6 years of kung fu and wants to open up a school

[pak_hok]

I would just like to know what you guys think of this situation
I know a guy who has been training with us for about 6 years and wants to open up a kung fu school in Pak Hok he trains about 3 days a week for the first 5 years took about a year off and now he thinks he is qualified to open up a kung fu school because recently he spent 5 to 6 months training intensely in hong kong with another sifu. What bugs me about this guy is that recently he said to me that he is better than these two brothers who have been training in kung fu with us for the last 14 years he reckons he is king of every thing his technique is sloppy and when he does his forms he looks like he is having an epileptic fit i dont want to be mean to this guy but i would like to know your opinions on this and "do you think lets just say 6 years of moderate training qualifies you to open up a school in tibetan pak hok" there are guys who have been training with us for over 25 years they have the best form in the kwoon and even they dont want to open up a school. Further more this guys wonders why the entire club dislike him except for a few people I am trying to be nice i would like to know just from a general assumption from you guys whether or not you think training for six years makes you qualified also how do i tell this guy nicely discourage this person from opening up a school that will ruin the Pak Hok name that Chan Hak Fu has work hard to create, personally i have asked a few sihings about this and they say that he is not even qualified to teach anything let alone instruct, i dont want to hurt his feelings but i am also worried about my style of kung fu becoming a mcdojo.
Thank you for your opinions

[wushu chik]

Just let him do what he wants. You're not going to deter him from doing it anyway!! He'll either make it, or fall on his face! And, if you know what you're doing isn't "McDojofied", then it's all good. One rotten apple doesn't necessarily spoil the whole basket!!

~Wen~

[David Jamieson]

you come across as just a little bit jealous ph.

wushu chik, your post makes sense.

Let the guy try, make it or break it. it's not your call ph.

peace

[neptunesfall]

one bad apple CAN ruin the bunch.
stop and think about the reactions to kung fu after the first few UFC's. sure you can say "that wasn't even my style of kung fu" or "that guys kung fu was crap". i say it doesn't matter. they were representative of the kung fu community. just as royce and the gracies were representative of the BJJ community.
if this man, with his substandard training and understanding of kung fu becomes a representative of the KF community (and by opening a school and becoming a self proclaimed sifu, he WILL be representative of us), it adds another drop in the bucket.
if you were CEO of a large corporation, would you send an undereducated shipping clerk to represent your company in an international trade meeting?
i think this man is nothing but a servant to his delusional ego and should not open a school.

[David Jamieson]

neptunesfall, you come to a conclusion from only what one party has to say about it?

This is reactionary imo.

who's to say he is truly "bad" at what he does? There are plenty of unskilled people out there representing all martial arts. from bjj to kungfu.

people who go on and on about fake wrestling and how it sucks faiol to see the incredble skill of these entertainers and the hard work they do to entertain us.

The ufc and nhb are a measure of nothing beyond those and only those who participate in it.

peace

[Royal Dragon]

Hello,
You know, some people are way better at teaching this stuff than actually doing it. I count myself in those numbers. BUT, he really has to have an understanding of it to teach it first.

Also, teaching can be on a number of diffferent levels. For me, I don't feel qualified to teach a true hard core traditional Tai Tzu class, let alone run a Tai Tzu school. BUT, I am more than qualifid to run a school desiged for the mainstream Joe who wants to come in and learn as a recreational activity.

For me, since I am planning on teaching on a volume basis, I will undoubtedly run into students who are not happy with the comercial setting I am running. For those few, I plan to pass them on to Golden Mountain Kung Fu as it is close enough to where I will be teaching for those students to seek instruction. This is untill I myself am qualified to run a Traditional Tai Tzu class myself. In which case I'll funnel those students into that.

Basically, I will be useing the comercial program to farm for talent that will then be passed of to Golden Mountain untill I am qualified to do it myself.

In the end, I think this is a good way to do it as I will have the power to expose alot of the community to Chinese Shaolin Kung Fu, and Golden Mountain has the ability to gte them into the deeper more traditional aspects of the art. They only want a small number of dedicated students anyway, so I would be helping them out and educating the public at the same time.

If your friend does what I am going to do, then I don't see a problem. HOWEVER, if he is promoting himself as the do all end all of your style, or is claimimng to be much more than he is, then he's a fraud.

[HuangKaiVun]

Either the guy can do kung fu, or he can't.

Let his paying clients be the judge of that.

[Radhnoti]

Seems to me the question of his qualifications is up to your sifu. If your sifu oks it, THEN he's a representative of your style.

[dezhen2001]

First of all i would say its not neccesarily the years training that mean anything, over a certain minimum of course it depends a lot on the student just as much as the sifu...

But from what you have said (1 side of the story) it seems he is rushing to teach... but for what ends? Cash? a 'name'? truly to spread his love of the skill? if it's one of the 1st 2, then they come when u understand the skill and have the third option. As well as your Sifus permission and blessing.

if you go it alone then u usually cut off ties with the Sifu and even Sigung etc. then you have no experience after yourself to fall back on... that can be problematic in the future if you don't have as much skill as u thought.

it seems like a tough position for him, you and your sifu
good luck anyway!

dawood

[andoi]

hmmm this could be trouble
but did he really say that he was better than other bros(could you pm me and let me know who they are) and was it just between the two of you or were there other students present??

[WinterPalm]

What does you sifu think. I believe that ultimately it is up to the sifu to grant you the level of teacher, is it not?

[dedalus]

Hey Guohuen, by the time he trains-up some students to his current level he *will * have 10+ years experience!

I think its fine for people to teach when they feel ready for it. For one thing it is important to teach for your own martial development, and if students aren't happy they can always go elsewhere. I think it is also worth remembering that many great martial artists have been taught their art exceptionally well by senior students rather than their masters (perhaps its even the general rule).

Every case is a little bit different. I agree with the majority view that there's nothing intrinsically wrong with teaching after 5-6 years training (especially if you recognise that you're still a learner yourself), but of course Pak Hok has the advantage of actually knowing this dude.

Perhaps his motivation is the key point.

[pak_hok]

I think the problem with him is that his confidence outweighs his ability, my personal worry is that my style of kung fu will become mcdojofied and that is it, nothing else, and Kung lek i am not jealous why would i be jealous? i had a conversation with a couple of my elder sihings about it they say that there is no way he is qualified, but the dilemma lies in this he has two sifu's in the style he says that one says its ok, but i am one hundred percent certain the other would say "no" that is why he has not asked that sifu i've asked quite a few people in my Mu kwoon about it and every one i have asked said the same thing he is not qualified. So what should i do? i dont know and neptunesfall i agree with you one hundred percent when fred ettish fought johnny rhodes in ufc 2 he tainted, (unintentionally) every bodys out look on traditional martial arts. You know what i'll just mind my own business, if he wants to open up a kung fu studio with out an overwheliming approval of the people from his first Mu gwoon than that would be it, maybe he can teach maybe he cant i dont know, i dont care i just dont want the schools reputation being ruined that is it.

[SevenStar]

"I think the problem with him is that his confidence outweighs his ability"

That's not really your decision to make.

"my personal worry is that my style of kung fu will become mcdojofied and that is it, nothing else"

You don't know that it hasn't been already, somewhere. Just worry about your specific school. Where would the hard core tai chi players be if they spent all their time trying to keep the hippie schools in line?

[Crimson Phoenix]

pak hok, every kwoon has these types of people...people who want to run when they barely mastered walking, and who are trying to teach everybody to walk after...
Just let them do what they want, it won't change anything to your own progression. Don't lose time arguing or reacting or whatever.