knife fights(whose been in them) (what did ya do)

[Slater_E]

Hey all. I'm new to the message bord.
I have been in a couple of fights but nothing too serious.
Recentley though some guy my age (about 17) pulled a knife. He was shaky and didn't know what he was doing. I just pulled a groin kick, kind of swiped teh knife to the side and then decked him in the side of the head. nothing too big. he went down pretty easy.
I was wondering though, what knife fights have any of you been in? and what tactics did you use that either won the fight or caused you to lose?
I'm not scared of getting hurt, but I don't like to get sliced open. I have had an accident or two with knives and a nice cut or stab hurts like heck.(understatement)
what do you guys suggest I do if the situation presents itself again and I'm faced with someone more experienced?


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"In a fight, there is no second place."

[Sihing73]

Slater_E,

First of all if you find yourself in a knife fight expect to get cut. Prepare your mind for that eventuality as it will happen. If you are able to, and have the time to do so, take off a jacket and wrap it around your weak arm. Then use that as a shield while attacking with the other hand. You can use anything even your shoes to protect your hands while parrying a knife, though it is unlikely you will have time to take them off [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif[/img] Next thing is to use your belt if you are wearing one or pick up a stick or garbage can lid. One very nice improvised weapon is a car antenna. Rip one off of the nearest car, though they are getting scarcer, and you will have a formidable weapon which will slice up your opponent almost as nicely as a knife. But, your best option is to get away.

I have had the misfortune of being in a few knife encounters. As a result of one I have a severed tendon in my left hand. The guy slashed and I blocked with a stick. Only thing I forgot was to move my hand when he fell forward and slid the knife down the stick into my left hand. Oh well, I learned from that. Brings up a good point just because you block the knifes first move does not mean there won't be a second. I have also been stabbed twice in my left bicep and gut a slash across my right forearm. In each of the attacks, I was able to recover from the injury and take my attacker down. The one where I got stabbed was three on one. Another reason to run if you get the chance, it's not worth it.

While in the military we were taught to accept a cut to the outside of our weak hand in order to get a killing blow with the other hand. Works great if you can stand up to it. But, all those scars are nice conversation pieces.

Best advice is to get distance and run. Barring that I say attack the vitals and accept you will get cut. This does not mean you don't try not to get cut but it is unrealistic to expect to walk away from a knife fight without some type of injury. If you want some really good preparation then try some of the Kali arts as the blade is a preferred weapon.

Oh, for those of you thinking I look for trouble, I was a police officer for several years and even did a stint as a prison guard. Hence the excessive violence. Plus some people think I am just plain ugly and take offense to my darling personality [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif[/img]

Peace,

Dave

[Ford Prefect]

I've never been in one if you don't somebody attacking me with a knife when I was in high school. It was winter, and I had on a winter jacket. The blade didn't make it through. It was a crappy knife and it was only a half-hearted attempt because I knew the guy and he was just stabbing at my arms rather than my head, neck, or body. It was still kinda scary though.

I have seen a couple brutal knife attacks though. Nobody had any training and it just ended with a lot of blood being spilled. One kid even had to get air lifted to the hospital because the blade broke off in his back.

Stay clear of 'em. If you run into somebody not skiddish to use the knife, you'll be in a world of pain.

[Wudang]

It is quite easy to knock a knife out of someone's hand by striking either the tendons in the wrist, the knuckles, or the back of the hand with a hard object. It's called "defanging the snake".

[Robinf]

Wudang,

That technique should be called "painful". We practice some knife defense techniques and my partner has become quite adept at hitting that spot on me. I finally got her the last couple of times.

Fortunately, I've only had practice with rubber knives. I've never been in a knife fight.

Wow. I'm in a sheltered environment.

The only knife fight I ever saw was in junior high...some kid got slashed and bled all over my history classroom. Specifically, my desk. My a-hole teacher wouldn't clean it up since it might be evidence, and since it was public school, there was no room for me to move anywhere, so I had to try to concentrate on history with a big, chunky, schmear of blood across my desk.

I made it 15 minutes before I had to run out and puke.

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Peace.
Reverend Tim

[Sihing73]

Wudang,

Defanging the snake is quite popular among fillipino arts. However, if you think it is that easy and will work on the street I suggest you rethink your options. I agree that if you have a weapon, like a stick, to hit the opponent with you may have an advantage. However, the wrist is a small target and many knife fighters train to change directions while using the knife. I am not saying it is impossible to knock the knife out of someones hand but you need to consider the other persons mental attitude. For example, when I was stabbed in the arm I did not even pause, I just nailed the guy who stabbed me. I am sure he "thought" a knife in my arm would have more effect. If the attacker has any type of sensitivity he will be able to nullify a strike to his wrist, provided you can hit that target while under the stress of actual combat and while the target is moving. In real life people do not take a stance and brandish the knife. Most attack swiftly without warning and you may not even know a knife is present until you are cut.

Please do not take offense I am not trying to preach or put anyone down. The only thing I am trying to get across is that a knife is a dangerous weapon. The best option is to run away. If you must fight then I have found it more beneficial to pass the knife and attack the persons center or vitals. I find it hard for them to continue if they no longer have an eye or thier throat no longer transfers oxygen to the brain. Some advocate controlling the weapon. I advocate controling the attacker. As I said I managed, more by luck and the grace of God, to take each of my attackers out of commision after being cut. Your best weapon is a strong will. And, a good pair of Reeboks [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif[/img]

Peace,

Dave

[Sihing73]

Oh, one last thing, after re-reading Robinfs' post I would like to point out the fact that although she states her opponent has gotten quite good at the "defanging" technique. Robin has been able to "get" her opponent a few times as well. Remember, you can hit him several times, all he really needs is one good cut or thrust and you will be in a world of hurt.

Peace,

Dave

[nospam]

Good use of humour in your posts Sihing73.

I agree with Sihing73 about being prepared to get cut if you get into a knife fight. There are sooo many variables when it comes to knife defense. The best, if at all possible, is to get the **** out of the situation as fast as possible.

I have had a knife pulled on me on two occasions. The first one (and first time), it was obvious to me that the dude wasn't serious to begin with..so disarming him by hoofing the knife-weilding hand wasn't hard at all. Actually, it surprised both of us! I didn't have any martial art training at that time..just reflex. The second time occured many moons later. The knife was brandished in my face. I zoned and things went into slow-mo as I gained control of the person by stepping in very close to their body and seizing the knife-weilding hand and twisting the hand out and away from both of us while my other hand seized the throat.

I do not know if the person was serious or not. But I do know 2 things:

1) if possible, leave.
2) if 1 is not possible, you need to gain control of the knife-weilding arm quickly while simultaneously seizing control of the attackers body/balance. IN my experience, the throat is prime "A" grade beef.


Shows over folks. Time to go home.

[savagemonk]

Well NOSPAM has the right idea if you leed your opponent towards the side that is holding the weapon it will help you when you gain control of there hand that is holding the weapon. try to bolk or perry the thrust or stab towards the inside of their body at this point try to gain control of hand w/weapon turn it into their body. this will make the weapon face them or you can turn it away from them which means you would need to remove the weapon some how . this is not a very good way to learn I suggest you seek a competent SIFU to show you how. GOOD LUCK

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savagemonk

[Slater_E]

thanks guys for all yoru info. I'm a student of five animal style Kung-Fu, but I wanted to hear form some fairly regular people who have had experiences with it.

[Seeker of the Way]

Knife fights are really, really icky. I've been in two ever. I was sliced upside my lower arm, and got the knife away with a nasty finger strike to the man's wrist. I followed with a kick to his abdomen, and then ran like hell. I was lucky, and not even that lucky. My golden rule is: They pull a knife, you run like hell. A unlucky strike can render you dead or permanently lame. There is nothing glamorous in knife fights. Just run. Trust me on this one.

SotW

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The dance of life, the capering of elements, and skip of gods. The dance is mine, I AM the dance.

[Highlander]

Well, I was in a crowded diner in Texas when I saw this kid minding his own business. So I dumped my drink in his lap and pushed him off his stool. At that point he pulled out a knife. So I whipped off my pewter frog belt, swung it, striking the knife with the buckle and distroying his personal property. Then I pulled my pants up and called my lawyer to insure that I'd be in the clear and the victom would go to jail.

No ........ wait ..... that wasn't me.
I must have read it somewhere.

[GinSueDog]

My brother was having coffee at a coffee house with a couple of friends when he witnessed a knife attack. From what he said it happened real quick. A guy was sitting at a table outside with a girl when another guy walked up to him, they appeared to argue for a few minutes. Then out of nowhere the guy standing pulled a blade and stabbed the guy sitting in the side of the neck. The wounded guy tried to stand but just ended up falling out of his chair. My brother believes the guy died. The other guy, the police found a couple of shops down playing Tekken at Sega City. BTW, a quick note to back up Wudang, defragging the snake works well if you practice it and is extremely effective against those that are not skilled with blade work. Like anything else it just takes practice. I seen a couple of knife attacks but I don't think they drive home the same point like the one my brother saw.-ED

[This message has been edited by GinSueDog (edited 06-02-2000).]

[JWTAYLOR]

Well, I've obviously been laying low on this one, but Highlander has already chimed in for me. Next time I'll just grab some other guy and hold him in front of me.

That was the second experience involving the knife, the first one was much more serious. I got stabbed in the lower back one day while I was playing video games. I have no idea why the guy started stabbing, but I caught his movement just out of the corner of my left eye. I was able to move left and forward so that the first one got into my left side, but just into the meat on the side, no organ damage. The next two stabbs I blocked down and them up with my forearms, which are still scarred. On the third stab I punched, I think a couple of times but I'm not sure. I got him square in the nose. Then I grabbed his throat. He hit the ground, and I ran. I guess it was a victory, but I got hurt worse in the long run than he did. I still have no idea who he was, or why he was trying to stab me. He was pretty frantic about it at the time. It wasn't very calculated swinging, just rapid stabbing.

His attack style is what I use to judge all knife training from. Sadly, even in my own art, most techniques fail. Even Arnis and Kali don't do so well against a close in attacker making numerous light stabbs. Unlike a punch, the blade doesn't need much power. So little jabs that wouldn't hurt a bit with a hand become one of the most deadly techniques with a knife.

What saved my life wasn't the block, or the punch. It was the "cover". The immediate movement back and to the left that put me off the line of attack.
So what do I think is the key to blade defense.
Footwork. And that is taught first by stepping, and THEN by running.
Everyone always say, "run away". And that's god advice. But what they fail to mention is that you have to turn your back to run away and that's most likely when you'll be stabbed. You may get a couple a yards away, but bleeding and hurt, he'll be able to catch you pretty quick and finish the job. So learn HOW and WHEN to run away first.
JWT

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If you pr!ck us, do we not bleed? If you poison us, do we not die? And if you wrong us, shall we not revenge? If we are like you in the rest, we will resemble you in that the villany you teach me, I will execute, and it shall go hard but I will better the instruction. MOV