Help with 7* PM Basic Forms

[Skarbromantis]

I would agree with what BeiTangLang said, it all depends on yourself, try it, see if it works, if it does, than good, if not, try something else, it all on your self, I write them down, also I draw little stick figures, when I'm at work I play the form in my head, I do all that to remember a form, good luck.

Skard1

[Tainan Mantis]

Hua Tien,
You mentioned 8 Elbows.
From Luo Guangyu's lineage I have only heard that there is an 8 Claws. Both sound similar in Chinese, ba zhou or ba zhua.
I have also seen it written in Chinese as 8 Claws.

Is the 8 Elbows you mention originally 8 Claws?
Or is this another 8 Elbows form?

[Tainan Mantis]

Draco,
Wah Lum also has beng bu. In English it is called Big Mantis.

[Mantis9]

They're the same form. I've heard this from Sifu Steve Cottrell and Sifu Brendan Tunks as well as my own sifu. Also, If you check Sifu Tony Chuy's forms list at:

[URL=http://www.northernmantis.com]

You'll see the chinese, romanization, and the english translation, which he refers to as 8 elbows. I've notice the difference myself and don't know if there is a "right" translation. But, I do know they're the same thing.

Mantis9

[HuangKaiVun]

Xue Tanglang, get yourself a VIDEO.

Your sifu should be able to recommend you a video that helps you remember your sets.

[Lisa]

If you could get a video of the form from your school, that would be good. Otherwise, I'm not sure I would want to learn from one. There can be a lot of difference between how your school teaches the form, and how another school does. For example, I've downloaded five different video clips of Bung Bo. Each of them has the same movements, but there is a definite difference in how each is performed. But if the video was recommended by your sifu, then I'm sure there wouldn't be any problem with it.

Lisa

[Tainan Mantis]

Mantis9,
Thanks for that info.
The 7* 8 Claws of HK seems to have no relation to the Meihua and Taiji PM version.
Do you know where it originated?

[Mantis9]

No. I don't, but I'll ask around and get back to you.

Mantis9

[Mantis9]

From a quick internet search, Ba Zhou is credited to Wong Long according to Sifu Carl Albright.

Carl Albright

He's lineage is by way of LGY and Chiu Chi Man.

More later.

[Xue Tanglang]

I don't think my Sifu is big on the idea of videos. One of the advanced students was doing a form and apparently had an 'extra' move. Without even asking, Sifu told him he needed to stay away from those videos. I can ask him about taking some in-class videos.
Thanks Again!

[Young Mantis]

Tainan Mantis,

I don't claim to know a whole lot about the system, but from what I have been told, the Baht Zhao form of the Law Gwong Yook lineage is the same that is accredited to Wong Long. There are some people who have listed a form named 8 Talons or 8 Claws. To my knowledge, there is no such form in the LGY lineage curriculum. The word for claw or talon sounds the same as the pronunciation used for elbow as listed on our website and was most likely written incorrectly.

I have personally learned both the Seven Star and the Tai Chi Mantis versions of Baht Zhao. By chance, I was even taught the Taiji Meihua version of Baht Zhao and can tell you that the 7* and Taiji Meihua versions are quite similar. The Tai Chi version however is much different from the other two and I can find no relation to either.

YM

[draco]

Originally posted by Tainan Mantis
Draco,
Wah Lum also has beng bu. In English it is called Big Mantis.

Tainan,
I have written all the names of my forms I don't believe I have it. Is beng bu the same word as (peng pu)? because I also I also have been practising the 7 star form Peng Pu Chuan. I was not taught regular order of an established system. I will always appreciate your imput.

BeiTangLang,
we should all practise and take notes if needed. After a comfortable number of forms are learned there isn't much need for notes, physical memory becomes established and mental memory sort of fades and becomes balanced. Don Juan always told Carlos Castaneda to throw away his note book, he did not need it. I agree take notes if you need to.

[madmanits]

another suggestion is that you may want to invest in a video camera nothing beats video in jogging the memory !! good luck with your training

[KickingMantis]

Big Mantis is strictly a Wah Lum Tam Tui Pai System form it is not the same as Bung Bo from Chut Sing Tang Lang Chuan.

I would encourage students to have access to videos of forms that they know or is within their schools cirriculum. It can only help and spplement their training.

Our it gives them a different perspective of how other schools perform sets and good for various applications.

However, One should not use videos as an exception to studying under a good qualified instructor. There is so much to discover from the most "simple" techniques in mantis that one can not get from learning a form and a few obvious applicatons from a video.

Taping, taking notes, drawing and routine performance of your sets, drills, exercises and etc., can only assist you in achieving a higher level of performance.

a good habit, is like others have said, learn the material, practice and have some one tape you while doing it immediately after learnig it to ensure accuracy.

[Tainan Mantis]

7* Beng Bu is also known as Yentai Beng Bu and even Da Beng Bu.

Wah Lum Beng Bu is a variation of Laiyang Beng Bu. Sometimes called Hsiao Beng Bu, Mei Hua Beng Bu or old Beng Bu.
The oldest known Beng Bu, Laiyang Beng Bu, is from Liang Hsuehsiang's manuscript. At this time it is the oldest manuscript including Beng Bu Luanjie and Ba Zhou.


Taiji PM of Zhao Zhuhsi also does Yentai Beng Bu, but it shares moves with the WL version and also the 7* version.

Some of the techniques that look completely unrelated are actually the same technique. This isn't apparant unless you learn the partner of both forms and make comparisons.

Laiyang and Wah Lum Beng Bu are both solo forms only.
Used as a base for drills using PM principles.