Why is it that Praying Mantis is so effective for fighting?

[PaulLin]

I wouldn't say mantis is the #1 of all, but it is a highly balanced, highly linkable to all other arts, both internal and external fields, I have not known any other style as much as the same.

[yu shan]

PaulLin you surprise me. There are many great style`s of CMA. Southern and Northern. I must say Mantis KF is superior, hands down! If and only If you are lucky to learn traditional Mantis, all else leaves alot to be desired.

You are one of the lucky PaulLin, be proud... I know you are.

fortunate one,

YS

[PaulLin]

Originally posted by yu shan
PaulLin you surprise me. There are many great style`s of CMA. Southern and Northern. I must say Mantis KF is superior, hands down! If and only If you are lucky to learn traditional Mantis, all else leaves alot to be desired.

You are one of the lucky PaulLin, be proud... I know you are.

fortunate one,

YS

Only if I have won Lottory, then I can really have the time and energy to make the prograss I want. Not luky enough on that.

Mantis is one of the greatest for sure.

[seung ga faat]

The strong points of 7 Star are:
It's forms are easy to convert to combat
It teaches you that one attack is not enough
It always seeks to be several moves ahead.
These are some of the strong points these are taught through the forms.

[Ye Gor]

Originally posted by seung ga faat
The strong points of 7 Star are:
... It always seeks to be several moves ahead.
... taught through the forms.

SGF, how can you learn to be several moves ahead through the forms?

[PaulLin]

Originally posted by seung ga faat
The strong points of 7 Star are:
It teaches you that one attack is not enough
It always seeks to be several moves ahead.

Highly agreed form my experiences with 8 steps too.

We don't do one strike deal, the combols comes form 3 to 5 moves a set. That is, after you opened the door, you will continue the combols of the choice that you made and see fit with or without a hit on the target when the first strike was excuted. So you don't stop at one strike.

And the design of the combol moves have covered the opponent's reacts several moves ahead, so you can just keep on going until the set was completed without worried of being countered, you can only be countered if you pulse.

[SevenStar]

I refuse to believe that there is no counter if you don't stop. even if it was possible, what level do you have to be at to do it? I have a friend who trained kempo for a while, and he had such a combo - it was called "the seven swords" or something. It was a self defense type drill that consisted of seven techniques that he was supposed to be able to pull off before I could counter. He could not do it successfully...ever.

That did not mean that I was of a higher skill level than him, however, to have such a long string of techs and think that it cannot be countered isn't too realistic, IMO

While I was typing this, I searched for 7 swords and found this:

http://www.kenpousa.com/3rdbrwn.htm

but this is a little different from the one he did. I think he was trying to modify it some.

[PaulLin]

Originally posted by SevenStar
I refuse to believe that there is no counter if you don't stop. even if it was possible, what level do you have to be at to do it? I have a friend who trained kempo for a while, and he had such a combo - it was called "the seven swords" or something. It was a self defense type drill that consisted of seven techniques that he was supposed to be able to pull off before I could counter. He could not do it successfully...ever.

That did not mean that I was of a higher skill level than him, however, to have such a long string of techs and think that it cannot be countered isn't too realistic, IMO

While I was typing this, I searched for 7 swords and found this:

http://www.kenpousa.com/3rdbrwn.htm

but this is a little different from the one he did. I think he was trying to modify it some.

The combos I known I have no problem to finish it to the end in my 12 years of applictional experiences. But as you have said, the opponent I have facing might not be higher level then me.

I have found 2 cases that can have my 8 step combols stuck or wore off, but never countered. These 2 cases are:1 the opponent's foundation are very solid(or having power too much greader than the applier) and slow down the combo almost into a pulse. 2. the opponent knows what the applier is going to do before it started.

Other wise, I have seen no problem the counter concern.

[Art D]

Sounds out there PL .
I have all the respect in the world for PM, I think that it has some of the best options out there, but the stuff your saying sounds so unrealistic . I have to wounder if it were that simple why aren't all PM guys at the top of the game?

[Mantis9]

Its not that PM can't be countered; more that PM forms, drills, and techniques usually combine easily in anticipation of a counter. This is usually due to the fact that the techniques form a bridge to feel the opponents motion.

[PaulLin]

The most important to make a successful combo is the first opening chance. If you don't have a good opening chance and force the combo to it any ways, then it will not be the case. I am not other styles of Mt people, I can 't represent them. I can only say form 8 step point of view. Well, you can't even find any real 8 step out there in the game any ways.

[SevenStar]

Originally posted by Mantis9
Its not that PM can't be countered; more that PM forms, drills, and techniques usually combine easily in anticipation of a counter. This is usually due to the fact that the techniques form a bridge to feel the opponents motion.

That makes sense. it intrigues me also. It sucks that the closest mantis school is 3 hours away. I wouldn't mind seeing what it was about.

[Art D]

Mantis 9
I agree w/ your point of adaptability. It's in the flow of techniques and how easly they adapt that the real genious of PM is found.
Its not that there are no counters but the counters are easly adpted too.

[SaMantis]

I agree -- adaptability is key.

As far as seeing several moves ahead, I see that as a technique similar to that used when playing chess. You visualize several moves ahead based on the placement of pieces on the board to reach your objective. When the pieces change position you revisualize and change your strategy.

Of course, chess occurs at a much slower speed than combat, so you have time to think your way through each move ... but even chess players train using set strategies (like "combos" in MA forms) to increase their odds. Each strategy can be countered by an experienced opponent; this is where adaptability comes in. It's the same in MA.

Just my penny, anyway.

[flem]

you guys seem to practice "theoretical kung fu". i think you need to ponder artd's question- why don't pm guys rule?
i think the whole thing about the any supposed superiortity of pm revolves around it's late development same can be said for wing chun and probably(don't know the history) of choy lee fut. it all boils down to effective cover of the center line and efficient attacks- one's that work. the "new" styles cut out alot of the crap. read tao of jeet kune do- whether you are a traditionalist or not- it's all there.