Too much fighting in stick fighting?

[Black Jack]

Whats up guys,

Knife,

I tend to believe that any stout impact weapon "starting" about 22 inches in length will do for two handed stick work. You could do that with a large mag lite, broken towel rack, shovel handle, standard rattan stick, a blackthorn walking stick, umbrella, crooked cane, hardwood cudgel, lathi, livestock/pig stick, a jo....whatever. Some dynamics may change but the basic principles are still there.

I believe in the power game with sticks, the volume one dog brothers "power" tape is a good example of this aspect of stickplay, I believe the two-handed methods fit deeply within this factor, though there is always a trade off between one hand handed operations and double handed moves.

That trade off being aspects like power (two handed more power), commitment (two handed swings use more commitment than lighter and faster sticks) and recovery time (which is all equal to the attributes and skills of the player as well as the stick used), a bigger stick swing works different with momentum and centrifigal force, depending on how heavy you chamber the weapon and let it fly.

Their is more to do with two-handed work than just swings though, depending on if you are using a short end or long end method, my basic stuff consists of four types of strikes when I have two hands on the stick.

1. Thrust/Poke- This is the bread and butter strike. Drive the point/small end of the stick into an exposed target with full forward drive. This also works very well with one hand.

2. Bar Smash- Using full power of the arms and shoulders you use the middle of the impact weapon to smash the target. Up under the chin, down onto the nose, into the throat or the forehead. You get the idea.

3. Swings- Chambered hybrid baseball swings-the ****her you go back you get the idea.

4. Strokes- As in butt strokes. Good for close in work.

Add in some basic combat chokes and takedowns and you have it.

What is important to me though is that I can change my grip from one handed to two handed use. If I want to work really up close I can go to a short end method-picture a reverse knife grip and as an example hit him with a up swing into the neck area or grab onto his clothes with my free hand to help ride him and start to thrust with the small end into his solar plexius and "then" when the opportunity arises whip the stick into my free hand for a bar smash under the chin.

In the sparring game would a fighter be overrun by just using a two handed method. I would say it has to do with the not just the size of the stick but the players involved. IMHO it is about who sets and maintains the range and pace that often wins. Pure out aggression is a key element. Kinda like the Saxon housecarls who fought off norman knights with their very heavy two handed war axes.

I have had both ups and downs in sparring as for one thing I have to be very-very carefull about thrusting the tip of a hardwood cane into another human being. It does not work like that. There is alot of pounds per squre inch and you have to moderate and pull your thrusts. IMHO it is better used in contact scenrio stroke/drills even a foam stick hurts like a mother, these help to develop aggression, follow through and the grove of just being ballistic in your attacks and on to use equipment striking drills for developing power.

Hope I made any sense.

[yenhoi]

Bruises from pokes heal slower then bruises from strokes.



I really dislike getting hit by sticks.

[myosimka]

Every method of training has its limitations and it's important to recognize them and compensate. Clearly extensive stick dueling is a problem and produces alot of the flicky sort of handwork that can be a problem. I have an obvious bias but it seems many stick styles are way too heavy on wrist and arm power and understate hips and footwork as a result they get good speed but not power.
And anybody who has felt there arm collapse when they tried to stop a good lobtek knows the benefits of power. That being said, if you are using sticks to simulate bladed weapons then the need for speed and evasion seems to dominate over power. (Still think that's going to be more about footwork than wrists but like I said, I have a bias.) I've seen guys that made the finesse game work, rarer than the power but still happens.

Rogue,
Can't say what the shortcomings were and strengths of his approach as I didn't see it but I would hesitate to throw everything out. I have pretty quick hands and fight standing pretty well. Losing to any given guy doesn't change that. They may just be better. There may be an iherent issue in your training but there may not.

There is a definite flavor to many DB guys. And they definitely know their stuff. My only complaint is they seem to expose their heads an awful lot and rely on headgear, but then I only know a few candidates.

Wow, this was a directionless ramble!! Time to hit the hay.

[thekuntawman]

you should look for a philippine martial arts teacher who actually did some fighitng. most of the teachers here in the US learned in seminars, and they do almost none at all fighitng in those seminars. so now, you have a bunch of teachers with certificates, "sound lineage" good reputation becuase of the organization style and teacher they come from, but he cant fight because nobody taught him how. now he is teaching, and what can he show to you? drills, storys and promisings that these drills will make you a great fighter.

there aint to many authentic, deserving teachers around but you can find them if you look. the seminar is the same as "10 easy lessons" i dont care how much reputation they got.

we have a saying, that fighting ability and effectiveness can only be proven not demonstrated. and another is the true reputation of a fighter is built by your enemies not your friends. the seminar people know nothing about that.