Best Martial Art

[MA fanatic]

I keep hearing/reading people ask this same question. The
truth is, hardly any style prepares you for all situations.
I have studied several martial arts systems for the last 16 years.
Not one was complete. To defeat a man with empty hands one
must be skilled in: Striking, Throwing, Joint Manipulation and Strangulation & Choking (two are different). An artist must
also be skilled in: Kicking Range, Punching Range, Trapping and/or
Clinching Range, and Ground Fighting Ranges of combat. One must train realistically, not in a vacuum. Throwing techniques in the air for years is like learning to swim in the shower. There are few arts which address all these fighting attributes and fight ranges. In most cases, one has to seek supplemental training from professionals skilled in other areas of combat (be it seeing a Brazilian Jiujitsu stylist for ground fighting, Kung Fu stylist for stand up, Muay Thai kickboxer for effiency/power kicking and conditioning, etc. etc.). To be killed martial artists we must know what we don't know. Not all karate styles are "bad." Some Karateka can give a Kung Fu fighter a run for his money. I have seen it happen time and time again.
One is responsible for his or her own training. If an instructor says to his/her that his system is all one needs, the potential student should be carefull. There are complete systems out there, but most don't come even close.

MA fanatic

[Budokan]

Tae bo is a complete system.

Complete bull$hit, but complete.

[chen zhen]

"To be killed martial artists we must know what we do'nt know"
sorry. just had to quote it.

[shaolinboxer]

I believe that the black and white is the rare and complete cookie style.

[MA fanatic]

Good point Chen. I think many martial artists forget what they don't know, and fall prey to people who can exploit these weakness.

MA fanatic

[chen zhen]

Uhh.. MA fanatic, you do know that I quoted a typing mistake in your topic, right?!
(s)killed

[MA fanatic]

Dude, how could I not figure it out. I responded sarcastically.
Thanks for your help. lol

MA fanatic

[Ish]

MA Fanatic in your origional post you say "I have studied several martial arts systems for the last 16 years. Not one was complete" Mabe the trouble is that in your 16 years of mixed training you will not of completed any of the styles you were doing. (This is just a gues so correct me if im wrong) This could mean that the styles were complete and you just didn't learn everything you could have. I personaly believe that if you stick with a style (if you have a good teacher) you will learn how to defend yourself against anything. At the end of the day people only have 2 amrs and 2 legs so we are all limited in the way that we can fight.

[MA fanatic]

Ish: I have posted my martial arts background on another thread. Ok here goes. I studied Kung Fu for 4 years (trained hard during that time, 6 days a week two hours a day). I was obsessed at that time. I started with Wing Chun. My instructor was more of a drill sergeant and also utilized a lot of Chin Na in hi training. There was another Chinese man teaching a style called Hung Gar. I trained with him on and off, but concentrated on Wing Tsun (chung). When my school relocated, I wanted to get a better understanding of kicking. I searched hard, and finally found another drill sergeant Korean guy. He was a 6th degree in TKD (five time Korean national champion), 5th dan in Hapkido (Korean art focusing on joint manipulations), 2nd dan in Kodokan Judo (his father was actually a coach for the Korean Olympic team in the Korean Udo college), and was a champion of Soul Korea in boxing. Funny thing, when I met this Korean master, he was about to enroll in a praying mantis school a few miles away. The guy gave only 6 black belts in his 12 years of teaching in the state. All black belts stuck wiht him for 12 years. I stayed with him for 7 years before he moved with his family out of state. I tested for black belt under him shortly before he moved. Later I just wondered from school to school trying to find good instruction. I trained from a Kyoshu jitsu guy for some time (I think it was close to a year) but finally found a school teaching Muay Thai (instructors under Chai Serisute), JKD (instructors under Dan Inosanto and Larry Hartsell), and Brazilian JJ (machodo). I trained at that school for over 3 years. Then the school merged with a gym too far for me to commute so I found Caique (he is a world Brazilian JJ champion and old teacher at the Gracie academy). So now I'm with him.

What I meant by no art being complete, is that no art gives you all dementions of fighting. My Wing Chun could easily be countered with strong Thai leg kicks and wrestling take downs. AS a matter of fact, I have seen many wing chun guys beaten by wrestlers (William Cheung was even taken to the ground by a wrestler). My TKD kicks (though extremely quick....and I had full contact sparring experience) would not stop a take down or a strong leg kick. The hapkido joint locks look great, but against a resisting oppoent, if you dont secure his body right, he will escape. I think all martial artists should cross train. This is only my opinion. But, I just dont believe that one art (usually created by one person) has the asnwers to all situations. I can become an expert TKD kicker, but on a day like today (its icy outside), I'm helpless. A Kung Fu master skilled in glamorous animal styles can be easily taken down to the ground and choked unconsious (I have seen this happen, actually have it on tape). A BJJ guy may be skilled on the ground, but against multiple apponents, he has to stand up. And, all fights go to the ground, so even an expert kick boxer can fall prey to take down and pummeled on the ground.

What style do you train in? I suggest, go on a journey to discovery. Step into a full contact ring once and see how your techniques fair against another style in full contact, no rules competition (there are many guys who would love to oblige just for experience). Don't let your teacher brainwash you into thinking that his style is invincible. It isn't. I have heard one guy tell me that his teacher would only fight to the death. That's bull ****. That is a copout and an excuse. It hurts to find out that an art you have been studying and teaching wont be able to stop a classic shoot take down or a simple combination from an accomplished boxer. I had my eyes opened. BTW, my views are shared by people like Bruce Lee, Dan Inosanto, Gichin Funakoshi, Rickson Gracie, and many other martial arts masters.

MA fanatic

[shaolinboxer]

The last time I read an interview with Dan Inosanto, he was studying yoga.

Learning to fight is very important, but I believe it has it's limits. Everyone loses. I think the Gracies proved that no matter how much experience you have, how much strength you have, how much heart you have, or how good your technical ability is you can still lose.

That is why I think it is is important to experience a high level of competition, and then move on. You need to know what it is like to fight full contact, but you need not fight full contact all of the time. We always hear of the great full contact fighters, but we don't hear of the thousands who are injured so severely they can no longer train or those who, under a string of perpetual losses, give up hope and quit.

Competition and full contact "testing" are valuable, but very high risk. Do it, know it, move on. (Unless you want to be a professional fighter of course.)

[Ish]

Im currently training in wing chun but i've only been doing it for a couple of years so i think it would be bad for me to crosstrain at the moment. I think i will continue with wing chun for at least a few more years before i think about trying any other styles. I know that at the moment i wouldn't do too well against some arts like more ground based styles. I do however believe that when i have trained for longer i should be able to effectively defend against any punch or kick and hopefully be able to finish a fight before the person gets a chance to take me to the ground

[Repulsive Monkey]

I hope I don't to sound too insulting but everything you've said in that long diatribe of yours actually weakens your defence somewhat. That long list of the few arts you've studied and the wonderful acolades that all your teachers have acquired a) showed as you say that you have no complete art; b) more so it seems that you haven't been able to stick around long enough to complete the art so as to experience it at its fruition. I can't quite seem to see why your garrolous stand in such a biased and imbalanced attitude saying that your 16 years of experience has led you to know the truth as far as what art is so and art isn't therefore we must all run out and study fragments of as many as possible. I know this sounds insulting and I didn't really want to be but, you've seemed to forgotten that all most 90 % of people come on this forum and accept the fact that what they say is merely opinion, some people do have the facts to back it up, but a lot don't. You make it sound like what you are saying is factual. Im sorry but thats just so laughable. You have seen one person on tape fall to another and therefore you feel justified in declaring that that persons art is insufficient!!! Maybe his art wasn't and just the application of his skill was, thereore the art remains in tact. Everyone does it at some point, but there really is no real need for people to come on here and pontificate to this level, espcially when the hypocrosises are obvious and transparent.

[Budokan]

Good point, Repulsive Monkey. I think you've nailed it down exactly right.

[MA fanatic]

Guys:
I'm not sure you guys are reading my initial thread. I have always stated that what I write is merely my own opinion. I was not insulted at all up until the point where someone called me a hypicrit. I think four years is enough to figure out what Wing Chun is all about. Certainly, 7 years is enough as well. I believe it was Bruce Lee who stated to William Cheung (who was taken down at will by a mediocre grappler being a grandmaster himself in one art...had he cross trained this could have been avoided) in their conversation (both men trained from Yip Man) that "I will beat you because all your life you've been doing the same thing while I cross trained and have seen the other truths." I don't claim to know the absolute truth. But, what you may seem as jumping around from school to school, I see as cross training and searching for answers. Tell me, how am I any worse than a master of Praying Mantis who's two ribs I cracked with a Thai kick? The guy had trained for 20 years in one style. Tell me, why am I so bad if I took down a Karate 3rd dan with 15 years experience in one art with a basic wrestling shoot? Can I do it again? Depends on my opponent. Some karate guys and praying mantis masters will kill me in a minute. I know my limmitations and i know what I dont know. And, for those who say that I site isolated incidents, trust me, there are many who will back me up, and I have seen many more followers of a single style be crushed by someone who has cross trained. There is nothing wrong with having one art as the main focus of life's long work, and at the same time cross training in other systems. Why is that bad? Because a master who may be teaching an outdated art convinced you that his style is all you need? You guys need to wake up if you believe that. I love kung fu. I will most likely train in it again. I think the only difference between me and some other people is that I have the courage to admit what I don't know and what my art lacks instead of hiding behind a master or a system. In my opinion, no art is complete. No master has all the answers. It is up to the student to fill in the missing holes.

MA fanatic

[MA fanatic]

For the record, I posted my martial arts background because someone asked. I changed schools because schools tend to relocate and masters do move. I do attend seminars of any martial arts instructor who comes into town just to meet a famous MA master, to learn new techniques and to explore new theories on combat.

MA fanatic