What exactly is the purpose of tucking the butt in during horse stance? Do all styles use it?
After years of squatting, sticking the butt out is a much stronger position to me.
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What exactly is the purpose of tucking the butt in during horse stance? Do all styles use it?
After years of squatting, sticking the butt out is a much stronger position to me.
ur supposed to keep a neutral spine. command to tuck in the butt is a que to correct bad posture, just like the arch command in squattingQuote:
Originally Posted by JamesC
horse stance training is a preparatory exercise for squatting in kung fu, the back stays the same in both
I am not qualified to answer anything of that nature but here is a article from someone that may be?
http://www.chiarts.com/the-myth-of-t...inmenu-16.html
Makes me consider others posts of Allen and his students being ram rod straight, stiff, etc. Perhaps there was reason they did this? Just a consideration.
I agree, I've met people with pretty decent posture start the IMA's with an unqualified teacher, and then screw up their posture big time by tucking their butt and overly collapsing their chest. In fact when I have push hands with people who do that BS, I find it easier to take their center.Quote:
Originally Posted by bawang
It is a part of traditional iron body training. Most practitioners that I see today seem too lazy to learn it. It is something that should be taught from the first day of training.
Depends on the squatting style. Low bar you have to lean upper body forward to keep weight over the midfoot. And, you stick butt back to engage the glutes and use the stretch reflex of your hamstrings to get out of the hole.Quote:
Originally Posted by bawang
I'm just curious why some schools teach a horse stance with the butt out and some teach it with it in. Butt out will force you to be leaned over more, but allow you to really use the hamstrings.
What are the advantages to gaining an extra couple inches in a more erect spinal posture?
butt out is the traditional position and is to prepare for weight lifting, butt in is common for standing meditation. butt in helps beginners find the abdominal pressure sensation, pushing their belly down instead of outQuote:
Originally Posted by JamesC
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Originally Posted by JamesC
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Originally Posted by bawang
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Originally Posted by JamesC
It's all about propioception of proper body mechanics and dynamics to allow effective delivery of waist, hip, and core power when fighting.Quote:
Originally Posted by bawang
Butt out is stronger for lifting. For fighting you want functional strength and body mechanics to facilitate mobility, agility and hitting hard.
Do boxers stick their butts out?
To say that to be generally stronger isn't functional is funny.
Thanks bawang, that makes sense.
Nothing against being generally stronger. Just that squats direct force upwards. Hitting people benefits from force going forward and down.Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesC
Strong legs let you apply more sinking force because you can drop faster and still recover. Butt in lets you use more core rotation to power your strikes.
Combine fast drop and explosive core rotation into the punches, and you have functional power for damaging the other guy.
squatting is an essential fundamental skill in kung fu.Quote:
Originally Posted by -N-
we werent talking about fighting. we talking about horse stance, for trainingQuote:
Originally Posted by -N-
for fighintg you switch body position as needed. if ur hunched wit tucked butt a hard clinch can fold u and ur hips are forward so easier to take down
You train kung fu horse stance not for fighting???Quote:
Originally Posted by bawang
Horse stance is transitional step for delivering power when you hit people. We tell beginners don't lean over with butt sticking out. They do this because their legs are weak and they don't want to bend their legs properly.
Part of the hitting power comes from core rotation. Leaned over and butt out creates higher polar moment of inertia, and makes the core rotation too slow.
Are you talking about static horse stance training? I thought you don't like southern Chinese. Why you follow southern kung fu method?
If you are clinched you change.
did u come out of time machine lolQuote:
Originally Posted by -N-
I used to use the horse stance all the time when I sparred. TKD/karate. Of course you may prefer to call it a side stance or variation of same.Quote:
Originally Posted by bawang
Everyone trains upper body stuff out of horse in the traditional MA's. Especially at first but even seniors worked it. We were also big on using sanchin dachi to practice upper body techniques. I prefer that to horse when doing so. It screws you in place better. I suspect you southern artists have a similar stance. I suppose one could fight out of it but I myself would not be able to. I'll call it lack of skill in being able to do so.
I know what you mean bawang. Thanks.
This guy your cousin?Quote:
Originally Posted by bawang
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Nvdh0FMzr0
No problem. I know what you mean.
Check out Mayweather dropping jabs to the body. He uses horse stance in a real fight better than most kung fu people.Quote:
Originally Posted by boxerbilly
Greetings,
Butt Stick Out:
- As -N- pointed out, it can be an indicator of weak legs. And while it may offer the practitioner that temporary benefit, dependance usually results in higher, weaker, stances over time.
- Can be a indicator of tight psoas muscles. The interesting thing is the same posture can reflect either very strong psoas muscles or very weak psoas muscles.
Butt Tuck In:
- Purpose to decompress the spine and activate the abdominal wall.
mickey