Could someone Explain Reverse breathing

[TaiChiBob]

Greetings..

A great quote i find applicable at times like these...

"it is as easy as doing it.. as difficult as 'trying' to do it"..

Too often we confuse the ritual for the goal..

Be well..

[Walter Joyce]

And too often we think we have it down when we don't.

Right now, I'm at the ritual as goal stage, I believe my path lies through physical understanding.

[Kevin Wallbridge]

I get the opportunity to work with lots of people who come to Chinese physical culture with a sort of "floating vagueness" about energetics and medicine. In recent dialogue with friends and students I have refered to them as the I-am-a-cloud-guys. To these people I say exactly what TaiChiBob is saying, often in the same words. So I cannot argue with that view. Its useful and practical and is a direct way to get at what Neigong advocates.

Whjat I have been trying to say here is for other people, the ones who are more hard-core in their training and who have a sincere commitment to get at the deeper implicatons of internal arts. I have some fear that the recent trend to harsh pragmatism in internal arts will be just as extreme as the peace-and-love-hippie-taichi trend of the 1970's and early 80's, and it may do more harm in the long run by trying to reduce Neigong to a susperstition.

One of the great things about the Daoist models of the body is that they have been continually tested over the last 2500 years, because they are the basis of the medicine as well. The concept of Yuan Qi is not so ritualistic or contrived if you see it as an simple observation of something that can be affected in the body from the outside in a consistent and reproducable manner. Chinese medicine isn't based on the postulation of a theory then its testing. Its based on contemplation and observation without agenda. When the Daoists advocate fangsong-ziran (naturalness) they still do it the context of the derived knowledge of what life is and what the body is.

After all, if Chinese medicine was simply ritual then it wouldn't work on dogs or horses. I'm sure the belief system of the pig has little to do with how effective acupunture anaesthesia is.

Cheers all.

[TaiChiBob]

Greetings..

i hope i never figure i "have it down".. i can only report my current understanding based on my experiences... i have been reading and experimenting with the concepts posted here since the thread began.. The only assertion i can make, based on "my" experince, is that currently the task of reverse breathing doesn't compliment "my" own application of skills in free-sparring.. That being said, it still plays an important role, for me, in the development of internal energies which plays a major role in free-sparring..

That is my own simplistic undrstanding of the topic, yet.. i will continue to experiment and research.. my understandings on most things are subject to revision... (thankfully)..

Best and sincere regards to all..

[Walter Joyce]

Bob,
Understood. You make an excellent point. The gap in neijia arts between neigong, or internal power training, and application, i.e. free sparring is huge. Most people don't truly understand that. And if they do, they say "too hard, takes too long" and walk. Thats ok by me.

But, and I'm going on faith here(I have seen neijia free fighting skills manifested by others, I am still working on it), if one continues to train diligently, that gap closes and the very skills one develops through neigong manifest themselves in a free fighting format.

BUT, this takes TIME. It isn't fast food, or the martial equivalent thereof.

Also, implicit in the idea that taiji should yield instant results is the assumption that most people who see taiji as a fighting art, are learning it to fight.

Newsflash, I learned how to fight a long time ago, I'm working on refinement of skill. I'd bet the same applies to you.

Respectfully,
Walter

[TaiChiBob]

Greetings..

indeed.. at times, its a lonely path.. too many people unwilling to invest the time or adjust their perspectives... but, as you well know, its worth the effort.. if one can stay centered in the crucible of conflict, the clarity outside the arena is inspiring..