WSL Ving Tsun - Sifu Cliff Au Yeung - Blindfold Gor Sau Training

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Originally Posted by guy b.

Sorry mate, someone who doubts the whole argument and the facts it is based upon is in fact demanding when they ask for evidence. Unfortunately you are in no position to demand anything, given that you are only speculating from a position of fear and complete uncertainty.

It doesn't matter at all whether you believe that bare fist sparring is possible. The purpose of discussing it is not to convince you, believe it or not.

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I see it is demanding when some one asks for evidence of a claim. Interesting perspective.

You keep playing the little kid you are scared routine. I am saying that it is just plain stupid to spar if you are really sparring which I suspect you are not without protective gear whether mouth piece or cup or gloves. It is stupid because those things prevent incidental damage that will only limit our ability to keep sparring and training.

I have no doubt bare fist sparring is possible just that I know it is pointless and silly to do it. I have sparred and been around sparring including pros and have helped train boxers so I know what goes into good sparring. I also know what would happen if the gloves would come off.

I think this whole my wing chun won't work with gloves thing is an out you give yourselves to not get in and spar with guys who really let me repeat really do spar and of course wear gloves. Spar with a boxer? Sorry my wing chun will not work in the ring with gloves to even 4 ounce gloves. Spar with mma guys or mt guys? Sorry but they wear gloves. Yes yes there is a reason the guys who wear gloves and spar get really really good and the bare knuckle guys for which there is no evidence of and do not even ask for it keep to themselves and are so deadly they can only talk about it.

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Originally Posted by tc101

I am saying that it is just plain stupid to spar if you are really sparring which I suspect you are not without protective gear whether mouth piece or cup or gloves. It is stupid because those things prevent incidental damage that will only limit our ability to keep sparring and training.

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Just gloves. You have no idea if it is stupid or not because you haven't tried it. You presume it is stupid because you presume it involves unacceptable damage, i.e. you avoid doing it out of fear of that presumed damage.

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I have no doubt bare fist sparring is possible just that I know it is pointless and silly to do it.

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You don't know anything if you haven't tried it

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I have sparred and been around sparring including pros and have helped train boxers so I know what goes into good sparring.

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Lol, haven't we all?

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I also know what would happen if the gloves would come off.

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You don't know anything because you haven't tried doing it. You presume to know, i.e. you guess

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I think this whole my wing chun won't work with gloves thing is an out you give yourselves to not get in and spar with guys who really let me repeat really do spar and of course wear gloves.

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You mustn't be reading what is posted, lol

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Yes yes there is a reason the guys who wear gloves and spar get really really good

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People that spar with gloves on get better at sparring wearing gloves. No gloves is not the same as gloves. See the excellent post by Graham H for examples of how it differs wrt wing chun

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the bare knuckle guys for which there is no evidence of and do not even ask for it keep to themselves and are so deadly they can only talk about it.

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Eh?

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Originally Posted by WC1277

You couldn't be more wrong. Maybe not with a "one-armed system".

There's long bridge, short bridge, hooks, uppercuts, arm breaks, inside-facing long bridge chops, punches of all vertical levels, palms of all vertical levels, chops of all vertical levels, knee strikes, phoenix eye, ginger fist, tiger claw, and more...

I don't know how much more I can stress that WC can be applied ANY WAY with regards to fighting. It's all about "balanced movement" my friend from chum kiu and your long bridge motions coming from biu gee.

In regards to the hook, even our friend Matt pulled off some decent hooks and this was before he really started to develop his WC

http://youtu.be/s5ey4JLuhQ8

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Funny you have everything but vt " one armed system " of elbow striking concepts. ; )

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Originally Posted by guy b.

Just gloves. You have no idea if it is stupid or not because you haven't tried it. You presume it is stupid because you presume it involves unacceptable damage, i.e. you avoid doing it out of fear of that presumed damage.

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So you are wearing headgear like with a face cage, mouth piece and so forth and then just foregoing the gloves?

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You don't know anything if you haven't tried it

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Sparring is a skill building activity and there are certain principles of that skill building that have been proved true. It is sort of like with strength training the human body develops in certain ways and there are certain principles associated with this. When you know how that process works you do not need to try every exercise or way of strength training to know if it will work if it is valid and so forth. Same with sparring.

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People that spar with gloves on get better at sparring wearing gloves. No gloves is not the same as gloves. See the excellent post by Graham H for examples of how it differs wrt wing chun

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No no no people who spar get better at sparring and develop better fighting skills. People wear protective gear to permit them to spar without getting incidental injuries and so permit them to spar more often. I understand that large gloves can make some things difficult or impossible to do but small 4 oz gloves should not make much of a difference.

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Originally Posted by tc101

So you are wearing headgear like with a face cage, mouth piece and so forth and then just foregoing the gloves?

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I have tried all kinds of protective gear including gloves. Gloves are the most damaging to wing chun ability.

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Sparring is a skill building activity and there are certain principles of that skill building that have been proved true. It is sort of like with strength training the human body develops in certain ways and there are certain principles associated with this. When you know how that process works you do not need to try every exercise or way of strength training to know if it will work if it is valid and so forth. Same with sparring.

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Skills built during sparring with gloves have absolutely zero bearing on your knowledge of the likely damage sustained (and "pointlessness" involved) in sparring without gloves. Your arguments do not follow logically from each other. It is like you are typing random responses.

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No no no

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Stutter still a problem?

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people who spar get better at sparring and develop better fighting skills. People wear protective gear to permit them to spar without getting incidental injuries and so permit them to spar more often. I understand that large gloves can make some things difficult or impossible to do but small 4 oz gloves should not make much of a difference.

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All gloves make a difference. Read the post by Graham H for specifics. Smaller gloves are better than large gloves. No gloves are best.