the clips are up

[KenWingJitsu]

Fa_jung.

You also get all the mad props form me.

QUite frankly, these are the kind of clips I would rather see on here ALL THE TIME. Instead of the my chum-kiu is great 'clips'.

For the most part I agree with Ernie. It looks a lot more like 'kickboxing'. But..............here's the thing. basically when two people fight/spar whatever,...it's going to "look" like kickboxing...whther you want it to or not. The only thing is how much of your "style" can you interject into that kixkboxing/boxing structure/look? The more you can use your 'style', the better you are at it, But I would hazard a bet that NO-ONE can look like Wing Chun ALL the time. Unles your 'fight lasts 3 seconds lol - which could mean bad news for you

Basically, yes, if I look closely, I can see the occaasional WC influence, but it's very occasional. Again, that';s not a bad thing. Fighting is fighting and training live like that, is way more beneficial than spending your time perfecting you goat clamping stance.

Basically, THANK YOU FOR SHARING THOSE CLIPS, and that is the kind of training/competition stuff that is sadly missing form much of Wing Chun. You have all my respect.

MORE!!!!!!

[teazer]

Originally posted by KenWingJitsu
But..............here's the thing. basically when two people fight/spar whatever,...it's going to "look" like kickboxing...whther you want it to or not. The only thing is how much of your "style" can you interject into that kixkboxing/boxing structure/look? The more you can use your 'style', the better you are at it, But I would hazard a bet that NO-ONE can look like Wing Chun ALL the time.

Personally I'd disagree with this. There'll most likely be a few adaptations - more kicks & long range strikes due to the frequent lack of serious attacks in this kind of sparring event, but someone watching it should be able to narrow down what you're doing to just a few styles. IMO the underlying structure/look should be WC, the moves you do should be WC though some would be emphasized more than normal. If not, then it seems to be indicative of what you're training when sparring.

[fa_jing]

Thanks KWJ - I really appreciated your comments and I know you have a rep as a fighter.

I'm going to repeat a couple things for clarity's sake:

I'm not a pure Wing Chun stylist. The drill portion of our class is about 70% Wing Chun, 15% June Fan JKD, and 15% other (mostly grappling). I'm including focus mitt work here which I think still counts as Wing Chun if done with WC structure and movements.

When it comes to bagwork and sparring - the rule is - whatever you can make work. I try to draw from Wing Chun as much as possible, but fall short of ideals. Again, my Sifu will not come at us in sparring like a WC stylist, seeking a bridge - his theory is that we already have alot of ideas for dealing with that kind of fighter due to the drilling. It is a humbling experience for there to be NO obstruction between my fist and his head...and yet not be able to hit him solidly (usually). IMO this is the only way to develop accurate punches.

My last two points are: 1. I did "revert" a little to my old TKD tournament tactics...although I studied WC for much longer than I did TKD...I competed many times in TKD (as a teenager) and these were my first tournies as a Wing Chun stylist. Something about being in a big gymnasium with all of the people running around....

2. If ANYTHING looked like Wing Chun, I consider it a success.

To me, what was most "Wing Chun" about my fights was the way I was landing the first straight punch....direct, vertical fist, explosive. Also following with the rear hand. No that's not unique to Wing Chun, but it is a very important part of Wing Chun. I did use the three angle step at least once it each fight.

Curious: did you guys watch the other fights? Can you tell what styles the practicioners have trained in?

[KenWingJitsu]

Just keep doing what you're doing. But also, I say take a closer read at Ernie's post. Especailly about the squared structure if you want to interject more WC into you sparring. Aso his points about the Wu sau & Man Sau. When you spar/drill drill that way and it will come out when you compete.

if you want to see were I'm coming from wing chun wise I can email you a few clips of some demo stuff but you will get the idea

Ernie, *ahem* I'd love to. dhirayesufu@ifgloans.com

[Ernie]

coming your way bro,
we still got to hang out i just started training again after a 3 week death bout with the latest hacking cough thing that's floating around .
i'm in need of some fresh energy and a bit of a tune up.

[vt108]

On the Wing Chub vs Mantis film which one of those practicioners were from Wing Chun?

vt108

[Brithlor]

I'm pretty sure the one wearing gloves was the mantis guy.

Personally I thought the mantis guy still retained alot of his mantis posture, but the WC guy in the clips seemed to have a much different approach to combat than a normal WC guy. Not that that is bad or anything, especially since the person demonstrating is a bit of a JKD person.

[fa_jing]

Don't be thrown off by the round kicks, the fellow in the WC vs. Mantis clip is from the W. Chueng line which does employ round kicks.

KWJ and Ernie - thanks again for the advice, those are things that I'll try to work on when I begin sparring again. Wing Chun has a wealth of applications and I want to make them accessible to me.

[Brithlor]

Fajing, what level in their respective arts were the two guys in that mantis vs wing chun clip?

BTW, I do the TWC version and haven't learned any round kicks yet... but I havent been doing it that long yet.

[teazer]

Originally posted by Brithlor
I'm pretty sure the one wearing gloves was the mantis guy.

Personally I thought the mantis guy still retained alot of his mantis posture, but the WC guy in the clips seemed to have a much different approach to combat than a normal WC guy. Not that that is bad or anything, especially since the person demonstrating is a bit of a JKD person.

I suspect so too. The guy with the white T-shirt did a few of the 'William Cheung patented entry techniques' & went for the outside gate wherever he could. He spent a lot of time on the outside trying to get long range kicks to work, which was a shame as they didn't seem to help any. Most times he got close, he did fine. I'd say of all the clips, he looked most like WC (at least the TWC end of things!) & least like JKD. Kept facing him, used both hands simultaneously, closed in when he could & was using footwork to get control of the centerline.

[Brithlor]

"I didn't know that. Even head level round kicks?"

I'm not sure if that was intended for me or not...

But so far no, the only kicks I've done are the straight front kick (with 2 variations I believe, one hitting with the whole foot, and the other more of a snap kick), and a low side kick.

The only time I've used round house kicks is for when a move calls for a high round kick for the defender to use a technique on...

I also haven't seen anyone else do a round kick where I take classes from either, however I might just have missed it, or else I'm not at the level where they are used.

Either way, there isn't that much emphasis put on them...

[Brithlor]

"I suspect so too. The guy with the white T-shirt did a few of the 'William Cheung patented entry techniques' & went for the outside gate wherever he could. He spent a lot of time on the outside trying to get long range kicks to work, which was a shame as they didn't seem to help any. Most times he got inside, he did fine. I'd say of all the clips, he looked most like WC (at least the TWC end of things!) & least like JKD. Kept facing him, used both hands simultaneously, closed in when he could & was using footwork to get control of the centerline."

I need to watch that video again, but if I'm not mistaken the TWC guy seems to do best when he uses the entry technique and attacks from the outside, and gets some good attacks in while they're kind of spinning around... Watch one of the individual fights towards the end and you'll know what I mean...

[Phil Redmond]

By level 3 you should be learning round kicks.
Here is the TWC grading:
http://www.wingchunkwoon.com/grading.asp

[Brithlor]

Ah, I guess I was mistaken then... I suppose I'll learn it eventually...

However, I still don't think they're used very often where I takes classes from. Kicks aren't really used that often at all... and when they are it is either for a counter kick to defend against the opponent's kick, or a front kick...

Maybe I just haven't watched closely enough yet though.