WC vesus Kyokushin

[Phenix]

http://www.warlinkbbs.com/logo/vidio/dishou.asf

[pseudoswitch]

Ah, the slapfest video. Great stuff. *chuckle*chuckle*

[edward]

which one is the wing chun?

[Brithlor]

I was wondering that myself . I honestly thought it was the guy on the right in the beginning...

[Brithlor]

Just curious, since I see so many martial art vs martial art clips, but would anyone be interested in seeing 2 newbies (of different martial arts) fighting each other? Just to see how lower level sparring of two different arts look... ei; san soo vs wing chun.

[Phenix]

Originally posted by Brithlor
Just curious, since I see so many martial art vs martial art clips, but would anyone be interested in seeing 2 newbies (of different martial arts) fighting each other? Just to see how lower level sparring of two different arts look... ei; san soo vs wing chun.

Not That new bies. and ofcorse it is easier to say that to do. Until one is in the ring...

[Phenix]

Originally posted by edward
which one is the wing chun?

When WC was forced by Kyokushi to adapt.. there is no WC.
Same with when WC was forced by bjj to adapt there is no WC.

So what is WC?

[Brithlor]

"Not That new bies. and ofcorse it is easier to say that to do. Until one is in the ring..."

I'm alittle confused with what you mean... you mean "No, they're not interested in that, newbies"? Or "As long as they aren't THAT newbie!". Just curious, lol.

Also, I don't see anything wrong with a wing chun person adapting to the situation... I mean, the people practicing whatever martial art are not the art themselves... so even if they don't do 100% wing chun in combat or sparring as long as it helped their combat skills I see no problem.

But I think the person you were replying to ment; which one is the guy who trained in wing chun?

[Phenix]

Originally posted by Brithlor
"Not That new bies. and ofcorse it is easier to say that to do. Until one is in the ring..."

I'm alittle confused with what you mean... you mean "No, they're not interested in that, newbies"? Or "As long as they aren't THAT newbie!". Just curious, lol.

Also, I don't see anything wrong with a wing chun person adapting to the situation... I mean, the people practicing whatever martial art are not the art themselves... so even if they don't do 100% wing chun in combat or sparring as long as it helped their combat skills I see no problem.

But I think the person you were replying to ment; which one is the guy who trained in wing chun?

New or old...... doesn't matter, it is a part of reality that is what WC needs to face.

Wrong or right.... doesn't matter, when one cannot take advantage of one's art which one train everyday. That already a disadvantage. When a horse lost its legs and eagle lost its wings,......

the Kyokushin guy just do what he did everyday in thier dojo.
and it is very white Crane platfrom. Sanchi type of body....

(BJJ guy will also do what they do everyday in thier dojo...)

Where is the WC platform? can daily practice be applied? that is the question one has to ask.


There is a different between don't do or being force out and cannot do.


We have seen two video clips on WC with Kyokushin. and both is not impress at all.

[Brithlor]

Hmm, ok... so which one is the Kyokushin?

I don't get what you're saying... In my opinion if wing chun helps you in some way then that is a good thing... are you saying that if you decide to change anything to fit your own personal style that makes everything you learned in the traditional sense worthles..? I'm really kind of confused what you mean...

"New or old...... doesn't matter, it is a part of reality that is what WC needs to face."

My question was if anyone was interested in seeing a Wing Chun guy fight a San soo guy who both of which have done their respective arts for under 3 years... Because all I see are higher level people fighting I thought it would be interesting to see others skill levels as well....

[Brithlor]

Ah, it makes more sense to me now that you edited it .

I see what you mean now... so you're saying a BJJ guy practices everything that he will actually use in fighting while a wing chun guy pracitices a lot of useless things that have no real application, and because of little foundation for actual combat they're technique either falls apart or they find themselves forced to change strategies?

If that's what you mean I see that as a valid complaint on any martial art, however I would disagree... Wing chun people seem to not do aswell because they lack either the combat training, conditioning or fighting spirit... Not because their techinques are inherently faulty. Besides, noone is bound to a style, so if they dislike one aspect of wing chun (after thoroughly studying the purpose for it ofcourse) that doesn't mean they have to quit wing chun and take up another martial art to fix thier problem... instead they can simply keep what is effective for them, and do whatever that want with the rest... It doesn't seem like it needs to be an "all or nothing" kind of a thing.

[Ernie]

hendrik
sorry bro but they both suck
one has a thigh kick the other has a side kick , whoopie
neither has good hand s or any concept on foot work range or mobility , god forbid a fake or broken rythem . both heads are wide open ,
they move like pieces of wood
i saw no wing chun or even good boxing in either of them
just looked like bad kick boxing .

sorry bro but i have time in the ring so and i know what skill looks and feels like . that wasn't it

but your right about adaptability ,
but going in with no gaurd or regard of distance is just plain sloppy

[Phenix]

ernie

the kyokushin is doing what normal kyokushin is doing. atleast he uses what his sifu teach him.

as for the wc. the guy in tkd uniform suppose to be from canton china wc school.

my point is instead of judge are they good. the question is :
so that is wc in the ring?
or how is wc supposed to look like in the ring?

[Edmund]

Ha Ha..

Plenty of videos have shown similar.

Are you dreaming.....
Of a Kungfu movie starring Wing Chun....
that has nothing to do with real ring fight videos.


So somehow the Kyokushin can do what he's taught and yet the WC guy can't. All WC guys must be bad learners!

Truth is WC guy:
1. trained WC stuff that is no use in the ring against well matched opponent therefore stuff is unseen.
2. trained stuff (like simple kick and punch) that was some use which did land in the fight.

You take away the head punch you will not see people dropped with a punch to the chest. Not often. No superpowers. They have to kick to win. Even one kick KO is hard. Will WC win with one punch and no stepping?

[Ernie]

hendrick
so that is wc in the ring?
or how is wc supposed to look like in the ring


well i don't think wing chun is going to look the same for everyone since in the end it is very personal

but some basics in body and princilple should be there
controlling center for one ,
that was not there
protecting center
that was not there
economy of motion
that was not there
forward '' eating up space '' taking position
that was not there

and so on
as for how it should look and do you have to abonden it ,
well i personaly use more natural footwork in long range , and i never use a staic wing chun posture but i keep the elements in place facing ,elbow down man sau wu sau just in a slightly more alive fashion.

i have seen gary fight , and he fought professionally , in china and thai land and his wing chun is very clear , relaxed and fluid
now he did adapt the thai thigh kick and elbows when he trained thai fighters ,
but his foundation in wing chun is dominate even when he fires a thigh kick you can see the wing chun striaght body posture .

what you seem to be pointing out is very obvious to me the wing chun fighters rarely have any ring experience and can't adapt there skill to a ring enviroment , instead they echo the style they are facing and so they are destined to lose

that comes from the '' wing chun arrogance '' that most schools promote , now before the flames start
let me explain
how many times have you heard , you don't need to spar , we have a superior system . you don't need conditioning

a fight will only last 3 seconds

these are sales pitches and true in the most basic and one sided street fights but not the mentality you need for the ring or to face a skilled fighter

so you have to ask yourself ''what am i training for ''
if self protection in the street then stick with the basic program
if your thinking of jumping in the ring then put down the donut and get to work , even though you might have a superior skill in the ring conditioning is a major factor
and you must learn to work the ring control the distance , read and lie to your opponent ,
conserve your gas and be patient

off to work