A Challenge....

[red5angel]

I have a challenge for anyone who is able to come to minneapolis June 29th and 30th. We are having a seminar with Carl Dechiara that weekend. Some of you have accused me of spamming because I mention him and his skill periodically but I am willing to put my money where my mouth is.
You come up, check it out, see what he has to offer. I guarentee you will be suitably impressed if you have an open mind. You can stay at my place, I have plenty of space, I can get you there and back both days, all you have to do is show and participate.
Right now your confident the wing chun you are learning is the good stuff right? I was too and I wouldnt be here right now if I didnt know in my gut that this is the real deal. I hear a lot of people who say they have touched hands with someone who has convinced them they know what it is all about, I am saying here is your chance.
We are always arguing what makes good wing chun on this forum. I see a lot of guys talking a big game but they dont seem williing to explore it a little and challenge what they know.
For those of you who are just starting out, here is the chance to learn what direction you could and should be heading in.
For those of you who have learned enough, long enough to feel you can judge someone and thier skill by touching thier hands, here is your chance. Check out the post about the minneapolis seminar, and email michael or pm me for any details or questions you have.

I am not interested in getting into an argument about what is better, what is spamming, what is right or wrong. I am saying if you want to find out, then here is your chance. Check your ego at the door and you will learn something!

[Sihing73]

Hi Redangel,

While I can appreciate your apparently unwavering support of your Sifu I must say that using words like "challenge" can cause problems. After reading your post I think that I understand that you are not looking for any type of fight but are kind of telling others that you have found the "true deal" and are inviting them to experience it as well. But why not make this an "invitation" rather than a "challenge?"

While your zeal is commendable, there is the underlying tone of "my way is the best way" which can be misconstrued and perhaps cause problems. Knowing how fragile some egos are, and how violate others tempers can be I think I would opt to tone it down just a bit. While you have found a method and approach which suits you and is among the better ones available, by several different accounts, let us not forget that each method and approach has validity.

Also, since you have opted to invite others to attend and even to stay at your house I was wondering if you would foot the bill . I know that I might take a trip out to visit and learn if the cost were being picked up by someone else. I am always looking for the free things in life

Seriously, your ardour is commendable but the tone is a bit rough. Be careful as I am sure this event is one which will not be served if others arrive with intentions other than learning and exchanging. Much like another seminar with another "challenge" several years ago It does neither yourself nor your Sifu any good to issue any type of challenge and only opens the door to something unpleasant regardless of the outcome. Besides, as history has shown, no matter the outcome most people will go their way unchanged anyhow

Peace,

Dave

[wujidude]

Carl has studied for a long time and attained good skill in Wing Chun under Kenneth Chung. What then motivated him to become an "indoor disciple" (his words) of Chen Qingzhou in Chen style taijiquan? And practice the Lao Jia Yi Lu form of Chen taijiquan 7-10 times a day (again, his words)--something that would take at least 4 hours of continuous practice each day.

Has Chen taijiquan improved Carl's Wing Chun? I'm just curious, because I've seen some different threads on combining Wing Chun training with another art, very often taijiquan.

Seems to me like the relaxation and rooting aspects of Chen taijiquan would work well with Kenneth Chung's "soft touch" approach in Wing Chun.

Any thoughts are appreciated.

[red5angel]

Dave, I sometimes come off a bit rough, being in the marines and growing up in my family will do that to you! "Invitation' would probably be more approachable and it may seem more friendly but I think challenge is apropriate here. "Allow me to retort...."

I have seen a lot of talk on this forum, and several others about what is good, what is bad, what is correct and what is not. Some people choose to take the middle road, its all good for someone, and while that may be true, there is some of it out there that isnt really good for anyone. If it comes off as my way is the best way, well fist of all its not really my way, its Carl Dechiaras and Kenneth Chungs way and I think it is the right way. So much so that I would invite anyone to come, take a look at it experience it, even practice it a little and see what I am talking about.
Of course I am not looking for a fight or to set up a fight I am sincerely interested in getting people to come try it out. All thing sbeing equal if you can afford to make the trip and are into wing chun, it will, I believ, be worth your while.
I did however mention that I wasnt interested in fighting with anyone or arguing finer points, this was an invitation to experience it.
Why do I believe in what I am learning? Several reasons, the first, I saw it in action against someone who just about anyone would recognize has some real skill, and it destroyed them. This person couldnt compete at all with it. He had no real root, no real sensitivty, although if you were to ask him or talk to him about it, or look at him you would have assumed it to be true. But you would be wrong. The second reason, because Carl Dechiara seems willing to take the pepsi challenge if you know what I mean? I cannot speak for him and I am not saying he would want to duke it out with anyone and everyone who came along, but I think he would be willing to show you that what he has is the real thing. I see the sincerety in him and his desire to develope his skill and the skill of his students. he believes in what he does and I also believe that he would admit if something better came along. I just dont think there is, my opinion of course.
LOL! on that free thing, sometimes you have to pay your dues to get something! I had considered offering to pay for someone if they felt that what they had was better and could prove it at the seminar, but a.) that sounds too much like a challeneg and I want to keep it friendly! and b.) who knows who you can trust now a days to be honest! Dave, you seem like an honest guy and if you can get yourself out here I would take you up on that challenge.

Regardless of how I came off, this is a friendly invitation adn I definitly think it would be worth anyones time to come out.

[red5angel]

Wujidude, while I cant speak for Carl, I can say that we do some Taichi excersise atht help us to develop our root and relaxation. Carl has integrated them into our warm up excersises to help us develop these a little faster.
I know he trainis at Chen Village atleast once a year and takes it very seriously but as fo rhis motivation and such, you will just have to email him on it.

[fa_jing]

What's the big deal? I mean, Red5 has already challenged all of our mothers, on the main board. (Sorry Red!)

-FJ

[red5angel]

LOL! at fa-jing!

[Sihing73]

Hi Red,

Again, I understand where you are coming from and I can appreciate your zeal. While I doubt I can make it out for this event, first of all I just resumed working again, second I am still far from 100% so it would hardly be fair for me to "show off" , third a little short on notice, I will be visiting with some of Kens students near the end of this month. I am sure that it will be a gratifying experience. Also, my Sifu has always had good things to say about Ken. Actually if you look at it we are all of the Leung Shun lineage, although my approach is likely to be a bit radical and different in comparison.

I wish you luck with this event and I would like to extend an "Invitation" for you, and anyone else interested, to visit me in Philly or attend the next Gathering in NYC in July. I promise a time of fellowship with no hidden agenda. Of course I will be using subliminal techniques to bring you all to my way, which of course is the One True Way LOL!!!!

Take care and train well.

Peace,

Dave

[red5angel]

No problem Dave, good luck with the Kenneth Chung guys! I would love to go to NYC this year but I have dedicated myself to training for a few years which means I wont be doing many on the side trips, but you guys keep it up and I will be out there to show you what its all about in a few years

[fantom]

I believe you should be able to trian and learn from all people, some more than others,
But hypothetically - if someone came along whose wing chun was better than Carl's, what would happen, what would you and Carl do?

This is not a personal challenge - just a hypothetical!

PS: What is the cost of the seminar?

[anerlich]

All of you can come see our school anytime.

No, you can't stay at my place, I won't pick up and deliver, and you can pay your own **** way.

www.combatcentres.com

[red5angel]

Wujidude - I talked to Carl and this is what he said about the taichi and wingchun:
He wants it clarified that Ken Chung is still his Sifu, so he is not Master Chens indoor disciple. He was introduced to Master Chen by Ken Chung. He does Yi Lu everyday, sounds like he does it for a little less then 2 hours and tries to workout total for 4 a day, the rest of the time it sounds like he does wingchun. I was incorrect in saying he went every year, he would like to but he does not.
Basically he told me it has made him more substantial in terms of his root, his sensitivty and his body structure. The man likes Tai Chi and He feels it helps him enough to make it worth practicing side by side with hiw wing chun.
For me, the small amount I do for warm ups has helped me out immensely!

Fantom - We can probably learn something from everyone, but for some those things we learn are how not to do something, or what is the wrong way As for the better person, Well Carl has said that if someone better came along he would be willing to learn what it is they have brought to the table. He deals a lot with people who have thrown out thier training to learn with him, empty thier cups to start over and learn it the right way, so he understands this. Its another reason why I know its the good stuff, almost everyone I know that trains under him has given up years of training in other wingchun, or other martial arts to learn his and Kens way. no problem on the 'personal challenge'! I dont mind being challenged at all, its why I am learning from Carl! I will PM you with the details

Anerlich, in a few years I may visit the great continent of Australia, if so I will definitely stop by!

[wujidude]

Thanks, Redangel. It seems like good taijiquan would offer benefits in rooting and relaxation which could transfer over to wing chun practice. Good luck with the seminar.

[red5angel]

Thanks Wujidude, I think that is the idea! I will definitely enjoy the seminar!

[Shadowboxer]

FWIW - My sifu teaches/studies Tai Chi as well as WC. I don't recall who taught it to him at the moment. He also teaches 7*Praying Mantis under Sifu Lai. But, I've never asked him in what order he learned these systems or why he stayed with these particular 3.