Hey guys I just read an article, saying that the monks in the shaolin temple aren't real.
I was wondering if someone can clear that out?
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Hey guys I just read an article, saying that the monks in the shaolin temple aren't real.
I was wondering if someone can clear that out?
You heard of communism right?
well if you did you would know that they destroy anything in thier path that isn't communist
really feel bad for the tibetians that are in exil from communist china
In area of shaolin temple in Song San, there is a Wushu school that are not monks and is government runned. Many foriegn ppl. who go there to train, train at this school. Then there is the temple, who have monks who practice buddhism and MA, and also monks who just train in MA, and not buddhism.
It is hard to tell, but the real shaolin monks practice buddhism.
China is just a communist gov't in name, it is hardly communist like former Soviet Union. There is no "banning" of any religious belief, except for Fan Lun, which is more like a cult, and also claiming Tibet as its own.
The Shaolin Masters left the Shaolin Monastary
between 1928-1933. What they left was only fragments of knowledge and Contemporary Wushu practioners have resided there since.
Being a Monk does not make your kungfu, Shaolin kungfu. There may be monks there, but shaolin kungfu left with the masters.
That broad statemants about what people think is "communism" are very misleading. The form of Government China has is not communism, but an opressive police state with a powerful ruling class imposing their ideals on the people, thus ensuring their power.
True communism is potentially a wonderful thing, and according to Mark could only successfully take place in countries that are extremely technologically advanced. In fact I believe he picked Germany and the United States as the countries likely to successfully apply communism.
I am a socialist, and I am firmly against what the Chinese Government has done, and continues to do. But I also am harassed quite often by people preaching the "evils of communism" because of examples like China and the former Soviet Union.
But you are right in saying that the Chinese Government has interfered in everything, practically destroying their countries own history and heretige.
Namaste.
Fifty years ago while Hong Kong was under British Control, my grandfather could hang non-china flags outside his flower business' shop. If he still lived today, he would be forced to pull the flags out of sight or fear imprisonment.
Go to China and go on any internet service. Try to go to a site that stresses democracy. What do you see? 404, buddy. We may have filters here at our schools, but the Chinese Government has their internet providers filter out most of the things on the internet that oppose what they enforce.
If you are in China, your choice of profession is limited.
If this isn't communism, I don't know what is.
Underaged Drunken Monkey
I am not defying "Mark", but the U.S. wouldn't be changing their primary political parties any time soon.
Lets say I was a socialist trying to run for president. When you get over a certain ammount of votes, the government provides you with something like 10 million in funds and a promised position in the next election even if you lose. This percentage is 5 percent. That may seem miniscule, but its a lot.
And no matter what you say, a campaign won't win without some bad ass funds. I am not sure what the figures bush and gore used, but they are well into the 8-figures.
The only way communism would be successful is if its principles were slowly sewn in into our current parties and then democracy would be phased out over many years.
Underaged Drunken Monkey
The form of Government China has is not communism, but an opressive police state with a powerful ruling class imposing their ideals on the people, thus ensuring their power.
As an opponent of communism/socialism, I believe this is the inevitable result of a communist system.
Whether China is actually communist is another matter...
But a main beef that anti-communists have is that communism, through centralized economic planning, inevitably leads to an accumulation of power among the planners (i.e. the ruling class), who inevitably limit the freedoms of the citizens in an effort to ensure their continued power.
Communists have great difficulty reconciling the fact that this accumulation of power has happened in all communist countries.
In the real world, communism hasn't worked well. Since there aren't any successes to point to, communists typically assert that communism has never been properly implemented.
But I also am harassed quite often by people preaching the "evils of communism" because of examples like China and the former Soviet Union.
I believe that true communism will always result in an accumulation of power among centralized economic planners, leading to massive corruption, and economic instability for the people.
Communism is, IMO, based on a false premise that major rifts will inevitably form between classes in a capitalist system. This isn't necassarily the case. Capitalism has proven that wealth distribution can follow fairly evenly with upper class, upper-middle class, middle class, lower middle class, and lower class.
It isn't a struggle between the haves and the have nots. It is a distribution, with the majority being in the middle class, and whereby people can move between classes throughout their lifetimes and throught generations.
I'm not saying that pure capitalism is the proper alternative to pure communism. But I am saying that a capitalist system with democratic social controls produces a morally superior result than the system Marx envisioned.
The only way communism would be successful is if its principles were slowly sewn in into our current parties and then democracy would be phased out over many years.
IMO. communism will never fly in the United States, absent a major revolution and the abolishment of the US Constitution.
Some principles have been sewn into our society with mixed results. Welfare didn't work out so well, social security did. Both borrow on principles of communism.
So I think you're right in the broad sense, that we can adopt some principles that allieviate class divisions and poverty.
But I don't think we can gradually move to the elimination of private property, absent major chaos.
The US constitution is rooted in protecting individual freedoms, including property rights. Communism is rooted in eliminating class strife throgh the elimination of individual property rights. I don't think they are really compatible at all.
Whatever the name,political injustice has always the same results;misery,non respect for liberty and life in general.
As for these "shaolin kung-fu monks"Well... they may attract some tourisme.Circus is in town! :eek:
C'est la vie!
from what I was told by people who have been there:
The "shaolinsi" there is akin to learning Kung Fu sets; you can learn the "outside" and look good "dancing", you have to "prove" yourself before learning the "inner" parts, higher levels.
The "public" areas of the Mainland China Shaolin temples are the "outside" of the forms. Hired Monks, small skilled, paid fronts. In order to access the "real" Monks, Kung Fu, masters, warrior monks, one has to be admitted to the "inner" parts of the temple.
In short: who you know.
ShaolinMantis-I
I agree with ShaolinMantis, as i said b4 in my previous post, there is the outside wushu school runned by government for tourism and the real Temple which has buddhist monks, some which practice kungfu.
About China and communism, i won't get into that cause i am not talking about politics, but i would like to ask how many ppl. actually been to China or Shaolin?
Ok let me get this straight
They banned the Shaolin Temple because of communism. But why didn't they banned the Budhist temple?
During Mao Tse Tung rule and the Cultural Revoulution many things were banned including kungfu and destroyed, but after Deng Xiao Ping and the current leadership very few religious faiths, are banned except the one i mentioned b4.
Check your definitions of communism people. I was tempted to dust off the communist manifesto, and start placing some anti-capitalist propoganda up online, but I figured I had better wait for my shipment of ak-47's to arrive...
As I said, I do not agree with what is happening in China.
And Just so you know, Marx said the only way Communism was going to be able to be implimented was through revolution, preferrably non-violent, but by ANY means possible.
I am not asking any of you to vote socialist. Jesus, it wasnt a statement against America I made or any such nonsense. I was a Marine, I served America for eight years. I have earned the right to voice my political mind. weather you like communism or not, it is a valid political philosophy. If you want to go far bac enough Socrates said that the ONLY government system that would work is the City state ruled by a philosopher king.
You think America is free? I could site pages of things that should be entirely up to the individual that the government misleads citizens into thinking they have no choice on.
The idea here is to put aside your stereotypes and stop being so ethnocentric. Here we place the utmost value on individual human rights. In other parts of the world (Asia in perticular) the rights of individuals tend to be based more on how they fit into a society as a whole. Neither way is "better" or "correct" just different.
We tend to think and pass jugement on other places based on our own set of American morals and values.
What is happening in China and Tibet is an atrocity. No doubt about it something has to be done. The murder, rape and plunder of entire nations cannot be allowed by any means. You cannot blame a philosophy on corrupt officials, because we have them here as well.
In America we are just not as open about it.
"I am not a crook..."
"I did not have sex with that woman... s. Lewinski..."
We are so ready to pass judgement on the ideals of others when they are not in alighnment with our own.
Thankfully I do not care a bit about what others think of my politics.
:D I dont threaten anyones freedom, and I encourage people to do what they have to do to ensure what they feel is right.
I didnt intend for my statement to be a foundation for a political joust. I just want people to check their history and sociology texts. Make sure you know what you are throwing rocks at before you let go.
I was simply making an observation that the Chinese government is not in fact Marx's idea of a true communist state.
Love me or hate me for it. It makes no difference.
Shantih.
Chinese, Russian, and Cuban governments are NOT communists. Real communism is not what is beeing led in these countries.
I highly recommand researching on marxism which IS real communism and you will see that it is very very different from these goverments.
There was a story about when a US president met the Chinese premiere (I don't remember which administration), and the Chinese leader admitted that a farmer will stay up all night with a sick hog if it's his own, but he won't bother if the hog belongs to the commune. That's what's wrong with Marx's theories in a nutshell, in my opinion--a fundamental misreading of human nature.
I will say in Marx's defense that at the time he was writing, Capitalism WAS pretty horrible. But, he failed to foresee the rise of organized labor unions and elected officials passing laws mitigating the worst aspects of Capitalism---like child labor laws, workplace safety laws, minimum wage, anti-disrimination laws, Social Security, Welfare, Medicare/Medicaid, Unemployment benefits, maternity leave, Anti-trust/monopoly laws, product and food safety standards, etc...
Just as a side note it is illegal in China to follow the Dahlia Lama or to be Roman Catholic. In fact they normally jail and put into labor camps any Roman Catholics found practicing in China several priest have spent several years behind bars and in force labor camps. This is a proven fact, communism may not be evil but something is up with that government.-ED
"The grappling arts imply most fights end up on the ground...take them there. The striking arts imply all fights start standing up...keep them there. The mixed martial arts imply any fight can go anywhere...be ready and able to go everywhere."-a mix martial artist
Just something I heard...The shaolin monks touring the world and giving demonstrations everywhere would be in reality SOLDIERS!!!
Could that be true? :eek:
("Take the bullet from my hand grasshopper!") :D
C'est la vie!
Interestingly labor unions are socialist in nature. Many of the other programs you were referred to were not set into place untill the end of the depression. It should also be noted that capitalism is far from perfect. (I mentioned Socrates' idea so please dont think I am defending or opposing anything I am with the old dead Greek guy.)
Our richest 1% in America's financial resources vastly outweighes every other economic class' resources in the country combined! The class division is only getting wider, and it is because of what Ky-Fi mentioned about the farmer and his pig. Everyone is watching out for their own interests.
In a sociology class I had in college we did an "island expariment" similar I am sure to many such social science classes. We tried to set up a governing body for a group of castaways.
The professor noted that the expariment was part of a separite project she was working on, and the results were of all the classes she had assigned this "island expariment" nearly 100% of the time the resulting form of government was based in true communism.
I thought that was interesting...
Is that a forum on kung fu or political science?
The topic was "Are these guys pulling logs attached to their balls and praying standing on their heads for real?" :rolleyes:
C'est la vie!
In a way, Communist ideology exists in the pop culture of US of A. USS Enterprise, IMHO, is a reflection of such a community. Goods and sevices are exchanged freely on board of this marvellous ship. But then again it doesn't have the main stream support.
Communists in China came to power with a lot of luck and was perceived by the grass root level a lesser evil of the two "at the time". They got the blessing of mostly unedcated commoners. In reality though, they've done more harm than good. How could you ask a government which was composed of uneducated and uncultured officials to respect culture and traditions. It is like playing piano to a bull. This is why they fear any form , civil, martial, or spiritual, of education. If true be told they were and are no difference to scandalous thieves and robbers ( my grandfather termed it that way).
I always stress on a point that the strength of Chinese people is not some foriegn ideology and political might but the cultural integrity and community spirit. Being somewhat of a Taoist, I don't believe in centralization or one form of ideology is better than another. Good and evil is just two side of the same coin. Leave it be.
As for Shaolin temple and monks today, I tend to agree that they are Cirque du Shaolin.
"Beam me up, Scotty, Kurt out."
Mantis108
Contraria Sunt Complementa
[This message was edited by mantis108 on 12-29-00 at 06:41 PM.]
*boggle*
Thats what they tell the inquisitive to keep them interrested.
People still believe in the legend that Shaolin is the mother of all martial arts or had a great role to play in history of Chinese martial arts which is actually not true. It is fact that they did practice and study kung fu it is obvious in all the drawings and writings upon the walls within the temple.
However, In reality most of what we think of in terms of Shaolin is merely a fairy tale.
The truth is that Shaolin was a Zen Buddhist temple and that is pretty much where it ends. We hear of the story where Ta Mo left India and went to Shaolin (The Liang Dynasty,506-56A.D.)and taught the monks Buddhism and realized that they had no exercise for the physical body and taught them a series of exercises and that was the basis for Kung Fu.
China had organized warfare and fighting skills way before the Liang Dynasty, the time Ta Mo is said to have come to the temple.
During other periods in China, long before the Liang Dynasty, such as the Warring States Period, there were hundreds of wars. War tactics were continously being developed and improved. there is alo proof of Chinese Martial Arts existence before Shaolin during the Three Kingdoms Period (A.D.211).
Shaolin was definitely a famous Buddhist temple, if Ta Mo taught exercises there is still not proven or debatable. Before he arrived to Shaolin there were individuals practicing kung fu there already. Many of the monks at the temple were men arriving at the temple seeeking refuge. Many ofthem were criminals. Many of them had some kung fu technique already and Shaolin was a perfect place to work on further developments.
they lived simple lives and had plenty of time to practice their arts and exchange ideas. Because of this, it may have caused the kung fu at Shaolin to improve or become sophisticated but never was it considered to be a place to go and learn Kung Fu like a school.
Someone earlier on the forum stated some reasons why they were going to leave their school, one of the reasons was because the instructor stated that he only taught the staff because it was the only weapon used by the ancestors. there may be truth to this if it is a so-called Shaolin style.
The most famous weapon there was the staff. Any or most Chinese or other styles, one first learns the staff. It is the most fundamental, basic, inexpensive,but yet effective weapon of the time.
In reality, Shaolin was a Zen Buddhist Temple, It was considered a holy place and no weapons were allowed. As with most Churches, Courts, and Hospitals. There are several things that you do not handle or behaviors you do not do. Therefore the staff became an effetive weapon in Kung Fu that was practiced at Shaolin.
It is known that shaolin got its fame during the Tang Dynasty by helping the government put down a rebellion and for their assistance they were honored by the government.
After the Tang dynasty many civil wars, uprisings and rebellions broke out and it is not known whether Shaolin assisted in these are not. However, it was claimed by many people involved in these civil wars and uprisins that they claimed that they were from Shaolin.
During the Ming Dynasty, which is an important period for Chinese Martial Artists, A General by the name of Kwong wrote a book, after extensive research in kung fu, in order to better train his soldiers and there was no mention of Shaolin Kung Fu.
During the Qing/Ching Dynasty, Shaolin was neither popular or was it famous.However, during this period it began to be greatly known because of secret societies that connected themselves with the temple. By doing this, their sense of purpose, to overthrow the Manchus' was now something holy.
A lot of fiction novels helped to popularize Shaolin as a fighting system. They ahve implicated that there were many Temples. Fukien,GuangDong,Henan,Siquan and other other provines. There is evidence of only one and that is the one that is at Henan.
Sifus' of those time also carried out the propoganda of Shaolin by claiming to be a disciple there, when they acually were not. Because it was such a legend, they could increase their enrollment and popularize their style. they needed to make a living and didn't care about misconception. Similiar to what many people do today.
Can anyone relly define what hte Shaolin Kung Fu System is? What most people considers to be Shaoln is the Long Fist System (ChangQuan). Actually there many styles of the Long Fist System, one of these is Jia Men , which is actually from the Chinese Muslims.
"The key is to begin at the beginning;high level short cuts can only lead to dead end."
"If You can't be honest nothing can happen."
That's strange. Wasn't there a movie, "Shaolin Temple" filmed at the Shaolin Temple? There have also been numerous documentaries about the martial arts on TLC showing Shaolin monks demonstrating their skills at Shaolin Temple. There is also a real-life and well-documented Shaolin Temple monk that immigrated to the US and is teaching in NY. He and his students demonstrated in that "Blade" movie special a couple of years ago on TV.
You believe everything you see on TV?
true imaloser,
but I think you are confusing the physical site of Shaolin with the art of Shaolin kungfu. Just because the physical temple structure survives to this day, doesn't mean that the people that have recently repopulated it are "genuine". Look up some interviews with Jet Li and the filmakers who filmed "Shaolin Temple" in the 80's, when they filmed the temple and surrounding area were uninhabited except for a dozen or so caretakers, and had been uninhabited since the '30's. There was nothing being practiced there, for all intents and purposes the temple was "dead". As for the people that have moved back in during the '80's and 90's, whether or not they preserve the authenticity of their predecessors is up for debate, and will likely never be answered.
"You should never, never doubt what no one is sure about."
--Willie Wonka
The media via TV,Film,Comics and other fictions has greatly distorted the truth not only behind Shaolin, but in Chinese Kung Fu in general.
This is why so many people give traditional Chinese Kung Fu a bad rep.
A lot of what most people think is Chinese Kung Fu isn't. The whole internal and external thing is out of proportion as well, that was started by a Chinese writer long ago, inquiring and writing about Chinese Kung Fu and trying to categorize it.
All styles of Chinese Kung Fu have elements of hard and soft. Their approach to these elements are somewhat different however. Some begin the student out teaching them the hard elements and later in the advanced level, they are taught the soft, depending on the physical requirements of the style. Others teach their students soft elements from the beginning and then as they advnace the harder ones.
The misconception of "southern fists and northern legs" is another misconception. All proproganded by media and the kung fu craze.
For the most part, if things seem to be fascinating and magical, you can bet your dollar that most of the time it isn't.
"The key is to begin at the beginning;high level short cuts can only lead to dead end."
"If You can't be honest nothing can happen."
Did you see it in Crouching Tiger? That place is beautifull. I say it kicks shaolin's ass hands down.
If your not bleeding, your not having enough fun.
To put it nicely, IMHO, I think KickMantis's argument is pretty much a standard "scholar" perspective in keeping with "Party Line". I appologize to you, KickMantis, in advance. I really could not find any other way to put.
In the year 4001, you will find "records" and "Documented material" from Government archives that Kung Fu never existed. It's a mythical cult!
It is true that WuShu (martial SKILL) existed in China way before Bordhidharma's time but it is him who elevated it to a higher plateau - one that is spiritual not just technical. Creative conditioning of the body, mind and spirit through hard work and chaos give you the merits. That's Kung Fu the core concept. You become a better person not a better killing machine. Shaolin and Bordhidharma are important in Kung Fu because they have inspired many to systematically transmitt their arts. WuShu today has already developed into a martial sport. It's sole purpose is to please the higher power be it the Government or paying customer, and to satisfy the Alpha Male Complex.
If WuShu perspective is in vogue then by all means follow it. I know my path is Kung Fu and I would take a stance (pun intended) against the WuShu hype even if it means I am going against popular believe.
Namasté
Mantis108
Contraria Sunt Complementa
Mantis108,
You said "It is him (Ta Mo) who elevated it (Kung Fu) to a higher plateau, one that is spiritual not just technical."
There is no proof of this. The only proof is from a legend that says Ta Mo brought Zen Buddhism from India to Shaoilin and that he meditated there for approximately 8-9 years or so and introduced breathing exercises to the monks for their physical health. Nothing about a fighting, martial or war like art. This may well have been adopted in the regime of the kung fu that was practiced at the temple from those that sought refuge there.
There is nothing spiritual about Kung Fu per se. Buddhism and Kung Fu are two very different things
Being spiritual doesnt make your kung fu anymore or less practical than the price of tea in China.
What it may do, if you are serious about your spiritualism or religion is make you a more person of good values and morals. This makes the Kung Fu person a good Kung Fu person. And in ancient times they would use their art for the preservation of life, liberty and the protection of their family,friends and communities instead of robbery and stealing.
Thats what has all these people off the wall these days now.Thinking there is something mystical and mysterious about kung fu. There isn't. Kung Fu is hard work and when one masters working hard at their kung fu then they become proficient in it. There are no real secrets. no real magic, just magical tricks that attract the naive, unlearned and ignorant.
"The key is to begin at the beginning;high level short cuts can only lead to dead end."
"If You can't be honest nothing can happen."
Can't resist an easy way out... :)
In God We Trust - this is printed on the US dollar bills. Do we have to prove that God exists before we acknowlegde the value of this piece of green paper? Not everyone has to be Christian to use it as long as he or she has faith (not the religious faith) in the system. This faith is an edvience of spirtuality, not to confuse with religion believes, that everyone has. A Christian would perhaps appreciate the currency more so than a non Christian because of the spiritual implication, yet a non Christian also enjoys the value just the same. There are evidences of Bodhidharma's existence such as the cave which he meditated in, 18 Lohan routine, etc... What is the benefit of discarding their existance? I drawn such a parallel in response to the last part of your post.
There are a few things to consider before discarding Bodhidharma's influence in Kung Fu.
1) Although Bodhidharma is consider the first patriarch of Ch'an (later became Zen Buddhism in Japan) which has it's root in Mahayana Buddhism. His school was mostly likely to be the Dhyana School which uses meditation as a tool for enlightment. Meditation is beneficial to martial arts.
2) It is highly likely that early forms of Buddhism didn't shed all of its Hindu roots. So Dhyana might have elements of Yoga, which is another Hindu tradition. Yoga can be a great "cross training".
3) 18 Lohan routine is very reminiscent of Yoga routine.
4) In Okinawan Goju Ryu Karate, a Kung Fu influenced martial art, there is a strengthing exercise that is a variation of the Sun Salution (Yoga routine).
There are many signs as such that we can't ignore and discard spirituality (for lack of a better word) enhance the experience of Kung Fu practice. The great happiness (Samadhi) - the "Ah, I got it." - is not an mystical alien feeling to many practitioners. I agreed that is no secrets in Kung Fu just hard work. Bodhidharma is a paradox in which a preacher of peace practiced the art of war. It is this paradox that boarden the horizon for martial arts or military arts practitioner. Otherwise, the demographic would just be composed of soliders alone.
Mantis108
Contraria Sunt Complementa
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In my opinion and observations thus far, the only purpose that spirituality has played in the martial arts is by giving its' practioners a sense of purpose or specfically a "Holy" purpose.
Zen Buddhism, Taoism, Confucianism and the like... were all a great influence in the martial artist because of the times. These were the major religions in China at the time. If martial arts was developed or prevalent in the US, Kung Fu might be a little different, with a more western or White Protestant type logic to it. If it was developed among natives, it would have had more of a naturalistic or anismistic type of philosophy.
Meditation is done in many religions in different ways to achieve the same end, As the goal of all religions, spiritualities, philosophies and thoughts. It does not improve the Kung Fu, it improves the individual that practices it. There have been devout excellent martial artists with unending legends of their skills and devout devotion to mankind, just as their are legends of excellent martial artists that have killed, robbed, raped and terrorized people.
"The key is to begin at the beginning;high level short cuts can only lead to dead end."
"If You can't be honest nothing can happen."
Anyone read the article in this month's issue of Inside Kung Fu on the Shaolin Temple?
It's titled China's Temple of Doom.
It's written by Brian Gray all I'm saying is if what he wrote is true the Shaolin Temple is in disarray. Just like anything else when it come's down to money chance's are that greed will get the better part of you.
PEACE
RAYNYSC
Though it seems to be messy, my friend (Xu Jian Lou) a chairmen of the association there confirms that the abbott is attempting to remove the marketing calamity and make it more peaceful as in the past.
However, given Yong Xin's background he may not be the most trustworthy. Being more into business than anything.
He will be travelling to the US this year with the Abbott of the White Horse Temple and my friend may be more will come of it then.
I guess I will find out more during the Shaolin Wushu Festival in September this year. Til then the commentary is neutral on the matter
Regards
Shi Chan Long
The Abbot and the Shaolin Temple is a very
interesting subject.
The Abbot is the CEO of the Shaolin Temple Inc.
He could do what ever he wants to do.
He does not have to do what you want him to do
or what I want him to do.
He does his thing not our thing.
He definitely has at his disposal 2 million
tourists a year.
That is the question?
Should the Shaolin Temple be religious or
should the Shaolin Temple be Kung Fu.
What is what and which is which is very interesting.
We are observing history in action.
We cannot be participants.
We can only watch as the Shaolin Temple is being transformed into something that the Abbot want's.
The Shaolin Temple is his not mine not yours.
CJ Max
i am working in Korea now. And i will have a long vacation. I am planning to travel to China. Do you guys know any real shaolin temple in China?
well uh the real one is at Henan and is the real temple. but if you are referring to the original curriculum and buddhist order with out the modern wushu and the amusement park theatrics, well i cant help ya there,,,,,try hiking into the distant mountains and seeing if you can find the secret temple that has remained untouched for a thousand years ;) i suggest that you go to the temple in Henen and check it out,,wish i could. what i have heard from first hand accounts is that the old shaolin ways are pretty much dead and that now the temple is a big tourist attraction designed to get the american currency flowing through it.
you are from korea? do you take the hwarangdo system? lets chat.
Many repsects, willow sword
Whatever you think i am or want me to be,,, i am.
oh and,,,Jesus loves you, everyone else thinks you are an a$.