choy lay fut metal rings

[RAIN]

i want to know if in choy lay fut the trainning include iron rings or another weight element ?

[yutyeesam]

i don't know of anything like that formally specified...

but i've heard that ring training and punching with weights can damage your shoulders in the long run. The resistance MA training that I was shown was doing punches with a bunjee like stretch cord.

123

[Fu-Pow]

Yes, I definitely wouldn't recommend the rings for CLF. We used them when I used to train Hung Ga but the movements are much smaller so it works better. These rings were specifically designed for Hung Ga.

[firepalm]

There is an old implement called a stone lock that was used in CLF, as well as styles like Lama, that essentially is shaped similar to a lock. The stone lock is usually made of stone or a wood casing filled with cement. The various punches of CLF were trained using them. They are however quite uncommon these days.

[David Jamieson]

While the rings are used in Southern styles of Kung Fu, particularly Hung styles, they do come from Southern Sil Lum (which is what Hung is considered quite often).

Any techniques or training done improperly can damage the practitioner. Having said that, I have trained with weighted rings for a few years now and have not suffered any damage other than the bruises you get when using them. But hey, that's what Dit Da Jow is for

I personally believe they are a vital and highly useful training tool for any practitioner of Chinese Martial arts and while I do not use the rings in training the North Shaolin I have been taught, I do use them for training in all the sets of southern Shaolin I have been taught. They make a huge difference after even a few short months of use.

peace

[Yum Cha]

I haven't used any for awhile, but **** if they don't sound good once you get going!

[GOLDEN ARMOR]

Are they used much in Bak Mei?

[Yum Cha]

I can't really speak for Pak Mei when it comes to rings, I think they are just a traditional training tool for strength and arm conditioning.

I've seen smaller stainless steel ones, and thicker black iron ones. You need a soft one to go on last next to your wrist, well, most of us do, anyway.

Obviously, short armed styles would have a different experience with them than long armed styles, but they're just a training aid, from my point of view.

Get 5 or seven on each arm, sliding up and back, banging away, makes quite a noise.

[GOLDEN ARMOR]

Yum Cha, does Bak Mei do any iron arm/body? Is there a lot of conditioning done in class?
I've heard that Bak Mei is a little like S. Mantis that u both use short power. I've read that S. Mantis develops its short power from its iron body. Is Bak Mei's power generation similar to this?

Also the defence is it more redirecting the force like Wing Chun or both force against force & redirecting like Hung Gar? Also does Bak Mei train in Chi Sau (sticky hands/legs)? Is Chi Gong a big part of the Bak Mei system? Is it taught from the start?

Sorry for all the questions, I've been interested in Bak Mei for a while but there isn't much info out there. Thanks.

Golden Armor

[Bolt]

Bak Mei does not use the rings (traditionally), but I've been tempted to use them a bit. Some portions of the forms are not condusive to use of the rings, others are - I would need to "free-form" movements (strip some out of form sets) to make good use of the rings just for personal purposes. We do have conditioning for various parts of (mostly) hands/fingers/knuckles and wrist (+more). We have short and medium range, no long; no force against force.
Chi Sau is not traditionally part of Bak Mei but we have adapted it's use. Chi Gong is definitely part of system.
You are correct, in that information regarding Bak Mei is sparse and difficult to locate.
Interested in Yum Cha's respons.

[Yum Cha]

Hi

Are you a student of Chan Yong-Fa? He is good friends with my Sifu.

Yes, short and medium range, mostly. Bridge, attack, finish. Power comes from the 6 powers, part of our lore, if you will. Iron body means a few different things. We do not use that term, but I do not speak for Pak Mei in general.

Pak Mei doesn't have defense. <grin> Really, our defense is bridging.

Yes, Pak Mei is very internal. You may be taught it as a beginner, but you don't learn it for awhile, and it comes in stages.

Bone hardening, conditioning, whatever you wish to call it, is part of our school, but not a focus. We have exercises, forearms, tiger claw, phoenix fist hardeners, but it's a personal choice.

There is a bit or redirecting force, a bit of overwhelming force, and a bit of underwhelming force.

Chi Sau isn't practiced in our school. Pak Mei does have "stickey hands" in practice though, and light grappling/grabbing.

[fiercest tiger]

ykm use rings during practice althougth it can throw out your timing and posture because of weight etc.

YKM has iron body training similar to SPM, also has sensitvity drills.

I think it all depends on your teacher how he or she teaches the art, like yum cha said!

Some focus on forms and no drills or sparring etc, some do lots of drill/pads and conditioning plus forms.

[Fifth Brother]

Traditional Choy Lee Fut does not use the rings. Instead they use the Mook Jong or wooden man to condition their arms. It is Hung Gar which uses the rings mostly

[premier]

Traditional Choy lee fut does NOT use Mook Jong. It's a wing chun dummy. CLF's basic dummy is called Ching jong.

http://www.clfma.com/modules.php?op=...rtid=25&page=1


premier

[Fifth Brother]

Mook Jong refers to a wooden man/dummy. It does not mean a wing chun wooden man unless you say wing chun mook jong. Ching Jong is a little more specific to Choy Lee Fut and it means 'balance dummy'. I used the Mook Jong as more people are aware of this term than Ching Jong :)
Besides the terminology is really a matter of semantics, as the whole point of the post (which Premier totally missed) was about Choy Lee Fut not traditionally using the rings but a Wooden Dummy to condition the arms.