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Thread: then and now

  1. #1

    then and now

    Intersting thread and article:

    http://www.emptyflower.com/cgi-bin/y...num=1071193499


    Makes me think about what training was like then. More specifically, the logistics of actually "training all day". Here's my thinking:

    Back then, as now, you gotta make a living. Whether as a smith, a farmer, a bodyguard, a soldier, etc. But let's see how much training a person could actually do. Let's assume that people awok at dawn and went to bed some good time after dusk - trying to get ~6 hours sleep a night. So....around 5:30 or 6 am to about midnight. You get up, and assuming you're a diligent kung fu adpet, you do your morning qigong, jiben, drills, etc - for about an hour before you have to go to work. Work being in the field if you're a farmer, or the court if you're a bureaucrat, or to the marketplace if you're a merchant or fisherman or something like that. You work until mid-meal, so afterwards let's say you can get about 1/2-hour break to do a quick workout. Let's say that "work" ended around supper time, so let's say 5am. Unless you have assistants or servants, there's always personal/house work to be done (it's not like there's a WalMart or Home Depot around the corner), so let's say this consumes anywhere from 2-4 hours of your day. By the end it's anywhere from 8-10am. Now you practice fullout - about 3-4 hours. It's now past 11pm or so, so maybe take a bath, or cool down, or write/read poetry, etc for about an hour. Then sleep around midnight.

    Now, this is a vastly hand-wavy generalization, but I am thinking that in all, there's about 6 hours of training in there per day. And I am assuming this is done everyday, more or less. Of course this actual schedule will differ depending on the day, and the profession, and also if you have a family or other business to take care of, but it's a good starting point to take a gander at what a tyical training schedule would be like. I guess if you were a rich man, then you could afford to train much more (especially if you're the child of a rich person). Or if you were a solider then it's your job to train more. But even monks have daily temple duties to perform that are not MA training related - just like soldiers normally have non-fighting training related things to do a lot of their days. And if you were a body guard, then you are out travelling a lot, and when on duty, you're primarily going to be concerned paying attention and not necessarily fighting. Of course whe off duty or during down times, you'd be training your ass off.

    Is this 1st order approximation a decent guess at what it would have been like? Is it really different than the way some seriosuly motivated people nowadays train? I'd say the primary difference will be in teh physical conditioning and mental toughness. Most "work" will be physical labor (unless you're a scholar or merchant or the like), and by the time you get around to your kung fu training, you're not necessarily going to need time to "life weights" per se. You can focus more on your kung fu associated activities. As for mental toughness, I am under the impression that back then, the world was lot tougher - in the sense that people and the elements were a lot less fogiving, and people were much more used to discomfort and pain in general. So experiencing these things during training would not have been a serious turnoff to training. And this general mental toughness would also have crontributed to mental toughness during fights themselves.

    Feel free to nit and pick this.
    ...don't think you are, know you are...

  2. #2
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    My late sigung told us that as a young man, his routine was to sleep 8 hrs, work 8 hrs, and train 8 hrs. This was around 1915/1920 I think, so it wasn't 'back in the day', but it showed that it could be done.
    cxxx[]:::::::::::>
    Behold, I see my father and mother.
    I see all my dead relatives seated.
    I see my master seated in Paradise and Paradise is beautiful and green; with him are men and boy servants.
    He calls me. Take me to him.

  3. #3
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    Did he say how he trained..? Lol, im just wondering >_>

  4. #4
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    Originally posted by PaiLumDreamer
    Did he say how he trained..? Lol, im just wondering >_>
    Why do you ask? I think at the time he was living in Putian and was training under a monk who lived at the Nan Putuo temple. From what I understand, the monk had trouble walking, so my sigung started his training by carrying his master halfway up the mountain to the spot where he trained. From what I understand, it was pretty hard training.
    cxxx[]:::::::::::>
    Behold, I see my father and mother.
    I see all my dead relatives seated.
    I see my master seated in Paradise and Paradise is beautiful and green; with him are men and boy servants.
    He calls me. Take me to him.

  5. #5
    I see the potential for a good thread here.
    i'm nobody...i'm nobody. i'm a tramp, a bum, a hobo... a boxcar and a jug of wine... but i'm a straight razor if you get to close to me.

    -Charles Manson

    I will punch, kick, choke, throw or joint manipulate any nationality equally without predjudice.

    - Shonie Carter

  6. #6
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    Jan 1970
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    Wait wait! I can derail it if you want
    cxxx[]:::::::::::>
    Behold, I see my father and mother.
    I see all my dead relatives seated.
    I see my master seated in Paradise and Paradise is beautiful and green; with him are men and boy servants.
    He calls me. Take me to him.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Location
    ky, usa
    Posts
    407
    While I'm sure a few people really did train several hours a day "back in the day", I think alot of it is just nostalgia. Sort of like how my grandfather told me how when he was a kid they walked to school through 2 feet of snow in a driving blizzard uphill-both ways-and then went home to do farm work until suppertime, which was dirt and they were thankful to get it. Oh, and children were always clean, quiet, obedient, reverent, etc.,etc.,etc. This generation now doesn't know what real work is!
    Big egos are fragile.

    Where the violent see only violence, the skillfull can see skill.

    "You cannot solve a problem with the same level of thinking that existed when it was created." Albert Einstein

  8. #8
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    Actually in the case of my sigung, I believe him. But then his skill and understanding in his art reflected the hours of training he had put in
    cxxx[]:::::::::::>
    Behold, I see my father and mother.
    I see all my dead relatives seated.
    I see my master seated in Paradise and Paradise is beautiful and green; with him are men and boy servants.
    He calls me. Take me to him.

  9. #9
    Originally posted by Cheese Dog
    While I'm sure a few people really did train several hours a day "back in the day", I think alot of it is just nostalgia. Sort of like how my grandfather told me how when he was a kid they walked to school through 2 feet of snow in a driving blizzard uphill-both ways-and then went home to do farm work until suppertime, which was dirt and they were thankful to get it. Oh, and children were always clean, quiet, obedient, reverent, etc.,etc.,etc. This generation now doesn't know what real work is!
    Did he mention anything about killing a grizzly bear with just his notebook??

  10. #10
    Join Date
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    Location
    ky, usa
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    It was only a black bear, not a grizzly.
    Big egos are fragile.

    Where the violent see only violence, the skillfull can see skill.

    "You cannot solve a problem with the same level of thinking that existed when it was created." Albert Einstein

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Jan 1970
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    7,044
    All right now, son, I want you to get a good night's rest. And remember, I could murder you while you sleep.
    Hey son, I bought you a puppy today after work. But then I killed it and ate it! Hahah, I´m just kidding. I would never buy you a puppy.

    "Three witches watch three Swatch watches. Which witch watch which Swatch watch?"

    "Three switched witches watch three Swatch watch switches. Which switched witch watch which Swatch watch switch?."

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