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Originally Posted by
RenDaHai
At the least we can say it hasn't changed since the painting of the mural of shaolin (because wugulun pai's xiao hong is the same in all but shenfa).
same as what? i see them nowadays doing it several different ways, all with the same small frame shenfa, but they seem to be moving free-form. each person seems to have their own way. and not only that, but i've seen some of them do completely different techniques added in that dont appear in others'.
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I was of the opinion that Li sou created Da hong quan, not xiao hong quan, and that the forms were not so closely related. That xiao hong was the older form.
you mean dahongquan as in laojia hongquan, created by li sou in late song/early yuan dynasty, much later than xiaohongquan as an amalgamation of styles from early song dynasty?
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As to the beginning meihua section...I am a little skeptical as to the Meihua men forms.... Meihua in early shaolin seems to be a completely different skill set,... I have some suspicion as to the origin of the current meihua forms. Need to investigate that further. I know we have some historical info, but it doesn't relate to the actual movements. I would like to see some more meihua forms....
well, the xiaomeihuaquan/ditangmeihuaquan is an abbreviated version of the original meihuaquan set. whereas the dameihuaquan was created fairly recently. i'm not sure how closely related all its weapon sets are to the early meihuaquan.
but the xiao/ditang meihuaquan has an opening sequence which is done in datongbiquan and others. it starts from the xubu following the gongbu danbian at the beginning datongbiquan, all the way up to the mabu one-two punch.
then the ending sequence of this meihua set is the opening sequence to laojia hongquan, which then flows into classic xiaohongquan.
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As to Taizu chang quan you will be pleased to know I am in contact with Liu Hui Zhen (liuzhenhai's son). If you remember we had some suspicions about his 'xiao tongbei' and its relationship to shaolin taizu quan and possibly Da Tong bei quan. He's out of town for the next month, but when hes back I should prepare some questions for him.
yes, particularly the lyrics for one of his xiaotongbiquan sets match up with the lyrics to the second road of taizu changquan, a supposedly lost form, as it is listed in the shaolin encyclopedia. maybe bring that up.
i havent seen other datongbiquan sets, but i've heard of there being more, and felt there naturally should be more to it. that question is probably also related to those mysterious xiaotongbiquan sets. they're all connected somehow....