Att: Grapplers! Advice needed.

[Nevermind]

Actually, anyone's advice would be appreciated. This is my first thread so bear with me if I ramble. I have been studying Hung Gar Kung Fu for about 5 months now. For the last 3 yrs I had been training exclusively in ITF TKD. I did about 2 yrs on and off of Shaolin Kung Fu about 10 yrs ago but did not train seriously. As you can probably guess, I have no experience with groundfighting. However, I do feel that I need to incorporate it in to what I am currently learning. I am fortunate enough to have a good friend who is highly experienced in both Muay Thai and submission wrestling. He has agreed to work with me on some groundfighting. Now, I am really concerned with two aspects of groundfighting: 1) Defending against a takedown. 2) If I am taken down, how do I get back up? Since I love Kung Fu and strongly believe in its effectiveness, I have no desire to abandon it. However, I do believe that all styles have weaknesses and I am just looking to fill in the gaps. The advice I need is: What do you guys think of the 2 aspects of groundfighting that I am looking to learn? Is there anything else you would recommend learning other than takedown defenses and submission counters. I really have no desire to stay on the ground and fight. I simply want to be able to counter so that I can get back up if I am ever taken down. I would appreciate any advice that you guys can give. Thanks in advance and I look forward to hearing your opinions. Peace!

[Water Dragon]

Concentrate on 4 things

1. Upa
2. Elbow escapes
3. Sweeps
4. Guard passes

[Nevermind]

Waterdragon, thanks for the response. However, I am not familiar with the term upa (?) Could you explain a little further?

[LEGEND]

Your friend should teach you how to SPRAWL, Crossface( a counter to single leg takedown ), ****( just learned it recently )...but to be honest descent SPRAWLING is all you need! If u are taken down and the guy is on top...then learning how to SWEEP and a STANDING PASS is great! Many UFC and PRIDE competitors cannot be taken down by the basic run and tackle anymore due to SPRAWLING. SAN SHOU fighters are expert at countering throws and takedowns also. U shouldn't have a problem...2 classes on SPRAWLING and u'll be ok.

[DragonzRage]

Hi. I respect your open-minededness! You should definitely work with your friend. For takedown defense have him show you the sprawl and do some live drills such as takedown vs punching sparring. You mentioned his submission wrestling background so I assume he has knowledge of the wrestling clinch. You should work on clinch teachniques such as pummeling so that you won't be clueless in the clinch. Work some Muay Thai plum techniques as well. For ground defense, a good place to start is to drill guard passing and escaping the mount and side mount with your friend. But you really have to know the ground game well if you expect to be able to defend it well. If I were you I'd seriously consider enrolling in a grappling class or at least getting to together with a good group of guys who train regularly and are willing to show you the basics.

By the way, I do Muay Thai and grappling. But I studied Hung Ga for five years. Just thought I'd mention it! Good luck

[SevenStar]

shrimping, but that pretty much ties in with elbow escapes. you also want to learn to be mobile on the mat - when you are new to grappling, you see that maneuvering on the ground (pivoting and such) is not as easy as you may think.

[chingei]

Originally posted by LEGEND
Your friend should teach you how to SPRAWL, but to be honest descent SPRAWLING is all you need! ! Many UFC and PRIDE competitors cannot be taken down by the basic run and tackle anymore due to SPRAWLING.

AAAAAAAAAaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!

the fairy tale continues.

[Gabriel]

I always like to whip my eggs for a solid minute. Maybe even two. Make sure to pour the egg out of the container with a similar consistency throughout, so as your mixture will not be "clumpy". Then I can safely make the best sunny side up eggs that I can make. This is only my method. IMHO the eggs go well with SMACK ramen noodles, especially the spicy flavor. Make sure to use two flavor packs, as this makes it really scrumptious. Generally, I microwave on high for 3 minutes. If I really want to spice up my meal, Ill boil the water. Now, there are two schools of thought as far as how to prepare the noodles themselves: There are those that like to not break up the noodles at all. Then, there are those that like to break up the noodles into managable bites. IMHO, the managable bites method is preferrable, less messy. Serve with two vanilla flavored cokes!

Gabriel

[Gabriel]

Gasp, this isn't the cooking forum!

[Merryprankster]

LOL at Gabriel LITERALLY responding to "any advice you can give would be appreciated!!!"


chingei--before you blow a fuse, (and I agree that the sprawl isn't a magical answer--all sorts of hip shifting needed to make it REALLY work) how about this---

If you had a guy who really didn't want to concentrate on grappling, but didn't want to be ignorant either, what basics would you teach him?

[SevenStar]

It's not too far fetched, actually. he mentioned ufc and pride. as you may have noticed, the most common takedowns in these are the single and double leg, which can be handled nicely by sprawling. Of course, it's not the only thing you need, but you definitely need it in your arsenal.

[KnightSabre]

You have to remmeber that to successfully stop a take down,your takedown defence has to be as good or better than his takedown skill.
Even now in both UFC and Pride with almost all the fighters having take down and takedown defence skills,most of the fights still go to the ground.
It' s almost always harder to stop the take down than to get the take down.

[Unstoppable]

These ideas aaaare outdated and somewhat stupid. To stop a takedown you must rely on your own specialties not try to use a method of another system that i have been shown inneffective countless times.

A good method which has been tought (to me) is practice striking your friend as he runs toward you. you must try to tap him in the face as he is about where you can first hit him, which means starting your strike before he is IN RANMGE!!! if you practice this for two hours per day seven days per week, eventually you will be able to find that you can hit him EVERY TIME!!!! Now if you are tried to gewt take down you will find that the SAME STGRIKE HITS THE WRESTLER. ITS THAT SIMPLE. (I have tried it)

Once you can hit the wrestler, the wrestler cannot get to you because he is AT THE END OF YOUR ARM (FOOT WHATEVER) AND NOT GRAPPLIONG YOU!!! THIS IS very important.

ANU QUESTIONS?

[KnightSabre]

Unstoppable,

what if he shoots after a jab cross combo,and you're busy blocking,how do you hit him then?

[Merryprankster]

Unless you knock out the shooter, OR completely interrupt their forward progress so they cannot get hold of something, you'll wind up on your back, under their terms, more often than not.

I'm playing the odds. My personal experiences, being on the shooting end, have been profoundly different then yours.

Don't get me wrong--I've been hit plenty, and with bad intentions (one of the very nice things about this game--your training partners will knock you out when you go full speed, if they can). Just not stopped. There's a BIG difference in the end result there.