what is the problem with shaolin-do?

[Judge Pen]

Originally posted by cerebus
Anton has stated very simply, exactly what most people who have any problem with SD have spent many more words trying to explain to the SDers on this board. Shaolin-Do is not traditional CMA. It IS Shaolin-Do (not, however, Shaolin Chuan or Chung Kuo Wu Shu [Chinese MA]). It might be effective, and it has certainly done much good for many people but it's frustrating that it is represented as something which it isn't. The SDers on this board have shown that, for them, SD is good enough to stand on it's own regardless of it's background or "history" it's just to bad that Sin The doesn't seem to know they feel this way (though by this point it's a bit late for him to come clean with the truth as it would be a tremendous loss of face to admit that maybe the background was "embellished" a bit here & there). T.

I've been open-minded to the arguments and can concede much of what you say. SD is SD. It's lineage is embellished as are other areas of the art. It is effective. It's more traditional than you think. It is not pure shaolin, but it has roots there like many MA.


The thing that bugs me, though, is saying it's not Chinese. It is Chinese kung fu, but it has evolved (or devolved as some may argue) because it was taught in Indonesia and then to a gaggle of americans who 90% can't do it justice.

[cerebus]

Well, I didn't mean to imply that it wasn't developed from CMA to whatever degree, but rather that it's gone it's own way and done it's own thing. The types of energy & aligments used (or demonstrated as far as I have seen) in SD's versions of the various forms they teach differ greatly from these forms as demonstrated by practitioners of the complete systems from which they came (White Crane, Praying Mantis, Tiger, etc.). Which isn't to say that SD's way of doing these arts is invalid, it's just that it's not the way they are done by those practicing these systems as taught in China, Hong Kong, etc. T.

[Judge Pen]

I see your point, and although I haven't worked with a Tiger practitioner before to compare my Tiger to his, I'm curious to do so.

What you are speaking of may be a result of lazy americans learning bits and pieces of systems and not putting the time to practice each form to the point that they start to blend together and look alike. I think the curse of SD is the number of forms because very few SD people can honestly say that they devote the times to learning and practicing a form that they should. I can't say I put in the time required, although when I remind myself of that it helps to motivate me to do more.

[cerebus]

From what I've seen, there are some tiger claw (Fu Jow Pai) videos on the market by former Wai Hong student Tak Wah Eng if you're interested in comparing. Also, the video "The Warrior Within" is an old 1970s documentary has some good Fu Jow Pai with master Hui Cambrelin. T.