Kung Fu (Hung) Concepts Basic Entries, Grabs & Misc

Agree!

1) Dodge - too conservative, your opponent will punch you again.
2) Intercept - more aggressive but not aggressive enough.
3) Catch/wrap - the most aggressive approach, also the most difficult to achieve, but the reward is great. You can take your opponent's punching ability away and force him to play your favor grappling game (if you are a grappler).

I also agree that if you are in your opponent's

- side door, 2 on 1 is much easier and safer approach. You can use your opponent's leading arm to jam his back arm.
- front door, separate hands (your right arm wraps on your opponent's left arm, and your left arm wraps on his right arm) may be better. You can use both hands to control both of his arms.

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Originally Posted by Subitai

-It always works better this way, as opposed to trying it immediately right at the very start of the fight perhaps on the very 1st punch. No not a good idea.

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The 1st punch usually is not a committed punch. It's easy to catch the thin air and fall into your opponent's trap. One of my favor set ups is to throw a fake punch, when my opponent blocks it, I pull my punch back, and punch him again right at the same spot "after" his blocking arm is passed.

Traditional Drills 2

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GleM...ature=youtu.be

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S-B5BTcJy9o

Subitai,

Some really great to outstanding ideas/concepts in those videos.

I am sure many here know some or even all of them but I am also sure some do not. Or had been taught it but could not get it they way explained them at the time. Perhaps by watching and listening to you, they get a "a'ha" moment and it all falls into place.

Thanks for taking the time to make this for people interested.

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Originally Posted by boxerbilly

Subitai,

Some really great to outstanding ideas/concepts in those videos.

I am sure many here know some or even all of them but I am also sure some do not. Or had been taught it but could not get it they way explained them at the time. Perhaps by watching and listening to you, they get a "a'ha" moment and it all falls into place.

Thanks for taking the time to make this for people interested.

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Thanks Dude! :)

Subitai,

You have shown good materials. If there is free fight training video clip, please show it too. That will help to prevent misunderstanding, and tell us you gentlemen's fighting method in real fight.



Regards,

KC
Hong Kong

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Originally Posted by SteveLau

Subitai,

You have shown good materials. If there is free fight training video clip, please show it too. That will help to prevent misunderstanding, and tell us you gentlemen's fighting method in real fight.



Regards,

KC
Hong Kong

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KC,

I don't try to hide my background if that's what you're implying, for example here: http://cykwoon.freewebspace.com/about.html

As for videos unfortunately most of them are from 20yrs ago, you can watch them, for example most people have seen this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PO_b5lP6Blo

But I'm a very different fighter now then I was back then. I'm more mature and not so hasty. I would venture to guess that most people should be much improved when they compare themselves VS how they were 20yrs into their youth. I know I'm allot better than I was back then.

Currently, I try to touch hands with anyone who wants to but I'm not interested in making enemies. Life is too short for that IMO.

That being said, as for kung fu age I'm still fairly young and strong with no major injuries...so when I teach seminars I'm always ready to throw down on some A-hole who wants to challenge me. I have to be ready for that still, because I'm not some famous old Chinese teacher who won't get challenged.

What I'm trying to do is show to people how to use some traditional methods in a more modern format. Most of the things I've shown, I can pull off on people if I can set them up properly. Believe me, there's allot of methods or Concepts that I also learned in Hung Style that I think are out- dated or unusable in a fight. I tend to concentrate on what I know has worked for me and if not...I often tell my students which ones I don't like.

"O"

You're doing great stuff, Subitai! Keep up the good work.

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Originally Posted by Subitai

Believe me, there's allot of methods or Concepts that I also learned in Hung Style that I think are out- dated or unusable in a fight. I tend to concentrate on what I know has worked for me and if not...I often tell my students which ones I don't like.

"O"

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what is the hung kuen fighting stance

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Originally Posted by bawang

what is the hung kuen fighting stance

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I personally don't think there is one. You just have to be in the moment, stand natural, put your hands up and be ready is what I say...but nothing specific.

*** Other guys will disagree with me on this but I think kung fu in general works best when you counter your opponent. That is specifically, if you can get the other guy to give you energy then it works so much better.

That isn't to say that you can't attack with KF, sure you can. ( you can also attack to get a response ) I realize that allot people prefer "Attack is the best defense" method and some styles are more geared up for that. I'm just telling you my own preference.


But since you asked, I think the people out there that have a fantasy version of what KF should look like in a fight will probably vote for someone standing LOW in a horse stance. Perhaps with the Kiu Sao extended or mabe the classic Wong Fei Hung Pose ala "Asking hand".

But IMO, there's no reason to display your stance of readiness or what you do to the other person.

It's nice to take photos like this ( http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j1...HSF%20pose.jpg ) for a shoot but I'd never stand like that for a fight...it would just waste energy.

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Originally Posted by Subitai

I personally don't think there is one.

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with all these videos of you demonstrating your knowledge of hung gar fighting have you ever actually tried finding out hung gar fighting stance

Modified high horse stance, on a 45 degree angle.

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Originally Posted by Subitai

I personally don't think there is one. You just have to be in the moment, stand natural, put your hands up and be ready is what I say...but nothing specific.

*** Other guys will disagree with me on this but I think kung fu in general works best when you counter your opponent. That is specifically, if you can get the other guy to give you energy then it works so much better.

That isn't to say that you can't attack with KF, sure you can. ( you can also attack to get a response ) I realize that allot people prefer "Attack is the best defense" method and some styles are more geared up for that. I'm just telling you my own preference.


But since you asked, I think the people out there that have a fantasy version of what KF should look like in a fight will probably vote for someone standing LOW in a horse stance. Perhaps with the Kiu Sao extended or mabe the classic Wong Fei Hung Pose ala "Asking hand".

But IMO, there's no reason to display your stance of readiness or what you do to the other person.

It's nice to take photos like this ( http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j1...HSF%20pose.jpg ) for a shoot but I'd never stand like that for a fight...it would just waste energy.

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This was a very good post.

So, watch how close it gets. I know you guys know this. Yet, I think many of us forget this or train ourselves out of this. We seek space. Away from but that is not often the case. In another thread Ed was showing examples. Clearly there needs to be space to demo or you might not see things. But it often is a hatbill away. I know you would never let that happen. IT HAPPENS.

This punch did not knock anyone out and then what happens could happen to anyone- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z0dqm957raU

Not many of us can defeat this- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=soGl0ugFB7Q

If you do get space. If you do have time. Then ones ways we do something may work very, very good. How many use find those ways in their arts for this close? How many spend enough time dealing with that ?

Grapplers do. They can work that close. A lot of your arts have grappling. But your strike if you prefer that. Can you work that that close. A WC guy may be able to use his sensitivity training. Every art probably has a way even if that distance is not what they spend most of their time on.

Now we are adults. WE avoid this crap and most of us have mastered not even being there. But the kids you teach. It will likely happen to them at least once in their lives. If they go looking for trouble or fun if they think like that, it will almost always look like that. Some times as close. Sometimes a little bit further away.
And look for cues. Sometimes guys step back because they feel smothered. The may need distance to hit. That step back may be the cue they be hitting you right after. Those kind of things.

edit- I am using the word "work" to mean they spend a lot of time in practice that close. Not to imply another art can not work there. To bring attention to what and where do you spend the bulk of your time. That may be where you find yourself all the time especially if you are teaching certain arts. Your students may find themselves at a different distance at kick off.

Also, I know there are people that get upset over range talk and that crap. Okay, for you there are really only 2 ranges. That which you can engage and that which you can not. Others may need segmentation orientation to that which you can do something in the position in relationship to Mr. Mean guy. I always find it funny when guys get angry about that. Look I can still punch you at kicking range. Yeah, because your arms are as long as my legs. I cant punch you though. I am in your punching range but you are not in mine.

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Originally Posted by Kellen Bassette

Modified high horse stance, on a 45 degree angle.

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what is it called

I want to veer this off one more time into so called "self defense" . Regardless your art. Fact is the vast majority of schools teach kids. Now, I don't care how any one runs the little kids programs. It is babysitting or getting the little guy to do anything active and make friends which seldom works in my opinion. Parents!
You have to make a buck. Why not? But the TEENS. This guys come wanting to learn to fight. Old people want self defense. I worry about the teens.

Now I posted examples of man this happens. This is more than likely. It is so common make it a focus. The other end of the spectrum is agreed upon fights. Teens have always and will always do this. IT HAPPENS. The streets have rules ! If you don't know those rules you may pay for that. And when we have rules , what is it again? A sport. A potentially dangerous one but TEENS are stupid. Have not tasted their mortality yet. You recall those strong feelings and emotions you had during that time ? Let me put it this way. How many men here, can still cry ? It gets harder and harder and only the most catastrophic of things will cause that. Heck, I've known old men that did not even cry when their wives of 50 years died. I know, after that long, I would not either. She drove me nuts! But, really it is because certain things chemically are no longer there in massive amounts.

Back to point, RULES, you bust them and you will find out fast and hard when his boys start beating the crap out of you that **** don't fly. Even then rules apply but they are nastier in what the crowd can do to you for breaking the rules. Where I live BOXING is predominate on certain streets. Now you can veer off it a little but man you do things you aint supposed to, you better be able to make it look like an accident. Now in white boy places, believe it or not you can get away with a lot more. The burbs. But there is still rules. Black boys places around here it will be boxing. Wrestling is allowed but people will break you up if it stays there to long and that's usually what happens. They stall on the ground. Where in White boy places it will likely go there. But you can kick , punch , elbow, pull hair. Unless the crowd starts yelling at you. Better to stop.

Puerto Rican places again what are the rules? Better know them. You elbow one of those black kids in his street on an agreed upon fight and the rest of the hood is descending on you my friend. In white boy places they generally separate you and maybe one really big kid will be in your face threating to stomp your head if you ever pull that **** again. You will probably get hit too. Better not hit him back. Then you get 1-2 more on you.Now do not just assume, you can ask what those rules are. If you are lucky they may say, box mother-!@#$%. But again, you can do some other stuff and it wont come down on you. Usually, you will get, "there aint no rules mother!@#$%. So you do something you ain;t supposed to and your got a gang beat down on your hands.

So, perhaps some will understand my preference for sport. Even when you think their are no rules there usually are rules. Can your art work inside of rules? Again, the kids, The teens. They show up to learn to fight. Might help to understand what is allowed where. What part of town might that be a bit different?
This is the group of students most likely to use the art in any way shape or form. If you know what the predominate style for street rules way is where you live, you can build around what they have to contend with. You can use your karate, kung fu or whatever else you do, but it has to be in the rules of that street. Where there are no rules. YES THERE IS ! And teens will always have a beef with another teen.