Shaolin Stances

[Buddha's Hand]

I don't know if this topic has been discussed here before, and if so, my apologies...

Lately I've been trying to compare the style I'm currently learning (Southern Shaolin Tiger Style) with other kung fu styles who come a more or less direct line from the Shaolin Temple(s).

Seems that we have a higher number of stances and some of them even seem different, even though they re supposed to have the same origin.

For example, I saw in the article reposted at http://www.shaolinwolf.com/morechitr...r/stances1.htm
some of the stance work taught at the USA Shaolin Temple.

By comparison, in our bow & arrow and tiger crouching stances, the front foot is curved inside, not straight out, and the front knee is bent so that the toes are "covered" by the knee to protect the foot. (the same principle applies to the horse stance, ie feet parallel and forward, not angled outwards)

Are there other styles out there that have these kinds of differences?

[David Jamieson]

stances in shaolin kungfu have the same framework across the board.

how that translates to your body will vary slightly.

twist horse for instance has different heights, crouching tiger also has different heights as does ma bu(horse), bow and arrow etc etc.

The bow stance is a good example because it is trained long and deep, but used shorter and higher.

You will find more similarity than differences as time passes and you get more practice and application in.

peace

[Buddha's Hand]

I understand your points KL, but since there isn't a great variety of kungfu styles in my area, and not too many other schools, demonstrations and competitions are rare...

I have to rely mostly on what I see on video, in magazines or on the internet to get a sense of what the other kungfu styles are like.

But even then it seems that most sources of information don't go very deep (probably so hacks don't ripoff the techniques?), and unless you have a very advanced knowledge of martial body mechanics, photo by photo pictorials of kungfu or tai chi forms are impossible to understand when no explanation is given about the use of a stance with a particular hand movement from one transition to another...

I wish I had an unlimited budget to travel far and see what else is out there...

But don't get me wrong, I'm quite satisfied with my Sifu's teachings! I'm just curious to see what else is out there.

[psycho monk]

LOL, ha ha ha, sounds like my psycho sense is telling me that these are two are just 2 more of the countless Shaolin Tiger Claw wannabes. Neither of you has ever even seen real Tiger Claw Go watch some Shaw Brothers Flick.

[Buddha's Hand]

"Psycho sense" indeed.

I practice Traditional Southern Shaolin Tiger style.

[GeneChing]

The Shaolin name encompasses a lot of styles. Shaolinwolf.com is Shi Yanming's site which focuses on Songshan Shaolin. There you have two major delineations, traditional and modern. You might check out a great interview with monk Shi Xinghao by Dieter Wagner in our Shaolin special back issue http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/maga...hp?article=144 . You might also check out an archive ezine articl I did about two of the major Shaolin variations in the west - Songshan vs. Bak Sil Lum - http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/ezin...hp?article=158 . BSL's stances are slightly different from either Songshan school, but closer to it's traditional one. In short, Shaolin is a massive concept, so there are many takes on how to stand.

[psycho monk]

Traditional , that word is used loosely now and days let me be more specific i mean authentic as in certified and not just some rejects who have never been authorized.

[David Jamieson]

psycho monk -

get over yourself, your assumptiveness makes you appear to be the petty one.

I suppose you are able to cast the magic light on thousands of years of developed martial arts with your few years tripping around the sun?

Keeping an open mind, and trying a few things will inevitably help you form a stronger opinion and knowledge base of anything.

peace

[Buddha's Hand]

Well traditional is as traditional does.

Check out my club's website if you want, though for "our history" link, you have to scroll down to about half the story, where the monks flee to Hainan Island. That's where our specific lineage starts.

www.ottawakungfu.comhttp://www.ottawakungfu.com

I practice at least 5 times a week on most weeks, during classes and on my own.

[Brad]

By comparison, in our bow & arrow and tiger crouching stances, the front foot is curved inside, not straight out, and the front knee is bent so that the toes are "covered" by the knee to protect the foot. (the same principle applies to the horse stance, ie feet parallel and forward, not angled outwards)

Are there other styles out there that have these kinds of differences?

I learned a Chung-I-Chuan form from a Hung Gar teacher and the bow stance was dome like this. I've also noticed Wu-Tan Baji does the same thing. I don't know what a crouching tiger stance is Most of what I've tried so far though(Changquan, Mizongquan, Huo style Bajiquan, Taijiquan) the foot is straight forward. Like some have said there's lots of little variations. I don't think either way is wrong unless the knee goes past the toes or not as far as the heel. I suppose there could be exceptions though.

Traditional , that word is used loosely now and days let me be more specific i mean authentic as in certified and not just some rejects who have never been authorized.

Actually, that's not very specific at all since there's no one to certify whether a style is authentic or not. Unless of course you're talking about the Chinese government. And after seeing the recent requirements/changes they've made to my favorite sport, it's hard to take their "authorization" too seriously anymore

[psycho monk]

You Tiger Claw rejects may say what you want but you only fool yourselves.

to Kung Lek ,

You petty child you have read one to many books and are only kidding yourself. Your paper tiger style Fools no one but you and your paycheck.

[David Jamieson]

pm-

why don't you come up and see me some time cutey


maybe you could peel me a grape.

peace

[psycho monk]

ok Kung Pow first of all look at yourself your not chinese , so please use an american name second u called me cutey thanks my girl thinks so too but i dont go your way and third NYC is the capital of the world why dont u come see me so i can teach u how to peel grapes by the way since you read a lot of books try reading little red riding hood its aged towards 4 to 6 year olds thats right up ur alley dave.

[David Jamieson]

I'm not american either...hmmmm.

what shall i call myself? dave will do i guess, but this is a kung fu board after all. you can call me what you like

I read little red riding hood, it's a good morality tale for people of all ages. reading between the lines will help you to understand.

and yes, I like to read about kung fu, especially bonafide training manuals. I like to learn from videos too! imagine if the shaolin had videos instead of books so long ago? imagine how many would be practicing kungfu today!

imagine if there were more people who really knew that kungfu is a personal experience that is available for anyone with the determination to get better at it?

that would be a nice world to live in wouldn't it.

p.s I'm married and was only insulting you for being such a loudmouth. I gotta get my cheap shots out every now and then too.

otherwise

peace

[psycho monk]

No hard feelings Kung Pow , as long as you understand where im coming from plus whats a hard day of training kung fu without something to laugh about at the end of the day.

peace