Gaining weight and internal martial arts

[Eight Diagram Boxer]

I'm 6'4" and 166 pounds. I'd like to gain about 15 pounds and be around 180, so I've been researching weight gain. It seems like a high protein, low fat diet with an increased caloric intake will do the job, but all plans include weight lifting and reduced cardiovascular activity. It seems like this is contradictory to the practice of internal martial arts, since increased muscle mass might inhibit flexibility. Has anyone lifted weights while practicing internal martial arts? any recommendations or advice? I know this has been on here before but the threads are gone now with the new setup.
Thanks

[Kumkuat]

When will people learn that increase in muscle does not hinder flexibility? I lift weights and do internal. I'm a hypocrite. I know I'm not suppose to do that, but I love weight lifting so much that I can't give it up. Anyway, the maximum amount you spend in the gym can probably be 3-4 hours a week. Well, just practice your internal stuff for 8-10 hours a week in conjunction. Oh yeah, and eat a lot. like around 5000 calories/day or something. Oh and eat fat too. Don't avoid it. But fat has to be polyunsaturated or monounstaturated. Don't eat too much saturated fats. And don't eat too much sugar.

[Fu-Pow]

I think you can probably get away with lifting weights and doing internal, although I've stated otherwise before on this forum. As far as an art like Taiji any weight lifting you do is gonna be more for aesthetics. In the 3 internal arts and good external arts you're going to want to make you body like a huge "bottom weighted" spring. So you don't want to get in the habit of being tense and making the spring too stiff (nor would you want to let it collapse by being too limp). And also be careful you don't make yourself too top heavy by only concentrating on upper body strength.

[beautifulvaley]

1. peanut butter,molasses , and bannana sandwidges
and lots of milk works for me.

I found weight lifting to boring

why do you want to gain weight any way , a fight coming up or what

[CD Lee]

I used to be into bodybuilding hardcore for six years. All I wanted to do was gain weight. Now that I am 200 all I want to do is lose weight. I think you have a very efficient weight for you hieght. I lost 40 lbs running a few years back, but I could not lose the muscles, although I did lose some. I could not get a runners body no matter how hard I tried.

Why do you want to gain weight? Stay light. Your body can do so much more at a lighter weight. If you do internals properly, you should have plenty of power. I just think you should let your body be at a natural weight within reason.

Also, I know you want to add muscle, but just remember, by trying hard to gain weight, you will reset your internal clock for feeling full, and when and if you metabolism changes, you are going to fight your eating habits very bitterly for a long time to come. Your tastes will develop towards very dense caloric and high fat foods, which you will truly cherish in later years.

Now, if you still want to gain weight, how much, what type, what for, and here is the real kicker: How badly??? There are answers, although you may not want to do them all.

[Eight Diagram Boxer]

Well, I'm not desperate to gain weight, but I do feel I'm a little underweight. I'd like to add about 10 pounds and be right in the range for my height and frame- around 175-180. I'm not trying to get huge at 200 or anything...

[looking_up]

Lots of standing qigong with an emphasis on relaxation. Let your body decide how much it should weigh. Don't try to force things
physically or mentally.

[kungfu cowboy]

Lifting will most definitely not hinder your MA practice. Try a weight gain drink (like Mega Mass) or increase your daily caloric intake by approx 500-700 calories, or whatever is comfortable. Sit around a lot, and don't have bowel movements.* Determine how many calories you eat a day on average, and keep a daily calorie diary and weigh yourself weekly to determine if you are gaining or need to modify your diet. Basic rule: Total calories in must be greater than total calories burned to gain weight. Good luck!


*a joke

[Sum Guye]

ETB,

Check out a book called 'The Testosterone Advantage'. It's well
written with dietairy and workout plans for folks who want to gain or lose weight while becoming fit.

Your local library will probobly have it.

[Scarletmantis]

Alot of good advice here. At 6'4", 180 lbs. is still going to be skinny though. I'm 6' even, and at 215 most people can't even tell I work out when I'm dressed! If you put on 15 pounds of muscle, with a proportionate strength gain, your power is gonna sky rocket, but your looks won't change much.

Don't worry about being "too heavy" either. Your muscle is going to be able to carry it's own wieght many times over. In fact, you might even "feel" lighter. If CD is a 200 lb. bodybuilder, he's gotta be like 5'2"!

You want to concentrate on big multi joint movements for maximal testosterone boosting/functional kung fu strength. I've been powerlifting for about three years, and I found the following workout to be effective in my off season. It should work well for strength/wieght gain in an internal art.

Bench Press/Cable Rows
Squats/ Deadlifts
Dips/Chin ups*

Superset each pair (performing them back to back, with a rest between each pair). For power gain, work 3 sets of the heaviest weight you can handle for 5 reps. Since size is your goal, you can do 3 sets of 8-10, upping the poundage whenever you push beyond 10. For a real kick, I like to work for power AND size by doing 5 sets of 5 reps.

Do the routine twice a week, with at least two days off between each session. Oh, and I forgot to mention that the pair marked * is a "burnout phase" working the muscles you did in the first session to get a maximal pump. You needn't do the burnout pair unless you want to put on size, but then again, it can't hurt, right? You may also want to choose a burnout exercise for your legs too. I don't like to because Ba Gua sessions tax my legs enough as it is

[Scarletmantis]

Oops! Another thing that's nice about this routine is that it only takes about 25 minutes to perform. That leaves plenty of time to practice your martial art if you're a kung fu buff...errr a buff kung fu... ummmm guy.

My guess is that you're also probably getting enough Cardio health benifits from your Ba Gua. I'd back off on any supplemental Cardio you're doing 'cause it's just burning calories you need for wieght gain.

[CD Lee]

Posted by Scarletmantis:

If CD is a 200 lb. bodybuilder, he's gotta be like 5'2"!

Screw you. I am 5'9. Don't give me your roll-eye ****, *******.
Are you intimidated by my frame? If so, you have a real ****ing problem. I am just trying to help this guy. Go **** off!

[Daniel Madar]

I think CD has some good advice.

As was mentioned on another board, the following information comes from a 78 year old bagua, and taiji practitioner. I am sure the original poster has read it, but it might be edifying for others.

Taken directly from the other post*

"The trick for gaining mass while doing internal martial arts is to not gain too quickly, make sure to stretch your upper body, waist, and legs before and after workouts, and to LAY OFF if you are still tired from previous days. If not, you will end up super tight and your skill will suffer. It's not the mass that inhibits flexibility, its the method of training. I know a 78 year old internal artist who used to weight train and do gymnastics as well as internal martial arts, and he agreed about these points since in his experience these elements were key to avoiding ruining his skill. "

[CD Lee]

Thanks Daniel.

ETB, I think you have the right idea. There is no harm in adding good muscle to your frame, as long as you do it with balance. Muscle is efficient in the utilization of oxygen, and your heart will benefit from good training as well.

I would certainly be careful about radical changes to your diet to attain this goal.

ScarletMantis: I said I was a bodybuilder years ago, hardcore. That does not mean I was good or had the classic proportions to win contests. In fact, I never gained past 170 lbs bodybuilding at 5'9. If I wanted, I could have taken steriods and been more competitive, as my brother did, going from 160 to 215 in three months. I did not want to go that route. I did bodybuilding because I liked the workouts. The good news, since I trained properly, without drugs, I still have a nice muscular structure, not a huge one. The bodybuilders you see in magazines are not natural, and very very few people have the genetics to attain those type bodies.

Also, I do not believe that heavier is better regarding muscles. There is a law of diminishing returns in relation to gaining muscular weight on any given skeletal structure. There is a natural balance for the efficiency of the heart and circulatory systems, combined with the respritory system. The length of your limbs have natural leverage points that have a bell curve of muscle mass regarding the distribution of strength, efficiency, and flexibility. You can gain more muscle on your frame than is optimal, although most people do not have the genetics to actually make this a reality.

[Scarletmantis]

Cd, I'm sorry if I hit a nerve there. I meant to be using you as an example. Eight Trigrams Boxer stated that he is 6'4", and that if he weighed 200 lbs., he would be too big. I'm sure you realize that a 6'4" man is never going to look like a body builder at that body wieght. I only used your name because you described yourself as a "hardcore body builder" who wieghs 200 lbs. The reference to your height was merely an educated guess based on the body builders who are active today, and was meant to illustrate the absurdity of the of the idea that 200 lbs. of muscle is "too much" for a 6'4" man.

...and no, I'm not intimidated by your frame...
just jealous! Please accept my apology.