Chu Sau Lei Chi Sau Faat

[burnsypoo]

Originally posted by reneritchie
Weird, C.a.m.e.r.o.n is being auto censored??

you sick pig.
:P

[Mckind13]

Hey Dogz

FInals are almost over so I will post the next key word tonight...maybe.

David

[Mckind13]

Thanks for the patience

Jiu Fa - common methods of Gor Sao (crossing hands) such as Tan Da, Pak Da, Lop Da, etc. in singular and combination. Typically, it is a technician's level of training.

Jiu Fa is simple. It is the use of specific techniques within the framework of Chi Sao.

Specifically, the Gor Sao techniques ar single or linked applications against your partner.

These techniques can be used in free practice
they can be drilled over and over to perfect timing, positioning and proper application of structure
specific techniques can be applied against specific attacks or against steadily more resistant partners.

Once the basics of Jiu Fa are understood, then we can link them the other methods. (i.e. Tan Da linked with the idea of jeet or with pressing drawing, sinking or floating.)

Thanks

David

[PaulH]

David,

Thanks again for your input. The Jiu fa that you wrote seems to be a very systematic, modular, controlled and structured approach to learning combat. In the fight it often has many other unknown variables from complex psychology mindset to more chaotic, fluctuating, dynamic, and unpreditable factors. If the goal is to maximize the benefits of winning in an actual fight, would it not be better to learn just the bare bone mechanics of the techniques and spend the majority of time testing the techniques against non WC partners where they can feed you real live energy of boxers, MT, BJJ, or street fighters? Your body will learn how to adapt more naturally. Or the Jiu Fa above already incorporate what I just write here?

Regards,

[Mckind13]

You have a very good point but

There is always a but!

(paul wrote) The Jiu fa that you wrote seems to be a very systematic, modular, controlled and structured approach to learning combat

It is and it is dynamic as well.
If we perfect a Tan Da against X% of resistance and increase it over time, add additional variables then this is an excellent method for a person to really get a technique.

(Paul H) In the fight it often has many other unknown variables from complex psychology mindset to more chaotic, fluctuating, dynamic, and unpredictable factors.

You have a very good point again, but as you have seen with the other Fa (methods) and as my favorite Bruce Lee shirt says, “don’t sweat the techniques!”
Jiu Fa/Gor Sou is for perfecting technical ability but really makes a difference in our training when we use it to understand three things. Proper timing of a technique, proper position in relation to an opponent, and proper use of structure (using ours, breaking theirs). When we have these three and technically accurate techniques then we can flow and deal with other systems and different methods of application others might use.


(Paul H) If the goal is to maximize the benefits of winning in an actual fight, would it not be better to learn just the bare bone mechanics of the techniques and spend the majority of time testing the techniques against non WC partners where they can feed you real live energy of boxers, MT, BJJ, or street fighters?

Hi Paul, sounds like the topic for another thread! The goal is two fold. Maximize efficiency and train good Wing Chun fundamentals. Even Boxers and BJJ guys do not spend a great deal of there time ‘sparring’. There are drills, exercises, functional training from within the framework of the fight (mock sparring or light sparring) and when they do go they do not go 100% all the time. To answer your question

…Master Wing Chun, be aware of how other systems operate and share/workout with as many of these arts as possible….

Just learning the bare bones and going for it stunts your learning curve and makes you sloppy!!!

(Paul H)Your body will learn how to adapt more naturally. Or the Jiu Fa above already incorporate what I just write here?

Being good helps you adapt so you want to train the basics really well, get the fundamentals down and train free form too. And Yes Jiu Fa and the Chi Sau Lei Chi Sau Fa does incorporate allot of this.

Thanks and night!

David

[PaulH]

Since we are still lingers on the Yiu Fa, I wonder if you can comment also on the Pak Da. Some WC people I know has a scary shocking power when they pak. It will hurl you backward on impact if you are not used to it. Do you practice this kind of energy and how do you train this? I think Terence was mentioning this kind of energy on some other threads earlier.

Regards,

[Mckind13]

Yes, we train it.

How do you develop it

train structure, know how to break structure

Thanks

David

[Mckind13]

Hi all...

Just so you don't think I am leaving you all high and dry I will comment on this guy tonight when I get home.

Sim Fa - Methods of evasion with steps, body displacement, dodging, or hand movement, but still being close enough to continue. There are two major methods: using the torso to evade (small evasion) or using steps to evade (large evasion).


See you all tonight

David

[PaulH]

Hey David et al,

It is written that good threads don't die, they just fade away. Come back when you can. Just to say that I miss your refreshing perspective and insight on this thoughtful discussion of WC concepts.

Regards,

[Mckind13]

Sim Fa - Methods of evasion with steps, body displacement, dodging, or hand movement, but still being close enough to continue. There are two major methods: using the torso to evade (small evasion) or using steps to evade (large evasion).

Sorry for the Pause!

Sim Fa is often easier experienced then talked about.

As a method of evasion we could look at it from evading the situation all together to getting out of the way of a strike.

From the point of view of Chi Sau, it seems to me that we could look at it as a matter of degrees and what evasion is and is not.

Stepping back or moving out of range is not technically evasion. It is more removing oneself from the situation at hand.

Evasion is getting out of the way or off the line of attack through motion. Stepping or shifting are very large examples of this. As we improve, we decrease the empty space between the attack and our body so that when we are better we have the option to let an attack slip along the body, maintaining contact without impact. Additionally, rather then just evading, we can guide the hand and body of the opponent with our own as well as evading so that the motions are again smaller.

Thanks

David