Shaolin Abbot is an *******!

[8stepsifu]

I'm sure there are very good wushu teachers at shaolin. Too bad the cultural revolution slaughtered most of the good teachers and left a perminent scar on the martial arts. Shaolin was one of the best in it's day. Then the commies got ahold of it's tourist trap potential and now any school that teaches a traditional, complete style (training methods in tact) would be a better place to train. I recently read in an article that their lifestyle was grueling. Not getting fed enough is a symptom of poverty, not good martial arts.
I have lots of respect for traditional kung fu masters, I just think that most of them get the hell out of China as soon as they can. You don't see any Grandmasters outside China rushing to move back now do you?

I think we should trade China David Caradine and transport the Shaolin Temple to somewhere in the Appalatians. Better yet..the Vatican.

[Dragon Warrior]

Anytime I see any of the monks perform anything, whether it be wushu or traditional, it is amazing. They are the best martial artist in the world. Training all day everyday. People love to talk crap about others, ecspecialy when they are as good as the monks.

[Dragon Warrior]

yo who is the sifu at that school self thinking. I would like to go there

[Self-Thinking Follower]

No sifu's at "Gleasons" only ex champs, coaches, trainers and a whole lot of angry, aggressive young men looking to turn that anger into prize fighting money. They've been fighting in the mean streets all their lives and love it. A great deal of talent exsist there. They enjoy "keeping it real".

[dfedorko@mindspring.com]

For what it is worth, I have heard that this abbot was placed into this position by the Communists and also he has no kung fu training. He is not a true abbot. Mr. Ching should know more about the situation since he travels to China so much.

Damian

[dfedorko@mindspring.com]

Don't really know if he is but I have heard from several martial arts circles that the man is a Communist and has no formal kung fu training. Since Mr. Ching has been to China so many times maybe he might be able to enlighten us with the truth as to what is going on in the Shaolin temple.

Damian

[Shaolin]

Poisoned Dharma unless you know the Abbot personaly who are you to judge, who are any of us to judge anyone?

[dfedorko@mindspring.com]

I here from different sources that he is a Communist and has no formal training in kung fu. he is just a puppy for the Commies. Maybe Mr. Ching can fill us all in on what is going on over in China at the Shaolin Temple. He seems to always be traveling there.

Damian

[dfedorko@mindspring.com]

Shaolin -

You need to learn how to read. I did not judge the man. I just passed on what I had heard. If you want to believe it, fine. If not, that is okay.

Damian

[GeneChing]

Never been much for formality, Damian...

I have met with Shi Yongxin and hopefully will be meeting with him again in a few weeks. I am planning to go out for the festival again.

Venerable Shi Yongxin was a graduate of Beijing Buddhist College (as are many of the abbots in PRC.) He does not specialize in Kungfu - His focus is Chan. He is the abbot of Shaolin Temple, and I have heard that he holds a political seat with the party, but since Shaolin Temple has always been a political force this is really unsurprizing given the nature of Buddhism in today's PRC. We often forget the magnitude of Shaolin Temple - one of the most visited in China now - and the impact that has on local community as well as the government's stance on Buddhism. If you want more, I did a cover story on Yongxin in our Shaolin Temple Collectors Edition last year.

Yongxin has taken a lot of criticism about the forced relocation, but this is a common practice in China - check out what's happening with Three Gorges Dam or just watch the award-winning movie Shower. Before Yongxin, the temple was caught between local Dengfeng Government (which actually collected all the money for entrance into the temple) and private business (which was all that gaudy tourists stuff people all complained about.) The relocation reduced all the privates. The government never can come out - China has been under totalitarian rule for over 2000 years - 10x the length of our democracy.

I haven't been back since the changes so I'll refrain from voicing an opinion until I see it myself. Personally, I loved the gaudy tourism. After being to many Buddhist holy sites, like Bodh Gaya and Deer Park, I had no expectations of finding Master Po. The lotus has to have muck to rise from. Also I had many friends amongst those tourist shops and I'll miss stopping by for tea. But I admire Yongxin's attempt to bring the Chan back to Shaolin. I'm eager to go back and see what has happened.

Gene Ching
Asst. Publisher
Kungfu Qigong Magazine & www.KUNGFUmagazine.com

[shaolin_knight]

I don't know what to think. It is wrong kicking people out of their homes and all that, but it would be nice if Shaolin could return to a Buddhist temple with great martial training, and be somewhat peaceful. All those people you guys call "fake monks" are from the local schools around shaolin. The Abbot is kicking them out. Of course, the monks aren't very strict from what I've heard, but that doesn't mean they are fake. And I'm sure not all of them are money hungry. If they were, they'd come to America, get on the cover of magazines, befriend a famous rapper, etc. And this isn't about Communism, it's about one man's dream to return Shaolin to it's previous glory no matter what it takes. Maybe this is what Shaolin needs. And Gene, bring us back a good story...

[phoenix-eye]

All this politics and principle is all well and good....but...

If the monks have better gong fu and can teach you a thing or two then why argue?

Gene is far better placed than I will ever be to comment on the real story. However, don't we all just want to learn better gong fu? the REAL shaolin temple was destroyed many many years ago. However, if what you are being tauaght is true to the ethics, principles and skills of the original temple then how is that bad?

We cant step back in time so lets use what we have got - Good or bad - And derive the best results that we can from it...

I don't think anyone in China who is in a position of public scrutiny could be anything other than political. It is the nature of the country. I think that you just have to accept that this is the case. Even if you don't agre with it.

"We had a thing to settle so I did him"
Tamai, 43, was quoted by Police as saying.

[dfedorko@mindspring.com]

Gene -

Are you going to China at the end of the month? Wouldn't you know it, Master Gray is also planning a trip the end of this month. I understand that he travels to China every two years. Hope everything turns out well for both of you while you are away.

If you do travel to China I wish you a safe trip.

Damian

[Stumblefist]

"Yongxin has taken a lot of criticism about the forced relocation, but this is a common practice in China - check out what's happening with Three Gorges Dam or just watch the award-winning movie Shower. ..The government never can come out - China has been under totalitarian rule for over 2000 years - 10x the length of our democracy."

So Gene, this is how "communism works for China"?
This is the rule of warlords and greedy despots.
Your "abbot" is nothing less and you admit so - a party member, unskilled and not knowledgeable in Wushu. You admire him like you admire Mao , for being ruthless and greedy and having the power to destroy others.
I don't think anyone should look to you for truth about what is happening there. You have a openly stated political and personal alliance with the Abbot. If anyone would be the foreign representative of the "Mininstry of Truth(propaganda)" of Shaolin and the PRC it would be you.

"Without water there would be no fish"

[GeneChing]

DGF: I could be wrong, but wasn't his trip in '99 his first to China? I was there when he made that trip, in fact, I was there when he shot the pictures for that rather negative IKF article (ask him about htat if you get the chance, it was a funny story.) I also helped him get a good deal on some swords.
He's probably coming out for the festival - that will be cool to see him there again. I look forward to that. He should be careful though, because his article did make enemies that could make his trip challenging. You should check that earlier post from Heming to Brian.

sf: I am a layman disciple of Shaolin, so of course I have an allegience to my temple and it's abbot. That's an odd accusation since I fully confess to it and anyone who has read me knows it.
I wouldn't say I admire Yongxin because to be honest, I don't know him very well yet. It's not like he's my buddy, the abbot. I certainly respect his authority, just like I respect the authority of George W. Bush, Sun Tzu or Macheivelli. If you have no respect for authority like that, then you've probably never been on the receiving end of it yet. That teaches respect faster than anything.
The relocation is sad but I have yet to denounce Shaolin for it, and although the abbot certainly had his hand in it, I am still unwilling to make him the sole scapegoat for the suffering. Before I pass such any judgement, I need to see the outcome, and that may be a few years in the making. However my point about China stands - It has been ruled by an iron hand for so long that change will be slow. Communism was a reaction to this totalitarian rule and while far from perfect (what government is?) it works for China now. We can only hope that China continues to progress. Mao's ultimate goal for PRC was democracy.

I love Orwell, so your "ministry of truth" comment is doubleplusgood. I will certainly admit that I spin things with a positive vibration. Since there is so much negativity in CMA, I often find myself in the role of the point of yin in the yang. It's about balance.

And I totally agree that no one should look for truth in me. Hear that everyone? Don't look for truth in me. Nothing would disappoint me more. Look for truth in yourself.

So stumble, what will YOU say to Julia after room 101?

Gene Ching
Asst. Publisher
Kungfu Qigong Magazine & www.KUNGFUmagazine.com