Hung Gar Tang Fong Lineage?

[hasayfu]

I posted originally on this site to see what other people's opinions are in regards to the differences of Lam Sai Wing lineage and Tang Fong lineage, but as to date no one has been able to answer me.

What is not answered? You asked if someone was TF lineage. You got a few. You asked about Mui Fah, I think you got that too.

Anything else?

[Hungfutkune]

I guess I didn't make myself clear in my original posting.(Doesn't anybody scroll up anymore?) I was asking if anybody knew what the differences between the lineages were? More to do with the difference in the movements and focus of the forms, breath and training. I already know the differences between the forms in Mui Far Kuen (TF versus LSW), but I was wondering what other peoples opinions were.
Also if there are any other pratitioners who know the Hung Fut Kune form and if they were ever taught it in a Hung Gar class?

Thanks

[Je Lei Sifu]

HungFutKune,

I first would like to start off by saying that the Moi Fa Kuen is not a part of Tang Fong's lineage. He Sigung is Ho Lap Tin. Ho Lap Tin trained with Tang Fong since the time he was in China teaching at the Yi Yong Tong. Ho Lap Tin learned everything that Tang Fong taught and taught these things to his students as well but the Moi Fa Kune set was not a part of the curriculum.

The Kuen Toh (Fist Sets) which were taught by Tang Fong are;

1.) Gung Ji Fook Fu Kuen
2.) Fu Hok Sueng Ying Kuen
3.) Ng Ying Kuen
4.) Gau Duk Lin Waan Kuen
5.) Teet Sin Kuen

Although there are some physical differences between Lam Sai Wing's and Tang Fong's system of training, the faht (method) is still the same. More or less the shape of some movements are different, but the applications are the same.

The other difference is that Tang Fong lineage breaks the Gung Ji Fook Fu Kuen into two different sets because of the lenght of the form which is hard for some beginning students. The form is broken into Gung Ji Kuen and Fook Fu Kuen. Also, Lam Sai Wing's branch does not teach the Gau Duk Lin Waan Kuen.

I hope I was able to answer somethings for you.

Peace

Jerry Battle

[hasayfu]

my, my. Your first post was answered, you said in your second post "I just wanted to know what the difference in each lineage was and if there was any other people who studied Tang Fong lineage. " buried within a bunch of other stuff, which was good by the way.

OK, I should read closer next time. []

Unfortunately, your question needs some qualification. That's like asking what is the difference between the two sifu's you saw. I bet a lot on the surface and probably more as you dig. In the end, however, it's the similarities that bind us as family.

For example, Subitai on the list and I started at the same time with the same sifu. We worked out together for an extended time and pretty much share the same philosophy and understanding of Hung Gar. In fact, we are in frequent communication refining both.

That said, if you were to watch us perform our Hung Gar, you would see differences. I guarantee that his students and mine look more different. And I'm talking about students who have trained for over 3 years and are currently still studying from us.

Now you are asking about the difference of lineages that have 100s of 1000s of students each and down 4 or 5 generations. That should give you the magnitude of your seemingly simple question.

On the surface, Je Lei Sifu gave you some diffs. The two biggies in my mind are the use of Yee Gee Kim Yeung Ma in Gung Gee and Fu Hok for Tang Fang but not in LSW and that LSW has Sup Ying instead of Ng Ying.

For Hung Fut Kune, scroll up (J/K). I answered that in my first post to you. It's most likely from, get this, the style called Hung Fut. Which is Hung Gar with Fut Gar. It's not considered a Hung Gar form by either lineages.

Hey, don't take offense to my flip remarks. Just giving back a little for your scrolling comment.

On a different topic, since you put it out there, who are the vancouver sifus? Are they open to visitors? I head up there every now and then and I make it a point to visit as many Hung Gar players as I can. We learn from our differences and from what we do the same.

[Hungfutkune]

Haysafu - no offense taken in the scrolling, if anything I deserved that one. At times I like to be a bit sarcastic but only in a joking manner, so I never want to come off by offending anyone . My sifu in Vancouver is a very private teacher so I will ask him if it is ok with him before I mention his name on this forum. Hopefully he won't mind, because he does have a lot to offer to the martial arts world in general, and honestly his Kung Fu is some of the best Traditional Hung Gar i've ever seen. I only wish my schedule would let me keep training there.
By the way when you go to Vancouver do you ever hook up with any Hung gar schools there? And where are you based out of?

Jerry battle - I also thank you for your comments. It's good to see other Tang Fong people around. In vancouver it is only LSW lineage.
I thank all of you for posting your opinions and getting me a little more caught up in the Martial Arts world. I'm sorry that I'm not thanking all of the people who posted on this forum, but to be honest with you, I'm a little lazy to scroll up!

[TenTigers]

I'm not sure if this was mentioned, but..Tang Fong 'style'(if I may be so bold) is also known for more sinking of the horse and gathering of power, as well as in some techniques to be a bit more yeilding in order to draw the opponent into cum na sao. This is due to the fact that Tang Fong was smaller in stature than Lam Sai-Wing-who was a pig butcher, and known for his size and strength, and also had a backround in Northen Gung-Fu as well, so the forms are played a little higher and "lighter"(?). Ok, that being said, let me also contradict myself by saying that the interpetation of the form is based entirely on the Sifu, and that there are plenty of Lam Sai-Wing practitioners that have deep low horses, and utilize whole body strength.
Hung Tiger Shullman's ? Dang! I wanted to be that!
-Rik

[DeathTouch]

you still can ten tigers , the tiger schulman's of the hung system are found in any city in your local area lol. Hint follow the yee and get robbed till ya bleeeeed lol

[Keng Geng]

I know for a fact your sifu would not want his name posted here, so don't bother asking him.

[hasayfu]

HungFutKune,

I'm glad you took my post exactly as it was meant. some good fun. If your sifu is private, I can totally respect that. I don't get up to Vancouver too often. Might go in the summer. Last time I did not visit any Hung Gar sifus there.

FYI, I am based in Sunnyvale, CA at Wing Lam Kung Fu.

Ten Tigers,

I may agree on the low stances but being "yielding" is a hallmark of our kwoon and from what I have learned, signature to Lam Jo and Chiu Wai lines. Not arguing, just from what I've seen.

That said. I do notice a lot of Hung Gar guys play their game very hard. (From both lines) I think it's how we are taught to start but soften at the high levels.