FALUN GONG/Falun Dafa

[backbreaker]

I don't think there is any agenda in falun gong. I don't blindly follow what anyone says, and I make my own decisions as anyone should, but I am not at all worried about the falun gong senior citizens in my town going weird, that's ridiculous. No practitioners commited suicide today in my town. Remember there is no organizational structure and falun gong is not for money. I fit is against your beleive then that is fine and your choice, I can only recommend a reevaluation of beleifs, but that's all I can say. I am always questioning myself when comes to not only qigongs, but also matial ats fighting styles effectiveness, because I can't do every martial art or every qigong.


Also , the practice of all qigong is to bring energy to the higher centers, and even the crown. But , the crown development is sometimes subtle; you are not aleays aware of crown development. I cannot say for sure there are other styles with falun, but I seem to remember seeind a diagram of the chakras somewhere and one was a falun, maybe not. Beleive me, in the invokation of the masters meditation in qinway, the masters energy body sits on your crown, it is the same as far as I can tell. Li hongzhi's definition of enlightenment conforms to some of the other sites I linkrd.

I can only say that I beleive that traditionally qigong was practiced for enlightenment, so Li Hongzhi's teachings just convince me more that falun dafa is for real. There are other lower or more intermediate ( or even maybe advanced) styles which are also good for health.

[blooming lotus]

Originally posted by dropway



do you have link of stories of these?


also, what's strange is that the falun practioner want to go higher, and higher, and there are many level, supperior and inferior, to the end, he will feel superior to the "ordinary person"

the founder also is unclear to what is "enlightenment" and the aim of falun practice....

I don't have much time here, but if you read the current e-zine article from Grandmaster Tu Jin-Sheng, you may get a bit of an understanding.

quick quotes from the article re high lvl qigong practice:

" sometimes this harms your mental state."

"you can go crazy"

"your thoughts lose their focus..you see this in alot of athletes"

"egotism is an early warning sign. Aftre that, you go crazy or lose focus completely"

"the potential of losing your mind is why, at the highest level of qigong, you have to combine qgong with mudras and chanting"....(in refernce to yi and xi jing cultivation and vigilance realating to music, art and it's correlating meditative benifits)

pls also see the book (blue soft cover)
Falun Gong

by Li Hongzhi.

He talks about this himself and if you read the book you should be able to pick the potential for drama.

cheers

[foolinthedeck]

makyo?

[magicfist]

Hello,
A few years ago I practiced Falun Gong. I don't want to go into details (although I can), but it is a cult. There is really no nice way of saying that. If somone is interested in learning Qi Gong, then I would recomend any number of VALID systems besides Falun Gong. And if someone is interested in Eastern philosophy, then feel free to study as much as you want to. Falun Gong mixes religon and Qi gong in a system that is very emotionally unhealthy. I had to leave becuse I felt as if I was on the verge of having a nervous breakdown due to that belief system. I am not saying these things to sound mean or anything at all like that. I just want to warn people that it is indeed a cult. Li Hongzhi is a charasmatic figure who offeres what people want to hear. The only proof that he is enlightend is that he claims to be....I can claim to be a millionare...it doesn't make it so.

[backbreaker]

Hi, did the chinese government send you? Are you saying all Dao qigong is connected to Lao Tzu? All buddha's connected to "the buddha"? ANd you're saying that truth, compassion, and tolerance is emotionally unhealthy. So you have made up stories about a group which is hardly even an organised group. Just practitioners who practice in the parks every morning, LOL at you. Enlightenment is what qigong is about, and it is a misunderstanding to think anything else, although that does not mean practicing it for lesser reasons is wrong. Falun gong is clearly non religous and not a religion. Go away you paranoid wannabe. It's the same old tired, invalid criticisms based on a misunderstanding of falun gong, and qigong in general. THERE IS ABSOLUTELY NO BASIS TO SAY IT IS A MISH MASH, RELIGIOUS, OR MADE UP. IT IS PLAINLY REAL, WITH CORRECT ENERGY DEVELOPMENT

http://www.clearwisdom.net

http://www.falundafa.org

I recomend ths style IMO over 99% of others. Truly a gem, and real. And I can also say it is absolutely safe.

[backbreaker]

Originally posted by magicfist
Hello,
A few years ago I practiced Falun Gong. I don't want to go into details (although I can), but it is a cult. There is really no nice way of saying that.

BS. Li Hongzhi is not a leader. Each person cultivates themselves.



If somone is interested in learning Qi Gong, then I would recomend any number of VALID systems besides Falun Gong.


Re:It is way better than pretty much anything, except maybe personal study with someone the caliber of Li Hongzhi, but that would invole too much hardship anyways, and any valid qigong will say you have to cultivate through hardship at high level.



And if someone is interested in Eastern philosophy, then feel free to study as much as you want to.


Thanks for your expert opinion

Falun Gong mixes religon and Qi gong in a system that is very emotionally unhealthy. I had to leave becuse I felt as if I was on the verge of having a nervous breakdown due to that belief system.



Re: This is how I know you're lying. Falun gong is non religous and the practice is very serene and peaceful. This statement proves you are BS.



I am not saying these things to sound mean or anything at all like that. I just want to warn people that it is indeed a cult.


You're plainly lying. Nobody would refer to it as a cult except an idiot. It's not generally called a cult, it is a sect, and not even really that. So go report that to your communist bosses.




Li Hongzhi is a charasmatic figure who offeres what people want to hear. The only proof that he is enlightend is that he claims to be....I can claim to be a millionare...it doesn't make it so.

ANd this statement shows that you are just plain not intelligent. Li Hongzhi does not tell people what they want to hear at all, only the truth about qigong cultivation. I know this because I have experience in Qinway and Kunlun wild goose and falun gong is clearly and plainly just as legit, but there are others that aren't , and that is why I will always defend falun gong. So Li Hongzhi knows his stuff, and has simply made available a practice to anyone who wants it, and these types of opportunities in history, are indeed rare.

[magicfist]

Hi,
I can understand why you would be defensive about the fact that falun gong is a cult. Hey...I have an idea....why don't we quote Li Hongzhi directly from Zhuan Falun (the main book) and we can see what he preaches to his followers:

"The enlightenment quality of some people can't be brought out. Someone read my book and underline it here and there casually. Those who have their Celestial Eyes open all can see that this book is shining golden and bright with all colours, and every word of the book is the image of my law body. I would cheat you if I didn't tell you the truth. The one mark you made in the book has caused it to have a mass of blackness. How dare you do so?" - P. 168, 1998 translation

and:

"Your diseases will be cured by my Law bodies. Those who practise in the practising spot will be cured by my Law bodies. Those who learn Falun Dafa though self-study by reading the book will also be cured by my Law bodies."- P.61, 1998 translation

and don't forget:

"As long as you cultivate yourself, you will become practitioners of our school. My law body knows everything. He knows everything on your mind, and can do anything. He will not take care of you if you do not cultivate yourself, and he will help you all the way through if you do." -P.80, 1989 translation

These things can be read by anyone on the net at:

http://www.falundafa.org/book/eng/pdf/zfl_en.pdf

Why am I going to the trouble of posting all this stuff? Either I am a secret Chinese spy plotting against a innocent group of qi gong practitioners......or.... I am a guy who was involved in a cult and can't stand by in good conscience without at least making an attempt. Sometimes we want something to be true so badly that we allow our innermost desires to cloud our reasoning. If you want to get mad and start bashing me, feel free. I am just calling a spade a spade. I hope you get out, if not now, then later.

take care,
-Jason

[backbreaker]

Originally posted by magicfist
Hi,
I can understand why you would be defensive about the fact that falun gong is a cult.

It is not a cult, period. Everything is done by each indivdual practitioner, there is no cult, no organisation to join, everything about it is about benefitting society. Anyone saying "cult" is plainly an idiot.





"The enlightenment quality of some people can't be brought out. Someone read my book and underline it here and there casually. Those who have their Celestial Eyes open all can see that this book is shining golden and bright with all colours, and every word of the book is the image of my law body. I would cheat you if I didn't tell you the truth. The one mark you made in the book has caused it to have a mass of blackness. How dare you do so?" - P. 168, 1998 translation

That is taken totally out of context. You make it sound as if it is at all about Li Hongzhi, hey idiot, those books are pretty precious in China now, hey. You better preserve them well. You see, that does not say what you are trying to make say, it is about cultivation and this is proven, not attracting followers or worship, idiot.


and:

"Your diseases will be cured by my Law bodies. Those who practise in the practising spot will be cured by my Law bodies. Those who learn Falun Dafa though self-study by reading the book will also be cured by my Law bodies."- P.61, 1998 translation

and don't forget:

"As long as you cultivate yourself, you will become practitioners of our school. My law body knows everything. He knows everything on your mind, and can do anything. He will not take care of you if you do not cultivate yourself, and he will help you all the way through if you do." -P.80, 1989 translation


Re: that's right. It is in other qigongs of the buddha shool as well, which is NOT the buddhist religion. Damo qigong master chin chee ching sent energy to me from singapore, he is a real master, Like Master Li. Now, in Qinyin qigong, the master's fa shen energy body sits on your crown on top of your head, merging their energy body woth yours, as you chant " OOOM, jang he lao ja, sa yi wa sik day hong" , invocation of the quan yin and qinyin masters. So Li Hongzhi's teachings on Fashen are absolutely correct, real, and for no other purpose than cultivation.





ATTN: EXCELENT QIGONG TEACHINGS HERE. IF YOU WANT THE REAL DEAL IT IS HERE

[url]http://www.falundafa.org/book/eng/pdf/zfl_en.pdf





Why am I going to the trouble of posting all this stuff? Either I am a secret Chinese spy plotting against a innocent group of qi gong practitioners......or.... I am a guy who was involved in a cult and can't stand by in good conscience without at least making an attempt. Sometimes we want something to be true so badly that we allow our innermost desires to cloud our reasoning. If you want to get mad and start bashing me, feel free. I am just calling a spade a spade. I hope you get out, if not now, then later.

take care,
-Jason

BEcause you are another idiot, with an agenda, who knows nothing about what real qigong is. You never did falun gong, and you have nothing to show that it is fake. Because it is a real qigong. The teachings of both the Dao school, and buddha school are completely correct in Zhuan Falun, I know this because I have learned QInway qinyin qigong, and Kunlun wild goose qigong. You just don't know about real qigong that is beyond execise qigong or martial arts qigong. THe high level in qigong period, is real, and any criticism of falun gong , the same could be said of any high level gong, and it would be wrong.

[bodhitree]

"A few years ago I practiced Falun Gong. I don't want to go into details (although I can), but it is a cult. There is really no nice way of saying that. " Majic Fist

Its the truth, I'm not saying they deserve what the Chinese government does to them, however, the fact remains, just look at how much effort you are putting into defending them. Please, give yourself some time away to learn to think for yourself. Oh yeah, didn't 'master' li say those who practive martial arts qigong don't know how to cultivate life, and people who practice falun gong should not do any other forms of qigong because it will ruin the wheel. what are you doing here talking about martial arts qigong, go do some falun gong!

[backbreaker]

What Master Li means , is that martial arts qigong is based on movement, but only stillness and meditation cultivates the orininal pre natal life energy. And in many qigong's as you go higher level, begiining methods are abandoned for more advanced methods. Again, nothing other qigong masters haven'r said, nothing even non masters haven't said. Other methods of qigong only verify falun gong, and it's a good standard of which to judge qigong styles. It simply means that practicing several High level qigongs can be complicated, and practicing too many or mixing them up won't be goo, this is common knowlege in any true style.

[backbreaker]

Anyone criticisng falun gong saying it is fake is either-

1. Practiced simple health "qi" exercise, which truly have been ripped off ancient methods, but does not understand the potential of high level qigong. So they think they are experts, whent they're method does not come from a real school, but there is no basis for anything they say.

2. Simply does not beleive in real qigong period. And has no basis for anything they say.


3. Simply a religious person, in which case they will have many dogmatic misunderstanding about what qigong actually is, as well as just overall general misunderstandings of everything.

4. sent by chinese government

But there is simply no basis for anyone to say it is fake, because it is plainly real, and a good opportunity

[backbreaker]

Originally posted by magicfist
Hello,
The only proof that he is enlightend is that he claims to be....I can claim to be a millionare...it doesn't make it so.

Okay, so you know nothing about real qigong, and have never practiced it. Because you would know that enlightenment is in fact, what qigong is all about in both the buddha and Dao schools. I know this because I practice Kunlun wild goose, and qinyin qigong, so you have nothing to say, except that you think qigong period is fake. So shut up

[TaiChiBob]

Greetings..

In this discussion (i use the term liberally), there is little evidence that anyone is overly concerned with aligning their energies with Tao.. there is much contribution to chaos and division, much meeting mental force with mental force.. threats and accusations.. Where are the true Tai Chi, QiGong and Taoist principles?... i suggest that they are bound up in the ego's need to prevail.. If this discussion indicates the calm and quiet serenity gained by QiGong practice, it's no wonder so many others are skeptical of QiGong..

As i re-read portions of the Falung Gong text as suggested by Backbreaker, it is clear to me that there are obvious inconsistencies and plainly observable religious overtones.. but, the physical motions i was exposed to at the seminar were largely authentic with a few notable exceptions.. like anything, there is wisdom in having the experience and only keeping that which is of value.. Backbreaker's attitude is so harsh and judgmental as to be a detriment to the Art he so plainly adores, his attitude should scare away potential first-timers.. i mean who would want to end up with that sort of unkind antagonistic outlook.. so much of his posting is precisely what his beloved master warns against in the referenced text.. so, until Backbreaker can demonstrate that he believes that which he posts, he should be left unanswered.. unfulfilled in his quest for conflict.. leaving him more time to review the texts of Falun Gong and adjust his practice..

We are all just pilgrims on the path.. be well..

[goldendragon]

Taichibob that was a very wise responce, I bow to you and leave in peace.

[unkokusai]

Originally posted by backbreaker
It is not stolen. It is for real. Falun gong and similar buddhist and taoist styles are the original, religion comes from them and changes when it becomes religion. You're better off with falun gong than some alternative healer messing with you. The benefits of falun gong are very good and come quickly. There is not a valid argument against it

Someone's mixing the Koolaide!