Triads

[JADE ROSE]

Well I am sure you guys could tell me more so hit me with them.
* Are there specifice styles heard of in different gangs?
* Are there gangs that just utilise kung fu in attacks and not weapons?
* Any stories of fights going down looking like a Jackie Chan movie?

I know you know so share, would make some enjoyable reading.

[David Jamieson]

Are there specifice styles heard of in different gangs?

Yes and No, an individual joining a gang brings with him what he's learned. In the Case of yes, a renegade sifu is teaching his style to the gang members.

Are there gangs that just utilise kung fu in attacks and not weapons?

Kung Fu has weapons. Gangs by nature are cowardly so weapons are almost always used when available.

Any stories of fights going down looking like a Jackie Chan movie?

Plenty! Even in the club I was a member of our Si Gung had a reputation for clearing out the New York triads where I lived when they were harrassing the local business men.

Now, I wasn't there and I haven't heard the whole story of course, but that doesn't mean it didn't happen.

cheers

[Oso]

Author: Booth

More of a historical look at the triads. Didn't read much about
specific kung fu styles.

Anyone have any other titles? It's pretty interesting reading
although I didn't care for Booth's style of organization within
the book.

Matt

[Sho]

I'm quite sure the Hung Mun societies have/had some connections with the Hung Gar system. It was written somewhere as a side note, probably on a Hung Gar website.

[Stranger]

If you get the The History Channel they have two documentaries on the subject, "Chinatown: Strangers in a Strange Land" (have not seen it) and "Street Gangs: A Secret History" (have seen it, it is good, part of it covers a San Francisco KF gang called the "Joes" and their big gang wars in the 1970's). The gang war with the "Joes" contained gunfights as well as streetfights. Once the gun hit the streets of the US, its usefulness to gangs was never overlooked regardless of cultural heritage concerning firearms and their use. The street gang documentary also covers the gangs of Five Points NYC, the LA and Chicago modern street gangs (Crips, Bloods, Vice Lords, Folk, etc.), and the Mexican Zootsuiters vs. US Navy gangwars of the WW II era. You can usually by the shows on The History Channel website, if you don't see them scheduled fo broadcast in the near future.

[Merryprankster]

Absolutely not. Everybody knows that Martial Arts are primarily for character development and not for fighting. As a consequence, any highly skilled martial artist would never be involved in a triad. Their character is simply too great for that.

The fact is that no great martial artist ever was or ever will be guilty of crimes of any sort, or assisting criminal organizations.

[red5angel]

LOL!@ MP, so what are you trying to say?

Kung Lek -

"Gangs by nature are cowardly so weapons are almost always used when available."

I am not sure I agree with your statement here. Gang memebers do a lot of things I wouldn't consider cowardly. I think even labeling gangs as cowardly is just minimizing the issue. Alot of these guys are dangerous and aren't cowardly. Then you throw them into a crowd of like minded individuals and thats when bad things start to happen.

[Shaolin Master]

There is a fine line between wrong and right. Triads have a purpose, character building is a modern phenomenon. If martial arts were originally to build character then they'd have no development no history. Now in times of peace such statements are made. To concentrate on character is to lose the art sometimes. It is the way to something how to use it is an option.
Kung Fu Moral heroes are found in films in reality they are humans with expertise subject tosimilar influences.

Nowadays, we call ourselves businessmennot triads anymore as we have similar professions


Hakka and Hung Men Quan are popular triad arts. In sydney, choylifut used to have some involvement as did an old vietvodao school. But I'd let my friends be.

cheers,

[Oso]

The book I mentioned described the early triads as community
organizations with a bent for helping those in need.

Even after the turn of the century most of the triads had
more involvement in beneficial activities vs. illegal one.
They probably made more money w/ the illegal activities
and laundered it through the legal one.

Mao, is reported to have been very anti triad and the
Koumantang (sp?) seemed to have been heavily vested in
by the triads. I think Chang Kai Shek(again, sp?) was
reported by Booth to have been a triad leader.

all this is just my foggy memory of the book so pardon any
errors.

It's an interesting topic and my next non fiction read will
probably be about the early beginnings of the Itilian mafia.
I'm sure there is something out there. I'm betting they
have a similar genesis.

[Stranger]

For info on the origins and evolution of the Mafia and social banditry check out Primitve Rebels by Hobsbawm.

For a good book on the origin and evolution of social bandits/Triads, to Red Spears/Triads, to CCP cadres check out Perry's Rebels and Revolutionaries in North China, 1845-1945 .

Both books are good IMHO.

[Merryprankster]

I was kidding. I was being a smart ass. Bunch of people on here seem to think that MA's aren't about fighting, but primarily about character building.

I was using their argument to show how silly it looks in the face of proof that many masters have been involved with gangs and criminal activity.

[Cody]

Thanks for giving me my first good laugh of the day.

good perspective,
Cody

[Oso]

stranger, thanks I'll look for them.

Matt

[guohuen]

I agree with Kung Lek. False bravado and cowardice are the same thing.

[GeneChing]

There's an intrinsic problem with any analysis of triads in kung fu. Usually tong is the term that is translated into triads or gangs. But tong is a general term - in fact many southern KF lineages call themselves tongs. Gangs really is not an appropriate translation. It's more like fraternites, ala the masons, the rosecrucians or the odd fellows. Many were and are very benevolent. Some, like the hung men, were underground revolutionaries - terrorist cells if you want to use the present day vernacular. Others were clearly organized crime. Triads comes from the way the revolutionaries organized themselves - in threes so everyone had two contacts. If one was discovered, they could only reveal two. This organization was adopted by criminals.