Wong Fei Hung

[Laviathan]

Hi,

In the beginning, I checked out a lot of teachers and styles. After a while, I chose Praying Mantis because I felt it suits me better and concentrated on that style.

Shaobeiquan is an awesome style, it is like Long Fist combined with Wing Chun, plus a very fast and agressive fighting approach. But I like Mantis more, because it's more subtle.

Shaobeiquan is quite rare, even in China. It is widely practiced in the North Eastern provinces. But in the rest of China it is almost unknown.

In South Africa there's a Shaobei School run by Master Wang.

Greetings,

Lav

[Eddie]

Lav,
Master Wong Doesnt teach Shaobei chaun (not at first). He starts off with Baji and some Northern Shaolin basics, and then you learn Mantis from Chris (his son). Been asking him about Shao bei chaun, but Chris seems to be very much stuck on Mantis and Sword.

I learned Shao Ding Gan, which is a Northern Shaolin form, and a great form for fighting. More kicking drills than in Choy Lay Fut.

Eddie
Ps- some monks from the shaolin wheel of life is down here in Johannesburg. I might be getting meet them at a private session in this week.

[Laviathan]

Originally posted by Eddie
Master Wong Doesnt teach Shaobei chaun (not at first).
Been asking him about Shao bei chaun, but Chris seems to be very much stuck on Mantis and Sword.
I learned Shao Ding Gan, which is a Northern Shaolin form, and a great form for fighting. More kicking drills than in Choy Lay Fut.

I think with "Shao Ding Gan" you mean Diangangquan (Pointing Hardness Fist)? If I remember correctly, Diangang is a Shaobeiquan Form. Of course, Shaobei literally means Shaolin North Style, so it's the same thing as Northern Shaolin, right?

Anyway, it's funny you mention Choy Lay Fut. When Chris performed his Shaobei forms in Beijing, it really gave me the impression that it is Choy Lay Fut with high stances and lots of kicks. The long arm movements reminded me of Choy Lay Fut punching, while the short hand methods resembled Wing Chun. Together with the aggressive kicks and footwork, it makes a great combination. But of course, my knowledge on Shaobei is very limited. Hope you can enlighten me.

He starts off with Baji and some Northern Shaolin basics, and then you learn Mantis from Chris (his son).

In my opinion, Baji and Mantis contradict each other. They are both great styles, but they cannot be trained together at the same time. So if you're planning to concentrate on Mantis, I would suggest you to stop Baji training for a while. Just my 2 cents though... You might want to discuss this with Chris.

Ps- some monks from the shaolin wheel of life is down here in Johannesburg. I might be getting meet them at a private session in this week.

Enjoy your time and pass my greetings to Chris!

[Eddie]

Lav,

Originally posted by Laviathan
I think with "Shao Ding Gan" you mean Diangangquan (Pointing Hardness Fist)? If I remember correctly, Diangang is a Shaobeiquan Form. Of course, Shaobei literally means Shaolin North Style, so it's the same thing as Northern Shaolin, right?

Shao Ding Gan is the Shaolin form ( I know its even part of the shongshan shaolin curriculum), but of course it has master Wong’s flavour to it. I used to think it was different to the shaobei style, but now Im not sure. Master Wong is famous down here for his diangangquan form, which he performs at most functions and events. It is different to the shao ding gan which I know, but I will ask Chris this week when I see him.

Anyway, it's funny you mention Choy Lay Fut. When Chris performed his Shaobei forms in Beijing, it really gave me the impression that it is Choy Lay Fut with high stances and lots of kicks. The long arm movements reminded me of Choy Lay Fut punching, while the short hand methods resembled Wing Chun. Together with the aggressive kicks and footwork, it makes a great combination. But of course, my knowledge on Shaobei is very limited. Hope you can enlighten me.

You are right, the style Master Wong Teaches is similar to CLF. It uses allot of back fists and even sweeping punches, and one could easily mistake this for “sloppy CLF”, as the power generation and use is different to that of CLF. My Sihing at Master Wongs school started learning CLF with me, and he picks it up very quickly. His only problem at this point is that he is slightly lo loose with his foot work and his body movements, but its difficult to explain. He is also a tongbei student.

In my opinion, Baji and Mantis contradict each other. They are both great styles, but they cannot be trained together at the same time. So if you're planning to concentrate on Mantis, I would suggest you to stop Baji training for a while. Just my 2 cents though... You might want to discuss this with Chris.

I have noticed what you have said, but Its not that big an issue at this moment. Maybe at a later stage, but at this moment Im not to big into power genration etc. As I said, Im doing all this mainly to supplement my CLF. Power generation in CLF is way different to both Baji and taiji mei hua tang lang. But power is not my main stuggle at this point. Im still trying to get my body “loose” enough for the mantis. You move different in TMH Mantis than in CLF (I think you may know what I mean), and I am still trying to get to terms with that. Master Wong wants us to know baji and mantis, maybe later we will get to focus on one. I like them both, and both helped my understanding of CLF.

I like san shou, and I always try to see my kung fu in san shou and fighting. That’s what is important to me. That’s what I like about Master Wong and Chris too. They both into fighting.

Enjoy your time and pass my greetings to Chris!

Will do. He told me a lot about you after I told him we started to correspond. Chris is a very cool guy and a very good friend. Still very young, but he is a great martial artist in hiss own right. I saw him grow up before me during the last 10 years, but I respect him as a senior martial artist and a great teacher. Just never ask him anything about swords and Samurais. That’s his passion, and he can go on about that for days. He love his swords, and that’s one thing he takes extremely serious. He is a warrior, born at the wrong time .

Eddie

[Laviathan]

Originally posted by Eddie
Shao Ding Gan is the Shaolin form ( I know its even part of the shongshan shaolin curriculum), but of course it has master Wong’s flavour to it. I used to think it was different to the shaobei style, but now Im not sure. Master Wong is famous down here for his diangangquan form, which he performs at most functions and events. It is different to the shao ding gan which I know, but I will ask Chris this week when I see him.

Yes, Diangangquan is a great form, and Shaobei is a fascinating style. You are really lucky to be able to learn from Master Wang.

You are right, the style Master Wong Teaches is similar to CLF. It uses allot of back fists and even sweeping punches, and one could easily mistake this for “sloppy CLF”, as the power generation and use is different to that of CLF. My Sihing at Master Wongs school started learning CLF with me, and he picks it up very quickly. His only problem at this point is that he is slightly lo loose with his foot work and his body movements, but its difficult to explain. He is also a tongbei student.

I think I understand. CLF, like Hung Gar and other schools of Southern Boxing, stresses low, firm stances. Master Wang's style places emphasis on rapid footwork. So I think that's the thing your Sihing has problems adapting to. But good CLF should also have loose body movements, so I don't see a problem there.

BTW, I think Tongbei and CLF are a very good match.

I have noticed what you have said, but Its not that big an issue at this moment. Maybe at a later stage, but at this moment Im not to big into power genration etc. As I said, Im doing all this mainly to supplement my CLF. Power generation in CLF is way different to both Baji and taiji mei hua tang lang. But power is not my main stuggle at this point. Im still trying to get my body “loose” enough for the mantis. You move different in TMH Mantis than in CLF (I think you may know what I mean), and I am still trying to get to terms with that. Master Wong wants us to know baji and mantis, maybe later we will get to focus on one. I like them both, and both helped my understanding of CLF.

I like san shou, and I always try to see my kung fu in san shou and fighting. That’s what is important to me. That’s what I like about Master Wong and Chris too. They both into fighting.

Yep, TJMH Tanglang surely has power generation different to CLF. That's why I prefer Mantis above CLF, Shaobei etc. Mantis is very subtle, while CLF and Shaobei are very "Blitzkrieg"-like... It's very powerful of course, but not really my style.

CLF training should give you a good foundation for Taiji Meihua though. Both styles place emphasis on low stances, so it's not very hard to adapt. Hand movements are more different though... I am now teaching my CLF Sidai the Baiyuan Toutao Form, and it's kind of hard for him to execute certain techniques a la Mantis instead of throwing sweeping punches with CLF power.

Will do. He told me a lot about you after I told him we started to correspond. Chris is a very cool guy and a very good friend. Still very young, but he is a great martial artist in hiss own right. I saw him grow up before me during the last 10 years, but I respect him as a senior martial artist and a great teacher. Just never ask him anything about swords and Samurais. That’s his passion, and he can go on about that for days. He love his swords, and that’s one thing he takes extremely serious. He is a warrior, born at the wrong time

Haha, he probably said I was very lazy when it comes to training, right? Now, Chris is one dedicated martial artist. He's also a great guy and a good friend. But I don't know if he's a good teacher though, in the past he was quite impatient when it comes to teaching students, but this has toned down a bit. But anyway, I wish him all the best, and I hope I can see him soon.

And yes, I totally agree with you that he lives in the wrong era... He should have been a swordsman in ancient China or Japan...

But we are really hijacking this thread, so for chit-chat let's stick to email contact from now on.

Greetings,

Lav

[The Whyzyrd]

On behalf of Sifu Yee,

The Wong Fei Hung Museum in Foshan, China will be hosting Wong Fei Hung's 150th Birthday Celebration in August of this year.

If anyone is interested in more information regarding this celebration - please contact Sifu Pedro Yee at:

Yee's Hung Ga International Kung Fu Association
68 Union Avenue
Clifton, New Jersey 07011

Telephone: 973.772.8988

E-mail: pcyee@yeeshungga.com


__________________________________
Sifu David Goldstein
Yee's Hung Ga International Kung Fu Association
Western Monmouth County Branch
Monmouth Road
Cream Ridge, NJ 08514
(201) 679 1646
yeeshungga@optonline.net

[TenTigers]

hmmmm, I'm wondering..what kind of Birthday present should I buy?
He's just so hard to shop for.

[Baritsumaster]

I'm trying to find any information on Wong Fei Hung. Do any of you know if most of the information about him is still orally passed in the schools? Also, does anyone know how to get hold of the old stories in Chinese published in the 1940's.
Another question (so many) is how one can verify if the information on the net or
Wikipedia is viable or suspect?

[GeneChing]

That was our Hung Ga - Wong Fei Hung Collector's Issue.

[Baritsumaster]

Thanks, Gene. That was an awesome issue. Lent it to my sifu...haven't got it back. I may have to buy a back issue.

[GeneChing]

Check out Kungfu's Greatest Movie Hero: The Cinematic Journey of Wong Fei Hung by Gene Ching and Personal Perspective of the Wong Fei Hung Museum by Tim Louie too.

[Baritsumaster]

Your article is very informative, Gene. Thank you.

[Baritsumaster]

Gene,
I've been collecting all online articles I can find on Wong Fei Hung, breaking them apart and comparing them fact by fact. Your article was the most informative and interesting, and contained the most facts. May I ask what sources you were able to access? I was most impressed.
I'm working on a series of short stories featuring WFH for a national mystery magazine, and have already made an in depth study of Canton in the 19th century. If I get 'stumped' by a question, I hope I can ask you to kick it around.

[sanjuro_ronin]

Does anyone actually know what the "no shadow" kick was?
It wasn't obiously what we saw Jet Li do.
I have heard various opinions the two most plasuable ones were:
It was a low line front kick off a hand "feint".
It was a in close front/triangle kick under the opponents field of vision.

[banditshaw]

Does anyone actually know what the "no shadow" kick was?.......

..........It was a low line front kick off a hand "feint".
It was a in close front/triangle kick under the opponents field of vision.

Yeah those are the two common ones I have heard of as well. Maybe some more experienced Hung Ga peeps can chime in on this one.