how many forms do you think there are in wah lum?

[EarthDragon]

I watched Mimi do a breakfall form many years ago, how many of you WL guys are currently doing this, practicing this or mastered this kuen?
I was quite impressed with it

[CeruleanRyuujin]

For those who are curious.

The external empty hand forms from the 1983 Curriculum are:

Level #10
16 Hands
Little Open Gate
Wah Lum 1st form
Straight Form

Level #9
Seven Kicks
Second Form
18 Elbows
2 Men Forms
Little Mantis

Level #8
4th Form
36 Hands
Leopard
Lo Han

Level #7
3rd form
Buddha Palm
Fan Cha

Level #6
5th Form
6th Form
Big Mantis

Advanced Level
Drunken Form
Swallow
Plum flower
six corners
18 kicks
18 locking hands
tin fong fingers
so lo sow
luck low
Tong Long Juk Dung
Soft form

There are ofcourse a ton of weapons etc as well... but this I think is good enough for this threads purpose.

[yu shan]

My handbook (date unknown) lists a form in level #7A called "Tam Tui". Has anyone see it and is it a new addition. And is it a kicking form or something related to leg work? Just curious, I have not heard my friends speak of this form. Back in the 70`s I did get to see the "Swallow form" performed, very nice. Some of my comrades at the time learned "soft form", I missed out on that one... anyone know it? And did I hear at one time, MC`s camp say that "eighteen kicks form" will never be taught?

[CeruleanRyuujin]

Yu Shan,

What does the empty hand for list look like in your HB? Does it match the 83 one i posted above? Would you mind posting it if it is not the same or sending it to me in a PM?

[yu shan]

10B- 16 hands

10A- Little Open Gate, WL First Form

9B- Straight Form, Say Lok, Little Mantis

9A- Seven Kicks, Lo Han, Second Form

8B- Leopard Form, 2 man form, Little Fan Cha

8A- 18 Elbows, Fourth Form, Lok Low #1

7B- Lok Low #2, Third Form, 36 Hands

7A- Fan Cha, Buddha Palm, Tam Tui

6- Big Mantis, Fifth Form, Sixth Form

Cheers.

[phoenixdog]

Let me break it down for the MMA guy.The mantis that I know would be illegal in the UFC,IFL,MMA ring world,thats why it has the long standing street reputation that it does.

[Shaolin Dude]

My handbook (date unknown) lists a form in level #7A called "Tam Tui". Has anyone see it and is it a new addition. And is it a kicking form or something related to leg work? Just curious, I have not heard my friends speak of this form. Back in the 70`s I did get to see the "Swallow form" performed, very nice. Some of my comrades at the time learned "soft form", I missed out on that one... anyone know it? And did I hear at one time, MC`s camp say that "eighteen kicks form" will never be taught?

I've seen tam tui 2-3 times. If I remember correctly, it is mostly a hand form with some kicks.

Yao Li knows 18 kicks and I think I saw Bob Rosen did it one time.

[mawali]

I've seen tam tui 2-3 times. If I remember correctly, it is mostly a hand form with some kicks.

There are many versions of tantui. It is a basic form within Changquan -Northern Fist) (may also be called tantui) and Zhaquan and similar systems!
Aren't most forms hand forms, with soem kicks?

[Chop Socki]

I've seen the Wah Lum tam tui form several times - at least one of them - and while it's not quite as heavily balanced towards kicks as, say, seven kicks, the one I'm familiar with does have more leg work than hand techniques. I've also heard it described as the 'little mantis' equivalent of the Tam Tui system that was merged to form Wah Lum, as far as where it would fall in the system for educational purposes.

I've seen soft form referred to as 'cotton fist'; if they are in fact the same form, Master Chan has been teaching that (or some version of it) in seminars recently. Very nice stuff.

As far as student handbooks and curriculum, the biggest changes I've seen between the '83 version posted previously and what it looks like today are the inclusion of seminar material that has been taught over the years and added at appropriate points in the system. I don't think the 'core' stuff has changed much - you're not going to see 2nd form or 18 elbows go away, but things like S'il Fan Cha and Say Lok were added after they were introduced in seminars.

Practice!

- CS

[EarthDragon]

phoenixdog,
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Let me break it down for the MMA guy.The mantis that I know would be illegal in the UFC,IFL,MMA ring world,thats why it has the long standing street reputation that it does.__________________

LOL your kidding right? let me guess your style is too deadly to be in the ring? you know killing techniques, Dim mak, or dismemberment jointlocks?
you cant possibly be serious so i will let that go.

PS my KF brother fought with mantis in the UFC 6& 7 winning both bouts and there is nothing illegal about any of mantis's techniques in the ring. please dont give me the its too deadly reply. not every application is illegal.... if it is dont use it.

[Jack Squat]

The WL tan tui form (at least the one I learned) is a very difficult but very short form which is more legwork than handwork. It's a great set to do at tourney's as long as you add something to it to make it longer. It ranks up there with Yao Ling Kern (actually named Soft Flexible Fist which is different from Soft Form) as the most difficult WL emptyhand sets to perform. Yao Ling Kern is probably the "breakfall form" that somebody said they saw Mimi do, as it contains a breakfall into a kip up. Both Tan Tui and Yao Ling Kern are great performance sets.

[phoenixdog]

In 2004,a fighter was killed here in the ring with an illegal forearm blow to the back of the neck. I knew this man and had trained with him so I am not kidding.

[ironfenix]

would the breakfall form be wah lum drunken form? There are a couple of breakfalls in that form if i remember correctly.

[EarthDragon]

Phoenixdog,
While I am sure that unfortunate accidents can happen. It was not a mantis technique that killed this man and saying mantis techniques are too deadly to use in that kind of venue is ridiculous.

A forearm blow can be in football, hockey TKD, Muai Thai or any contact sport.

are you saying because the guy practiced mantis that threw the forearm that its techniques are illegal? whats illegal about a forearm blow? lets be real here.

Ironpenix
I am not sure if the form is drunken but it had many rolls adn was done very gracefully. I was hoping one of the WL guys would know

[ironfenix]

earthdragon, how did you know? i never said anything, but thanks. about the form, was she flipping on her head and doing the front breakfall on her forearms?
if so - drunken form.