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Thread: Need help with fighting

  1. #1
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    Need help with fighting

    I've been taking Hung gar for about 10 months now and I've learned a lot of the basics but I'm having trouble applying them while I am sparring. I feel like I haven't progressed since I started, is that a bad sign? Are there any tips to improve my fighting? Are there any special drills or forms to help me become a better fighter?

  2. #2
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    Stance more.
    Forms more.
    Sparr more.
    Ask questions more.
    strike!

  3. #3
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    Thumbs up

    Those things will NOT make you a better fighter. Only fighting will.

    You can train the things you will use or have during a fight, such as your mind/body/spirit, to fight better you need to fight. Doing stance will make your stance better, doing forms makes your forms better, and sparring makes you better at sparring, none of them directly translate to fighting ability.

    You will probably always feel as if there is still something to improve (sometimes greatly) upon, because there always is and will be.
    strike!

  4. #4
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    Hmmmm

    Not sure I totally agree with Yenhoi on this. This is just my opinion though. One thing commonly said by martial arts players that have been practicing for 20-30+ years is that "many paths lead up the same mountian" Ie: Practicing a hard art leads to softness, practicing a softer art adds in the hard aspects later, etc. Forms, stancework, fighting, developing your senses, relaxation, eyes, and many other things all manifest in how you move, think and feel when you fight. My best advice to ANY martial artist including myself, is to practice the BASICS. You most likely will never reach a point where you are not practicing them in fact, and they will always involve and help you build a strong personal style up from them. In fact arts like Hsing I and other internals spend much of their time just standing in one stance, yet this improves MANY things relating to their styles. So to put it bluntly..practice practice practice, and always reevaluate what you already know when you learn something new.
    -Golden Arms-

  5. #5
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    You will get worse before you get better.

    Every individual possesses some instinctual fighting ability. When you start learning a MA you essentially erase that instinct and all the bad habits that go along with it that would limit your potential as a fighter. There will be a time when you realize your old way of fighting/moving was limiting/ineffective and you "try" to use your new techniques/ways of moving. However, you have not yet " mastered" the new methods so they feel awkward. Continue to persevere and train hard and you will make it through this period. The techniques you are learning will become so ingrained in you that they will become your instinctual way to fighting/moving. Then you can use them effectively in real combat. This is called the "no mind."

    There have been time in sparring when I have used technique almost directly from forms and I didn't even realize it until afterwards and I analzyed what I did.

    Hung Ga is an awesome system. If you have a qualified teacher and are dedicated you can reach a very high level of achievement and fighting ability in this art.

  6. #6
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    Good Point Fu Pow, Its a nice feeling to not have any idea what you are going to do and then to see something you may not have even ever thought of conciously as a certain application just pop out of you when you think about it later.
    -Golden Arms-

  7. #7
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    Wow thanks for all your help. Right now I'm working on two man drills a lot, like someone throws a punch and I do such and such technique until I get familiar with it and then I move on. My instructor says that one day everything will "click" and my fighting will be much better. We spar about one a week for about 2 hours, is that enough pratice? Thanks again for all your help =).

  8. #8
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    Practice, practice, practice, practice.

    Practice your techniques.
    Practice your forms.
    Practice your partner work.
    Practice your sparring.

    It sounds a lot simpler than it is!
    Adam Stanecki - Practitioner of common sense.

    "Think for yourself. Question authority." - Timothy Leary

    Fluid Fitness - www.fluidfitness.com.au
    Dominance Mixed Martial Arts - www.dominance.com.au

  9. #9
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    Nice post Fu-Pow.
    " Better to be a warrior in the garden than a gardner at war."
    "Ni hao darlins!" - wujidude
    "I just believe that qi is real and good body mechanics have been masquerading as internal power for too long." - omarthefish

  10. #10
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    Work on your basics homey.
    IXIJoeKaveyIXI

    If Wing Chun was a man, he would be The Man...

  11. #11
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    In Hung Ga, one must know his applications.

    Take the opening Hung Ga salute for instance. It can be many things:

    1) grab the guy, knee to the groin
    2) step in, reverse punch
    3) grab head, apply knuckle to temple
    4) grab shoulders, bite the opponent
    5) parry opponent's lead hand, strike armpit or head
    6) block incoming strike with either arm or leg
    7) forward choke
    9) "ready" position for combat
    10) other moves - make them up as you go along

    When doing the form alone, one must imagine doing it on an opponent - and then imagine it being done to oneself.

    Knowing the counter is just as important as knowing the move.

  12. #12
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    WOW!!!
    Now you're a Hung Gar sifu Huang?
    After only one lesson?

    Either you've got the hugest learning curve EVER or you'r the biggest Hungabee I've ever seen...

    "10) other moves - make them up as you go along"
    hmmmm... your normal M.O. huh Huang?

    I woulda expected telling the kid to train what he learns in class, outta class a lot; or bugging his sifu with questions on what he should/needs to work on..... but NOT trying to teach the kid hung gar appz....BOLD...

  13. #13
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    So Nick, my boy, when are we going to fight?

    As always, you're still deathly afraid to face me. Where's your contact information so that I can demonstrate the above moves on you?

    My door remains open to you, and I'd love to challenge you in Hawaii.

    Who is your sifu anyway, Nick? I want to have a long hard talk with him.

    And while you're at it, why don't you tell us why the moves I posted above WOULDN'T work?

  14. #14
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    Guohen,

    ARE YOU NUTS ! ? TIT SIN KUEN ? ! ?

    The guy said he's only been at this for about 10 months. Tit Sin Kuen is for, like, after about 10 years maybe.

    Huangkaivun,

    I have serious reservations about the apllicability of that salute for any of the uses you mentioned except for number 5 and even for number five it's only o.k. Mainly it's just a salute. I do like the block and punch idea but mostly just in principle.

    1) grab the guy, knee to the groin - twist stance ---> hanging stance. Where's the knee?

    2) step in, reverse punch ---> maybee if you interpret 'reverse punch very liberally. There's no bow stance so I see no reverse punch.

    3) grab head, apply knuckle to temple ---> has posibilities but it's really a stretch to turn that first block into a grab. . . on second thought , what the hell.

    4) grab shoulders, bite the opponent ---> please don't include biting as an actual technique.

    5) parry opponent's lead hand, strike armpit or head ---> this is the one i like . . . sort of.

    6) block incoming strike with either arm or leg ---> not clear how this is different from number 5. Actually number 2 maybe should get lumped in with number 5 as if you accept that punch as a reverse punch then the two tyechniques are the same.

    7) forward choke ---> What ? How? What are you talking about?

    9) "ready" position for combat ---> either you mean this is just a salute or your nuts.

    10) other moves - make them up as you go along ---> If this is what you come up with stay away from making up your own moves.

    I do give points for creativity and using your imagination during practice.



    Back on topic:

    At ten months I wouldn't worry about sparring much. Just get the stances and basic techniques down. The two person sets will come later and then sparring. There is a logical progression to be followed.

    1. solo forms - creating the raw materials. gives you a vocabulary.
    2. 2 person forms - linckages, applications, reactions, timing etc.
    3. free sparring.

    There are combos to be drilled and other exercises but each in it's own time. Don't get ahead of yourself. You may learn to fight quicker but it won't be Hung-gar. If you don't have the patience, you are better of going to a kickboxiong gym where you can start sparring from the get-go.

  15. #15
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    omarthefish, you're obviously a lineage and categories guy.

    Me, I was trained Hung Ga as a FIGHTER. And this is how I fight using the salute:


    1) The traditional Hung Ga salute is done on one leg. The OTHER leg, bent, can be a kick or a knee.

    2) Typically, the opening salute is done with a fist in one hand with an open palm in the other. The open palm can be used to target or parry the opponent, the fist can be used to strike. This is a great way to get by a guy's guard, and styles like Wing Chun and Hsing Yi (among others) use this as well.

    3) When you are grappling, particularly in close quarters or on the ground, often the opponent's head is well within your reach. By focusing a single knuckle on the fist hand, you can attack the temple and injure the temporal artery. This technique works well in headlock as well (head noogie).

    4) What is this "biting is not an actual technique" stuff? Some guy trying to kill you attacks, you BITE HIM. This is one of the most effective self-defense techniques there is. Try telling that to any woman who successfully used a bite to extricate herself from a would-be rapist - she'll bite YOU. Or try telling it to Paul Vunak, who put the bite on his "Street Safe" video.

    6) Why should you even care? In a real sparring situation, you don't even have time to think through this stuff. You just DO IT and that's that.

    7) When astride an opponent (you're in the "mount" position), you can use the opponent's collar to choke him. The fist holds the lapel and the other arm lends either support or guards the choker. The Gracies use this move as well, though they use more of an X-motion.

    9) In old China, this stance was the way for saluting to opponents in a way that they couldn't sucker punch you. In the 21st century, it's typical for a guy to put more weight on one leg and hold his hands at chest level. It doesn't look exactly like the form, but only nonfighters would be dumb enough to fight EXACTLY like the form prescribes.

    10) You're right. I ought to stay away from making these moves. Heaven forbid I pull them on some guy trying to take me out - I might HURT HIM.


    You talk, I spar. And that's that.

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