Fu-Jow Pai

[Enlightment]

Matrix, What do you mean "the" school? My sifu only has one school. Perhaps you are referring to one of the Tai Mantis branches in Michigan? What website?

[matrixninja]

Thats is what i was refering to.

[Enlightment]

We do have a Tai Mantis branch in Michigan under sifu Lay Fuy Yen. Whereabouts in Michigan, I do not know. What webpage are you talking about?

[Enlightment]

We do have a school in Taylor, Michigan. I just checked. I don't know how much you will learn in just 7 months but you can try it.

[matrixninja]

COULD you ask you SIFU WHERE it's at in TayloR mi.

[Enlightment]

I'm sorry but we are very busy. Sifu doesn't have that information readily available.

[matrixninja]

Thanks anyway.

[Enlightment]

For anyone who doesn't know anything about Fu Jow Pai, it was brought to the United States by Sifu Wong Moon Toy who learned it from the founder Wong Bil Hong. Wong Bil Hong studied Hung Gar from Wong Fei Hong before creating Fu Jow Pai. The 2 styles are somewhat similar but still different.

[loquito]

Enlightment,

Do you have any insight what the differences are between the two styles, Fu-Jow Pai and Hung Gar?

Regards,
loquito

[Enlightment]

From the one form that I know, there seems to be more techniques using the tiger claw. Some of the movements in the form come straight out of Hung Gar. I only know one form so I don't want to say the wrong thing and give the wrong impression.

I actually thought that Fu Jow Pai was created from Hark Fu Moon, as opposed to Hung Gar. It is taught along with Hung Gar because of Wong Fai Hung. Hark Fu Moon is older than Hung Gar. I study all three. This is something I've been pestering my sifu about lately. By the way, my kwoon is in Az. I don't know if that's close enough for you to be interested.

[loquito]

Friends,

This is paraphrased from Fu-Jow Pai history:

Wong Bil Hong, circa 1840s, was a master of Hung Gar. He learned Hung Gar from Wong Fay Hong.

During a duel w/another master in the court yard of the Hoy Hong Temple, Wong Bil Hong and his opponent were thrown apart by an elder monk, who invited them to discuss their differences. They settled their differences and then both men asked to learn the old monk's art, Hark Fu Moon or Black Tiger.

Wong Bil Hong mastered the system and taught it to two people: his manservant and his nephew, Wong Moon Toy. Wong Bil Hong renamed the system "Fu-Jow Pai of the Hoy Hong Temple" in honor of the monk.

Soon after the deaths of Wong Bil Hong and the maservant died circa 1934, Wong Moon Toy came to NY and opened up shop teaching Hung Gar and Mi Ching I and only taught a selected few Fu-Jow Pai.

Wong Moon Toy died in 1960 and his closed door disciples of Fu-Jow Pai decided to open the door to the public in the late 60's early 70's, with Wai Hong as Grandmaster and leading the helm today.

Now, Wong Moon Toy learned Hung Gar and Mi Chung I first. Wong Bil Hong also began with Hung Gar. As a result, there are many elements of Hung Gar in Fu-Jow as well as some Mi Chung I. Forms such as Fu-Hawk Kuen, Gung Gi Fu-Fukien and Iron Thread are common staples in the Fu-Jow form arsenal.

Fu-Jow Pai and Hark Fu are one in the same. If you learn Fu-Jow you are learning Black Tiger. Hung Gar is a close cousin to, but a different style to Fu-Jow. Fu-Jow Pai was not created from Hung Gar.

And there are interesting questions regarding the history of Fu-Jow. No one has ever found if the other Master that dueled with Wong Bil Hong and later learned Hark Fu Moon left disciples. It seems apparent that they would have surfaced over the years but have not. Thus, Grand Master Wai-Hong and the other disciples of the Grand Master Wong Moon Toy, are the sole heirs, (along w/their students) to Fu-Jow Pai/Hark Fu Moon.

I hope this is clear.

Tigerlilly, where in Arizona is your Kwoon and with whom did your sifu learn Fu-Jow Pai?

Respect,
loquito

[MoQ]

There's abit of Fu Jow stuff going in the Kung Fu Forum under the Bo Law thread...

Hi...My kwoon is in Tucson, Az My Si Gung is Don Hinzman. He studied with Dave Kovar, from age 6 to age 15. He then went on to study Judo with Gene LaBelle for 5 years. Don was given his Master's from Gene last July when he found out that Don was made Si Gung. He has had his own kwoon for 7 years now. Wai Hong is who taught Dave Kovar. Wai Hong knows my Sifu if you want to ask about him or Kovar for that matter. I hear Kovar no longer teaches Hung Gar!!! Sold out!! Or I would recommend him.

[This message has been edited by tigerlilly (edited 07-18-2000).]

[KrAzy FiLiPino]

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[This message has been edited by KrAzy FiLiPino (edited 07-18-2000).]