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Thread: the importance of uniforms

  1. #1
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    the importance of uniforms

    what's everyone's feeling on the importance of uniforms? (not necessarily a question about belt ranking systems, but if you want to bring that up, fire away.)

    does it create a sense of discipline, tradition, ****geniety?

    is it completely unnecessary? does it stifle the individual?

    what do you think?


    stuart

  2. #2
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    oh, for god's sake. h*mogeniety.

  3. #3
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    For events like large demonstrations and competitions, they are nice on the audiences eyes.

    Other than that, I don't care for them. Any discipline they add is external to the practitioner, kind of fake. Anyone who practices harder because they wear a uniform should reassess their priorities.

    In my mind, being able to fight with the system you learn is a better tribute to your school than matching shirts with patches and belts.

  4. #4
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    Uniforms are nice and practical. Shirts and pants rip up too easy, and have you ever had someone do a collar choke on you with a T Shirt on? Might as well be piano wire. Nice for grabbing, plenty of room for stretching, easy to wash allot and no big deal if it gets a little bloody.

    To me, it's just practical.

    I don't think that uniforms instill any kind of comradery or order within the school. Disiplined, serious practitioners will do that. ja(koffs in uniforms will still be ja(koffs.

    JWT
    If you pr!ck us, do we not bleed? If you poison us, do we not die? And if you wrong us, shall we not revenge? If we are like you in the rest, we will resemble you in that the villany you teach me, I will execute, and it shall go hard but I will better the instruction. MOV

  5. #5
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    I like the shirts… always a conversation starter…but x-tra large is never big enuff… at tourneys, it's cool to have your lil group lookin like they 'bout sumethin… but if/when you or one of your peoples azz get kicked and everybody saw it… that hurts… but at the end of the day, it really dont matter... it's just a way for the school to get a lil extra $$$... but belts suck... who cares how many forms i know if i cant work many of the techniques...


    "Uniforms are nice and practical. Shirts and pants rip up too easy, and have you ever had someone do a collar choke on you with a T Shirt on? Might as well be piano wire. Nice for grabbing, plenty of room for stretching, easy to wash allot and no big deal if it gets a little bloody."

    that's a good point too… I didn't think about that aspect… blood stains on your uni… now that’s a good sign of rank… that or you get your azz kicked too much…
    Last edited by Suntzu; 04-24-2002 at 09:46 AM.

  6. #6
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    Uniforms can bring a sense of ****geneity to a group if that is what you need to shoot for. With everyone dressed the same it will bring everyone closer to the same basic operating level. It doesnt reduce skill but helps each individual to associate with the 'team'.
    Unfortunately our society at the moment doesnt promote this, everyone wants to be a rebel and stand alone so unifroms are generally distained.
    I dont think they are essential but they can add a team feeling which isnt a bad thing.
    _______________
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  7. #7
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    KC elbows,

    i was thinking the same thing, actually. it's similar to bowing (though i do encourage bowing, oddly). you can bow and still think the other guy's a tool. or not bow and still deeply respect the other guy.


    JWT,

    ironically, a woman in my class ripped my dobok last night. just the little tag off the front. no big deal. but you have a good point. they're usually made of sturdier stuff than a t-shirt.

    and yeah, a jack*ff in a gi is still a jack*ff.


    suntzu,

    can't argue with it's effect at public gatherings, offering some sense of cohesion.


    stuart

  8. #8
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    well, everyone wears one.

    business men wear the uniform of the suit and tie, hip hoppers wear the baggy pants and loose fit uniform, hippies wear the grungy jeans and love beads uniform, etc etc.

    In a martial arts school uniforms have a few purposes.

    1. it identifies you as a part of a community

    2. it brings sameness to all and therefore is a form of deterent to ego.

    3.it has practicality to it within a style IE: The aikido stylist can hide foot movement with the low hanging "skirts", while in kung fu, the uniform is loose fitting and allows for complete motion.

    In Karate the uniform is usually a think canvas GI and provides some protection from scratches as well when someone grabs the cloth the limbs can still move inside. THe cloth can serve as a trap of sorts.

    Other than that, it's a style of dress that is representitive of the group you are part of.

    peace
    Kung Fu is good for you.

  9. #9
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    I prefer to train naked.
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  10. #10
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    red5angel,

    yeah, that's part of what i'm getting at. i used to teach at a friend's dojang. he ran taekwondo classes. everyone wore some variation on the uniform (full dobok, dobok pants and school t-shirt, belt, etc.)

    my class was much more informal. t-shirt, sweatpants, shorts, whatever.

    i do think it reflects a different teaching/training philosophy. matt's emphasis was certainly on some sense of community in the school. me, i tend to encourage differences in my students. not inequalities, necessarily (though if someone excels, i'll certainly acknowledge it). but i'm one of those guys that believes that the style comes from the individual, not vice versa. so i try to pick up on people's strengths and weaknesses and take them into account.

    not that wearing a uniform precludes that, of course. there may be absolutely no relation between the two things. but it seems to me that if you're attempting to create h0m0geniety in your class, it will affect how you teach individual people.

    not sure about that though. thoughts?


    stuart

  11. #11
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    Thats interesting and a good point Ap. I guess I would have to say that in my belief, ultimately your personality isnt overcome by wearing a uniform, you just more easily identify with those around you who also wear the uniform. this could be said for the instructor as well, he may well be able to focus on a more ****geneous way of teaching, and not pay attention to individual weaknesses and strengths.
    However I believe that ultimately it is more a moral thing. As human beings we strive, whether we want to admit it or not, to belong. To belong to something larger. We also strive to be recognized individually. I believe martial arts feeds this paradox somewhat effectively, because in getting into the martial arts we have joined our "group" but still remain somewhat distinct from the large population. Uniforms help to identify with that group and help to set us apart from others around us.
    _______________
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  12. #12
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    note to self: NO grappling with water dragon.

  13. #13
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    kung lek,

    well, i'm not really considering it a uniform unless the specifics are dictated by someone else. if a kid opts to wear baggy pants because all his friends wear baggy pants, it's not a uniform. it's an expression of an internally-held desire to look the same as the guy next to him. (though it does address a lot of the same issues. you're right about that, i think.)

    the community thing is definitely valid, though it's not something i stress myself. i like the point about ego deterrence. it's one of the checks i have in the 'pro' column for uniforms. though i certainly think that there are other ways to achieve the same end. practicality within a style is also a good point. judo has a stiffer gi to allow for use in throws, aikido hakama hide foot movements, etc. i'll buy that.

    my students tend to wear whatever's comfortable, etc. without much regard for uniformity or representation. but that's largely because of the size and informality of my class. there's no question he's in the class. he's jude. he's here every tuesday. we all know that. but in a larger institution, i could see it becoming more important. or rather, serving different functions.


    stuart

  14. #14
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    I think ultimately it can serve a purpose and when not used for nefarious means can be a good thing, albeit not necessary.

    Otherwise we could all grapple naked?
    _______________
    I'd tell you to go to hell, but I work there and don't want to see you everyday.

  15. #15
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    red5angel,

    nicely said. very nicely said. (the community thing, not he naked grappling thing.)




    stuart
    Last edited by apoweyn; 04-24-2002 at 10:32 AM.

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