Somethin i wrote up for anti-grapplin folks

[Royal Dragon]

And furthermore, let me say that sport SHOULDN'T be brutal. I mentioned earlier that I think refs in mma often let fights go on too long. And I don't care for MPs attitude of keeping on fighting after it's clear that you've won. If you are de facto the winner of the bout, I think you are honor bound by human decency and good sportsmanship to back off whether the ref signals you to or not.

Reply]
See, the GOAL of MMA is to NOT be brutal.

If I was in Don Frye's shoes in the Frye-Batteti match, for example, I would've gotten up and declared myself the winner after about five or six of those knees to the head and not kept going until the ref pulled me off.

Reply]
What were Batteti's injuries? Was there anything broken, or was Fry being gentile and just knocked him out?

[Royal Dragon]

hey, what if someone KOs you then **** on your face or fock you without condom

Reply]
I'm not sure, but I think the ref might stop the fight for that.

[MasterKiller]

hey, what if someone KOs you then **** on your face or fock you without condom

In your case, you should tell the police about your dad's behaviour. You're just a boy, afterall.

[Chang Style Novice]

I was speaking for myself, not MMA at large, and I do not practice MMA.

I don't know what Batteti's injuries were, but Frye could have easily killed him with those knees if the fight continued and he decided to do it. I suspect that Batteti didn't tap due to some macho latin code of honor, the same kind of thing that got Helio Gracie's arm broken by Kimura.

That sh!t is just dumb to me. It's a sport, a game. And it still doesn't address the difference between MMA as a sport and MMA as a way to hurt someone until they can't move/breathe/whatever. We all saw John Marsh break whatsisname San Soo's arm. Is there any doubt in anyone's mind that after the break Marsh could've dragged his ass to a bridge and thrown him into the water to drown if he had a mind to?

[Xebsball]

oooh son of a b!tch!!!
you cant use the "dad focked you" argument on me, cos it was me that first introduced it here at kfo

[apoweyn]

Royal Dragon,

But they TRAIN to honor the tap, and the DO have a refferee.

Don't you train to pull your strikes before your training partner is rendered unconscious? Broken? Maimed?

The difference please.


Stuart B.

[red5angel]

I second Aps question?


Also RD what is the importance of brutality in training?

[ewallace]

Sure, just like it's all speculation that if I took a baseball bat and hit you in the side of the head with a home run swing that you'd probably die from your head caveing in.

Just like it's all speculation that I'd still be standing there like a dumb ass waiting for your swing to connect. Also notice the word in bold in the above quote.

No offense Royal Dragon, but I think it is you who fails to see what's going on here. I see value in both methods.

You say "I do [technique X] and [result Y] will happen", assuming that you will be in proper position, assuming you will be able to generate the proper force, and assuming the other person will not be able to defend against it. - Hope everything works out there.

The other method, is one tap away from happening for sure.

I always prefer reliability over probability.

[Brad Souders]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

What in the f*ck are u guys talkin about. I looked at my calander cuz i wasn't sure if 1993 waz back again or not.

I agree that "mma" events are less brutal then training "street" grappling because of the respectr shown to the opponent/training partner. BUT if i where to put on an armbar on the street (standing or on the ground) wouldn't it take me simply lifting an inch harder to "break" the opponents arm.

The only advantage a "fighter" has is his body becomes more conditioned to a "figth". Yes there is a referee but that's not what i'm talkin about. The fighter becomes more awarew of his own bodies limits and what he can can and can't do when the sh*t hits the fan.

How does one drop an knee on an opponents limb in a real fight if the other person is resisting? Easily right he controls the opponent. Well take that single though and imagine being able to control the opponent threw the whole conflict not just physical but mental. That's what "ring" fighting lets u gain. How to control the tempo of combat with a safe place to do so.

I'm not sayin some 90 year old crippled man from China couldn't take out Rickson Gracie, sh*t if a five year old runs into his dad's crouch more an likely he just whooped his as*. But what i am saying is why look at mma as the "evil" and "non realistic" event to so called full contact sparring because in the end what u do is the exact same thing as i do when i train. So buckle up my friend if you fight in more then one range YOU ARE A MIXED MARTIAL ARTIST. Welcome to your ego becoming bigger.

Later, Brad

[Royal Dragon]

Don't you train to pull your strikes before your training partner is rendered unconscious? Broken? Maimed?

Reply]
There is a different mind set, we are working skills with the INTENT to maim or cripple. We have to pull back of course, but the techniques are desinged to work that way, and to be hoinest, unless yu actually break something, I don't see many of them really working. Take my favorite Knee drop to the lower ribs. If you don't go full tilt, and actually crush the rib cage your really just leaning on the ribs and the opponent (If he's still got his wind after the throw) can just rool over, grab you leg and pin you into submission MMA style. If you can gte the position to land the knee , it's actually harder to NOT do it because your fighting gravity. You really just have to let yourself go and it just happens. In the heat of battle, the chances of "Accidentally" maiming your advisary is pretty hig with that one. With MMA stuff, you have to add more pressure, and really try to break a joint. The pint is to get the submission without having to go that far in the first place.

Also RD what is the importance of brutality in training?

Reply]
Personally, I think avoiding it is more important. Yes, you should "Simulate" it as best as possible, enough so it's there if you ever need it, but not actually practice it if at all possible, because you'd be leaving a trail of bodies in yuor wake.

MMA Ground fighting actually has and advantage by not being a Brutal discapline similar to Chin Na in Kung Fu because you can use it in sport venues and such, and you could never use real Kung Fu ground fighting as it pretty much precludes catastrophic injuries if you want it to work. With injuries like that pilling up MMA would soon be banned if Kung Fu Ground figting was actually done on any sort of scale.

In MMA, you have guys that over do it on occasion (As exapmled earlier in this thread), but on the whole, most people don't want to brutalise thier oppnents, so they go for stuff that does not leave any sort of long lasting permnant dammage. That's why you see knockouts, and the majority of fights ending in submissions as apppsed to most fights ending with criples going out on stretchers or in body bags.

[Brad Souders]

please note i'm to f*cken lazy to edit my post. Thank you.

[Royal Dragon]

How does one drop an knee on an opponents limb in a real fight if the other person is resisting?

Reply]
Umm no, it's a full body weigted kneed drop to the lower rib cage used in conjunction with the throw. If you manage pull the throw off, you've got the knee drop. The momentum will almost pull you into it if you let it. All you have to do is aim. It's not against a limb, that would be stupid and ineffectual.

[Royal Dragon]

please note i'm to f*cken lazy to edit my post. Thank you

Reply]
Mee too. heck, I barley edit my own posts

[norther practitioner]

X100
WOW, who would figure that street v. sport and kung fu v. mma would come up again..... I thought this was mainly dead with such regulars.

[ewallace]

MMA Ground fighting actually has and advantage by not being a Brutal discapline similar to Chin Na in Kung Fu because you can use it in sport venues and such, and you could never use real Kung Fu ground fighting as it pretty much precludes catastrophic injuries if you want it to work. With injuries like that pilling up MMA would soon be banned if Kung Fu Ground figting was actually done on any sort of scale.

In MMA, you have guys that over do it on occasion (As exapmled earlier in this thread), but on the whole, most people don't want to brutalise thier oppnents, so they go for stuff that does not leave any sort of long lasting permnant dammage. That's why you see knockouts, and the majority of fights ending in submissions as apppsed to most fights ending with criples going out on stretchers or in body bags.

Please tell me someone didn't actually post that.

I think the point that you fail to see, and possibly why your little incident with Water Dragon occured, is because people don't train to wait for a tap, they just have the control to stop when they hear it...if necessary. It's the responsibility of the tapee to know when he can't take anymore.