Hard training in taijiquan

[IronFist]

Do any of you taiji people do any hard training? I mean things like punching bags, posts, dummies, anything that involves hitting something hard, similiar to how boxers or other styles train? Or do you guys do the soft form and push hands all day?

IronFist

[taijiquan_student]

Troll!!!

[Laughing Cow]

Yeah, we hit trolls and people that ask stupid questions.

[taijiquan_student]

Indeed. Does smashing people's faces in and breaking their knees with thunderous kicks count as "hitting something hard"?

[IronFist]

Troll? wtf? Sorry for asking a freaking question.

[Watahhh]

Our Sifu gets us to do a lot of 'hard training'. A typical night includes 10 minutes warmup, 30 minutes strengthening (pushups, crunches, squats...) and then about an hour of actual training. Which involves mostly non-contact sparring followed by kick rounds and punch rounds. For kick rounds, a partner holds a kick shield in different positions and you deliver full strength kicks for 2 minutes. We usually do 2 to 3 rounds with 30 second breaks in between. For punch rounds, a partner holds a mitt on his hand and we punch at full intensity for 2 minutes. We do this in either a set of 5 2-minute rounds with 30 second breaks, or 3 3-minute interval rounds in which our Sifu repeatedly calls out one of 3 things:
"Hard" hard accurate punching
"Fast" develop speed by punching fast
"Pushups" get on the floor and start doing pushups

We usually finish off with forms done hard and fast, a bit of stretching and meditation.

[Laughing Cow]

Methinks we annoyed IF a bit.

We do way more than just forms and push-hands.

Push-hands is also not gentle swaying of the limbs with no force, this type of training leads into San Shou. OMG

Most of the harder training comes in at a later stage when we start hitting (not literally) the Tai chi sphere and similar exercises.

Try doing 30 or so minutes of silk reeling, shaking the pole, etc and your arms will be ready to drop-off literally.

There are schools that do hit the bag and similar in their training.
But who do want to fight a lifeless bag or a human being.

If you want to be pushed, punched, thrown and kicked around than come and see us.

Where I train no mats, no gear when you get thrown it is "hello mr. wooden floor"

[Watahhh]

A requirement to grade to red shash is to do 7 2-minute rounds on a 6 foot bag at our school. Fitness and endurance are still important in MA.

[Laughing Cow]

Watahhh.

During those punch and kick rounds do you maintain the principles & techs of your style, or you simply going at it any old way??

[Watahhh]

We maintain proper form, foot work and technique. We try to incorporate different moves (palm heels, willow leafs, hamer fists...). Sometimes I try to focus and deliver chi strikes but I usually only maintain that level for 5 seconds or so. Intensity and power play a major role though.

[Laughing Cow]

Watahhh.

Bit confused.

What are chi-strikes??
Never heard of them in IMA training.

I know Fa-Jing moves.

Also bit confused your profile states Yang Tai Chi, Hsing Yi and Ba Gua with 1 yr training.

Do they teach all styles at the same time or do you learn one first and than another one.

Also what form of Yang TJQ is it, a couple of things you mentioned raised a few question marks for me.

You also doing forms of Tui shou and Rou Shou I would expect.

Just curious, not intended to question your or your schools abilities.

[Watahhh]

I haven't actully been tought 'Chi strikes' yet. I just use that term to refer to a strike where you focus all your energy and use perfect technique (body movement) to deliver a maximum power hit.

I have heard of Fa-Jing moves but those are only tought later on. I've only been training for one year.

We study 3 arts, all at the same time. We train 3 times a week and most of the time we do 1 art per session. Sometimes we have sessions were we combine the 3. Change from one to the other depending on the situation and on your oponent.

As for the arts, they are Original Yang Tai Chi Chuan, Shansi Hsing-i and Dragon Pa Qua.

I don't think I've heard the terms Tui Shou or Rou Shou mentioned yet, but we have 8 normal forms (katas) which everyone does and 2 sister forms (1 attacks the other defends) which are only tought after getting red sash. There are other forms which I haven't learnt yet though. Plus Taoist Meditation, 24 movement and 108 movement Tai Chi Meditation and some qigong exercises.

[Laughing Cow]

Tui Shou (Push hands) is a 2-person sensitivity drill that is a needed pre-cursor to San Shou(Sparring hands) in Tai Chi. Among a few other things.

Rou Shou is roughly the BaGua equivalent.

Normally in Ba Gua you learn to "walk the circle first", and you keep doing that for some time.

24 movement Tai Chi Form is not traditional but a new PRC created standard form, but often taught as an introductionary form.

It is unusual that the 3 arts are taught at the same time.

My current Chen TJQ form alone took 13 months before I was shown the last move and now I will need to spend a few years perfecting it.

Like I said, just a bit confused as your training seems to vary from the traditional methods I know.

Alos a bit confused with some of the terminology you use (108 movement Tai Chi mediation, calling forms Kata, etc)

Do you have a URL for your school?

Cheers.

[Brad]

Speaking of push hands, anyone ever get these huge ugly bruises on the insides of your arms afterwards? They were there for a loooooong time too.

[Laughing Cow]

Originally posted by Brad
Speaking of push hands, anyone ever get these huge ugly bruises on the insides of your arms afterwards? They were there for a loooooong time too.

We had some nasty bruises from one form of "push-hands" where we bang the forearms together.


Twist the arm a bit and it hurts and bruises.