idea to care, now I'm putting full time all my free time into Bak Mei yall really need to give me the page by page details on the genesis of doo wai and one J. Lacey.
http://www.youtube.com/user/Tosserha.../2/gw4pasFPfUY
lmao
what an idiot, you're suppossed to stand and you punch as soon as tension is there...lol
The first one is Cross Fist, Character Ten fist, from Futsan lineage. There are vids you can check out of Zhong Luo on Youtube teaching all of that form step by step. There are also a few vids of him doing demos. There are also vids on Youtube of peeps from Futsan lineage in China doing that form. Different than most all Sup Jee or Sek Sze forms from other Bak Mei lineages.
The second one is the first Bak Mei form, Straight Step Fist, but from Doo Wai lineage. The guy is obviously not doing it properly here because of the steps mainly, and other reasons...A good form though done properly. Not much different than most Jik Bo from other Bak Mei lineages aside from some moves.
I thought it might be Futsan Pak Mei.
There is no Doo Wai lineage of Pak Mei.
It is total fabricated crap unrelated to Pak Mei other than what he learned in a few months from Wilkie Wu in Vancouver. The video demonstrates no understanding of pak mei, simply a mimic of some superficial movement. It is completely different to Jik Bo from real pak mei. Just to be clear on that point. There is no Doo Wai Pak Mei.
But, feel free to call it "white tiger", I'm fine with that. :D
"It is completely different to Jik Bo from real pak mei. Just to be clear on that point."
No kidding!
No jing, no swallowing or spitting, shoulders too high, no rooting, etc, etc.
Either a beginner or someone that was taught the moves with no intent or perhaps a "video" trainee.
but WAIT!! The videos introduce him as Grand Master!......
This is Doo Wai kung fu, sometimes called Pak Mei, but following some push back from real Pak Mei people, he changed the name to White Tiger. These are old videos.
There is no skill, other than in the spinning of the story....
LMFAO!!!:D
Doo studied in HK with you lots hero, CLC. If he also did with WW, then fine. Great for him.
Anyways, so let me get this right...
Lai Yip Jeurng,
Yum Yeurng Kum La Sau,
Bil Jee,
Sut Choy,
Chum Choy Toi,
Kol La Fu Jow,
Gwok Jeurng,
Soy Kuil,
This isn't principles from Bak Mei Jik Bo?
Out of curiosity,
I have heard the story a few times around the world of Doo being asked to change the name. I don't know the extent of the truth with all of it since the name has been BFP for as long as he has been known to the media since, the 60s.
Anyways,
Why didn't Futsan Bak Mei from the other line get pushed to change their name back in the day???
doo was crap when he started and he is crap now.
i say this because he is such a pathetic liar and now he is fashioning himself as a medicine man.
lord knows what sort of damage he'll do there.
he's a case study of fraudulent kungfu "masters" though.
nuff said.
anyone who doesn't like that can blow me. :p
:p
Oh! Well, I could care less if he lies or embellishes. He's Chinese...:eek:
He's been both a kung fu and TCM man all along.
Seriously, without flaming and trolling. What is wrong with his internal fu?
Better yet, why is his medicine bad??? What contraindications occur? What messes up the yin and yang organs? He's a fuucking licensed TCM doctor...
Noone is going to blow you. Don't worry so much.
He told you this? My, what a surprise.
He also got the secret of smoking fingers from him too, I bet. And the 5 finger heart exploding hand? How about the bit where he showed CLC some of his secret family fu, and that is how he created Sub Baat?
I've heard it all, and I don't believe a single word of it. You're in an unlucky position.
Regardless of what you hope, that sad truth remains, you are entitled to your own opinions, but not your own facts.
Ah well, Yum Cha,
No, he didn't tell me this. I don't know the man. I don't study or practice Bak Fu Pai or Bak Mei Pai for that matter. I follow the internal Yau Kung Mun from Tiat Yun and BJJ, only. That doesn't mean that I can't read and research. For the sake of modern historical study, let's let all the cats out of the bags...
Isn't Doo-- Wilkie Wu anyways? Wasn't that the story here about 8 years back or so? That his real name was Wilkie Wu, and that after some triad nastyness, his wife and child got killed, and he fled to America??? This was the story spouted about 8 years back. Good story until everyone realizes, or had realized, that Wilkie Wu was and is a real person living in Canada, who never fled Canada...
I digress...
Wasn't it Wai's father who studied at the same temple as CLC? Who knows? All hearsay until someone comes up with concrete evidence. Wasn't it CLC who studied at that temple? Who knows? All hearsay until someone comes up with concrete evidence.
Did Wai study with CLC in Hong Kong? Who knows? All hearsay until someone comes up with concrete evidence. CLC would have been 70 or so when Doo went there. But, many people for back then to now have said yes on both sides apparently... If you really want to know, (which I don't), take CBL a picture and see how he reacts. Seriously, see how he psychologically reacts...
But, why would CBF and CBL call Doo Wai, which they did according to most involved apparently (No I wasn't there), and ask him not to call what he was teaching in his $$$ videotape, Bak Mei? Why would they even know who he was??? That was the case according to most on both sides. That was back in the late 80s mind you, not the late 50s.
If you go to Guangzhou and ask people, they don't know. If you go to Foshan and ask people, they don't know too. If you go to Hong Kong and ask people, they will just say no, or they don't know too....
The point here, is that noone who really knows about these things ever says ANYTHING about it. I'm talking people who were alive then, training in the 50s and 60s.
Me questioning in any of this has nothing to do with what Chinese Kung Fu men say about each other and their lineages. I couldn't give a shiit about all of that because I know how important lineage, legend, and mah jong is to Chinese Kung Fu men. I couldn't give a shiit who studied with who, for how long, and all of that other useless Bullshiit.
My questioning is more physical if you will. AND my question is,
WHY WOULD DOO WAI KNOW EVERY BAK MEI FORM AND JONG JUST AS IT WAS TAUGHT IN HONG KONG AT THAT TIME??? WHY??? More importantly, HOW???
If you choose to believe, pay your money and take your chances.
Its not about 'politics' its about Buyer Beware. Plain and simple.
:confused:
Are you talking to me or everyone? Because me personally...I am not buying ANYTHING without bargaining (lived in China too long), and if I am talking to a Chinese Kung Fu Man Sifu...I'll bargain and ask them all kinds of nasty little questions, in their own language no less. This usually gets "them" to walk the other way quickly, (especially the language bit), and fumble around in their pockets for half a dozen smokes (glad I quit)...
The question stays,
Why would Wai have complete knowledge and understanding of the entire Bak Mei system???
Was he the first home video student of Bak Mei back in the days or some shiit? hehehe! :D
Didn't this start out about Pak Mei? Or have I picked up the wrong magazine again?
1) Doo Wai is a joke.
2) Yau Kung is a joke.
3) Being able to speak Chinese is as necessary to understand Chinese boxing as quadratic equations are to an earthworm.
4) Cats dont get into bags unless someone puts them in there in the first place
5) This is probably all stuff I 'heard'.
Lai See,
What? Yau Kung is a joke now? Please, please explain that one. Har Hon Hung wasn't a student of CLC? He wasn't a student of Tiat Yun? Seriously, please explain this to me.
About the other bit, I'll wait until my question is answered, which is won't be.
:D
You are right, Mah Jong is cool. I like Mah Jong and dumb fark talk, not Mah Jong and "no it goes this way because I am the original bad arse," talk. That usually just makes me want to throw the pieces at whoever said it then turn the table over on them...You see how it gets out of hand?:eek:
Sigung is not PMPai, he's the head of Bak Fu Pai. Bak Fu Pai is a family style that has been kept within the family for years and has been taught to a few people outside the family. Of course, taking into consideration how many people have studied a style like Lung Ying or Pak Mei. Bak Fu Pai is similar to Pak Mei, just as Pak Mei is to Lung Ying. There short hand styles! Comparing PM to BFP is almost like comparing Chu Gar Gao and Jook Lum. Same hands, different energies. One style is know for it's geng ging and the other for it's Yau Kung. Geng Ging is but the beginning for us in Bak Fu. Same is true is YKM!
Don't judge Sigung by a guy who isn't even his student. Sigung has a clip of him on youtube doing jikbo back in the days. He's actually training the energy form, as the Pak Mei he has is called Hung Mo/ErMei Bak Mei and every routine has a fighting form, chi gung form and a endurance form.
Bless,
Buby
:D
Bro, How goes it?
Yep, I guess that I am going to have to wait for any rational responses. Oh well, it's Friday! :)
Take care
Sigung? I see your video sifu Garry is still associated with Doo Wai.
As you referred to the Doo Wai jik bo clip, and apparently consider yourself a Bak Fu Pai practitioner (via video?), perhaps you can answer these questions:
I never did get any answers during that whole donny brook.
Reality Check,
Maybe you can answer my question since you seem to know:
Why would Wai have complete knowledge and understanding of the entire Bak Mei system???
:confused:
[QUOTE=sanjuro_ronin;996453]No jing, no swallowing or spitting, shoulders too high, no rooting, etc, etc.
Either a beginner or someone that was taught the moves with no intent or perhaps a "video" trainee.[/QU I don't get it, I'm on my way to BAK MEI on a friday night could be@da bar. Why do people sell fake video instead of spending time training properly...like from the level of studying fitness theory the topic issue is hilarious.
Yum Cha,
Very good point. I'll gladly answer as bluntly as possible and give my views. Perhaps this will take some space...I will be as objectively as possible, and I won't sit on the fence.
With regards to my question... I have no fuucking idea...I can speculate although I hate to because it isn't very objective now is it?
-Wai learned from his father, and his father, and so forth.
-Wai's father was friends with CLC.
-Wai was friends with CLC.
-Wai's father learned from the monk on the mountain too.
-Wai's father learned from one of the monks disciples.
-Wai was a student of many in Hong Kong, and somehow through great memory remembered all that he saw to where he knew all of the complexities of various styles, and went from there.
-Wai witnessed lots of Fu in Hong Kong from various styles, miraculously remembered complex hand movements and principles from all of them, and went from there.
Now, I could go on and on with speculation, the POINT HERE is...I don't know, and YOU DON'T KNOW TOO. Noone here needs to pretend that they do.
-You saying that you don't believe because so and so who wasn't even there, or for that matter born during that time, means nothing to me. Pointless debate.
-You saying that you don't believe, because so and so who was there, and was born during that time, again means nothing to me. Why? Because every Chinese Kung Fu Man, is out for number one, and has their own agendas...If you really think about it, we could spout of bullshiite about every Chinese Kung Fu man under the sun, forever...
-Reality Check, although having a cute name and posting some article from Wai, also proves NOTHING. As usual. Why? Wai might have made all of that up in that article just to cover his agenda, no matter what it was. I am not saying that he did. NO ONE KNOWS!!! If someone does, they ain't saying it here.
Now, I reckon that you lot are educated people. All that has been said here in this thread, all that has been said in the past on the nets and in magazines, all of it, MEANS ABSOLUTE SHIITE!!! And you all know that. If you don't, then you have made up an answer for yourself. Which if that is the case, would be a crock of bullshiite as well. The only thing that matters in all of this in the end of it all, that is for people who can get over themselves and can wade out of The Chinese Kung Fu Man Role Syndrome Shiit, is the physical aspects of it.
DOES ANYONE WANT TO TALK ABOUT THE PHYSICAL ASPECTS OF IT? Not talking about mosquitoe hand talk from watching a vid on youtube. Post your experiences from training Wai's watered down Bak Mei as you like to call it. Tell me, what worked and didn't in all of the clubs that all of you bounce in, in all of the tourneys that all of you are in, in your military bullshiite, and etc...Tell me why the forms are the way that they are, and why one is better than the other. THEN, COMPARE AND CONTRAST IT TO BAK MEI....
TELL ME WHY HAVING QUICK HEAVY AND LOOSE HANDS IS A BAD IDEA, AND THAT IT IS BETTER TO HUNCH OVER WITH YOUR SHOULDERS STUCK OUT WAY IN FRONT OF YOUR BODY AND JUST USE YOUR WAISTE AND BREATH with movement. (For christ's sake, even Peek-a-boo style boxing doesn't do this).
So to close, let's all stop blowing smoke up each other arses. The way people carry on here about who did this and that, is farking SO poofta gay.
When the truth is found, it's usually not as cool as we thought it might be. If we really knew the full and absolute truth about CLC, it probably wouldn't be near as cool as we thought it might have been. If you guys can't see this, in regards to everything in life, you've got your blinkers on to a very farked up degree.
Cheers.
Tao
I still train with Sifu Garry, just not via vid. anymore. I vid what I train with him.;) Yeah, I've been training thai since 95 and boxing since 82. My uncle and the crew he ran with were pretty big in the street fight scene in bedsty(70s-mid80s), so he taught me to box and he and his boy Pebbles taught me the blocks version of the 52.
If you ever in NYC holla at me. Jers aint to bad. Atleast, ya got the med. marijuana bill.:eek::D
Buby
Tao,
You keep coming up with the regurgitation of his con, and his poor woe is me, everybody is jealous of my secret skills jive.
You are reciting the con, chapter and verse, maybe this, maybe that, always looking for the reason to believe, not the proof.
You have ONE source, and of course your comrades who also drank the kool aid.
I know its going to break your heart, but Pak Mei is a fairy tale, let me say it once again in case you didn't get it the first 10 times. Its a fairy tale.
He didn't have secret stuff that CLC didn't get because he didn't exist.
People can practice hitting a nail with a hammer and get kung fu. People can train the most simplistic martial art and learn to fight exceptionally. Spirit, the human intellect and physical training can create fighting skill from very little other than sweat. That proves nothing.
Logically, you are caught in a loop: You believe what he told you, that nobody else knows, and surely everybody proves it, that they don't know indeed.
The problem is, people do know. They know where he came from, they know how he reacts when they come up and knock on his door, they know his objectives, because he has videos still out there that show his game.
But all that aside, there's his skills. His lessons and performances are all over the internet. His 'secret family style, handed down father to son for generations and so tightly held, is all over the internet like pay per view sex chat come ons.
The physical reasons have been discussed ad nausium, but we always come back to his people trying to recite his con back to justify verbally what can't be justified physically.
You want a lesson from me now, on the difference between his style and Pak Mei?
You want to talk to me about internal Pak Mei and Ng Hang Mo, Siu Jau Teen, Di jau teen and lok gang ging, and the methods of cultivating the ging and breathing?
I think that's probably unnecessary, being that you have such gold from other sources to fill your cup already.
:D
Nah, you got me all wrong, especially on the mental aspect of it, that's for dammn sure. I didn't drink any cool aid. I don't need a reason to believe anyone.
I wasn't regurgitating anything. If I was, it was simply because I am a human on this earth and have heard other humans open their mouths full of shiite, good or bad, to tell me his regurgitation. I SPECULATED. Read everyone of those speculations again if you didn't understand. Again, you are going back to being subjective, (not your whole post mind you). I never said anything about anyone being jealous. You subjectively read into whatever I objectively said.
LOOK PLEASE, I don't care if he made all of it up while sitting on the shiitter...Can't you get that?
Breaking a broken heart is hard to do bro. I KNOW that BAK MEI is a fairy-tale. I KNOW that CLC was a man who ate, slept, shiit, ****sed, farked, laughed, etc...I know that Wai was, and his father was, and the monk was, and that I am, and that you are, and that everyone on this whole entire planet, past, present, and future, IS.
I agree with everything in your 6th paragraph except the last sentence. IT DOES PROVE SOMETHING. It proves that sitting here talking shiit about people no one here knows, and noone who they know knows, is NOTHING. It also proves, that in the end of it all, that is all that matters. Who farked who isn't. We just think it is simply because society and history tells us that it should be that way.
NO, I DONT BELIEVE WHAT HE TOLD ME...FARK! I don't know him, for the 10th time. hehehe! You like it? :D The only loop that I am caught in is trying to explain to you my perspective, which obviously you could care less about. Well that, and death and taxes.
So people know? Okay, good we are getting somewhere kind of. WHO? Who has went to his door (Coughs, bullshiite...), Who knows his objectives? You can post that for the other readers... AGAIN, in case you didn't read my first post and are simply wanting to put out your objectives... I DON'T CARE ABOUT CHINESE KUNG FU MEN PLAYING MAH JONG AND THEIR OBJECTIVES! You don't know anyone who knows where he comes from. Was it Huizhou's thereabouts? Nice place, I have been there. Had noodles at a place near CLCs. Shiite noodles but. Seriously who do you know that knows. Which won't matter, because AGAIN, everyone can say they know...Proves nothing.
Anything on all over the internet, (You mean YOUTUBE and a few sites out of billions), save maybe one form done, he is in his late 70s doing it...Come on! You can do better than that.
NO, his demonstrations haven't been discussed ad nausium. You just say, looks like mosquitoe killing. But you never say that about Wing Chun. People just say that his stances are bad and his hands are too fast. Nothing else. Because noone else talking about it trains it. It's pretty simple. Which by the way, I don't care how good or bad he does it.
AND no, I don't want a lesson from you. Do you want one from me? If I did anyways, I would just ask in person next time I was around. I'm sure we would both learn something cool and it would be a good time. I don't know if there is any good Dim Sum around where you guys train, but we could find something good to eat afterwards anyways...Maybe play Mahjong even.:D
I was simply asking anyone to discuss this rather than discussing who shiite in whos mouth. I was simply asking why in the world he would have all of that knowledge and know all of those forms, the same as the HK Bak Mei forms, by heart. That's all. Nothing else. Yes, I would like to talk about internal because it is my passion, and I know from training all of these different kinds of methods over the years, that A PERSON just can't get the same kind of internal from doing Meng Fu Chut Lum, slowly. It just doesn't happen...
Anyways man, I think you have me badly mistaken. I am all about results. I don't care about lineage wars and fairy tales, at all. I have traveled the world over training various styles. I have probably actually lost life rather than gained it from training martial arts. Still, I know little.
Sifu Garry is much better at Kung Fu than I am, so I listen to him and take his advice. There are many people better than I am, and I listen to them and take their advice. I am all about becoming better. I gain from training the internal methods, whether they are from Yau Kung Mun, CLC's Bak Mei, or Wai's White Tiger, or some dumb fark down the street.
THERE IS NOTHING NEW UNDER THE SUN AND THERE NEVER WILL BE...That is just how it is.
Let's contribute to saving cyberspace if anyone here wants to answer my question...
Cheers,
Tao
http://www.youtube.com/user/SifuWu?a...59/wnW7LAdeyjM
Who is demoing this Sup Ji?. it's like identical to what I'm training but dude is so much better than me at coiling...@ like the 49 second mark is where I'm up to...so cool to find cross country video of a master demoing something I'm just getting into like only under a month of training.:)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s0BYO...eature=related
Who did JC train with and is there good video online of jackie demoing the White Eyebrow?.
Diego,
If you don't mind me asking, who do you train with? Sifu Wu, if I'm not mistaken is guandong PM, but I could be wrong. One of the older lines of CLC Pak Mei.
I like the force generated in his forms. His three strikes are awesome, all with power.
Thank you in advance,
Buby