Choy Lay Fut Hand Sets List

[Ben Gash]

The Tuet Jin I know (which is very similar to LKH/TMW's) isn't Hung like in the least. Indeed, it's probably one of the most representative CLF sets. Also, there is no Tuet Jin in Hung Gar. There's a Tuet Sin (Iron thread) which is a hard Qigong set in the iron shirt mould.

[Mika]

Then I must be mistaken. Maybe it's another form that I am thinking of now. Like I said, spelling might pose a problem or two every once in a while...

But the translation given to me was Iron Arrow or Iron Spear. Anton used the same translation.

I think that what is representative of Choy Lee Fut and what is not is a matter of opinion to a degree. Choy Lee Fut is so, so wide in its material.

It's kind of hard to explain, but let's say Siu Mui Fa is more the kind of Choy Lee Fut with which I am familiar. If you then see the difference, then we might be talking about the same form. If you don't see the difference, we still might be talking about the same form..

But the length is a dead giveaway, I think.

Nonetheless, same form or not, Chan Family Choy Lee Fut has that kind of form, whether it has anything to do with the form discussed here or not...

Cheers,

Mika

[Mika]

Here's a site: http://www.geocities.com/Colosseum/B...hungforms.html

And the form I am referring to is called Tiet Sien Kuen (iron wire form). It's the third form from the top (one of the three core forms of Hung Gar).

How different this form is from the Choy Lee Fut form that I have learned, I do not know. But I am told this is the basis for the form by the same (or very similar) name in the Choy Lee Fut system. And to me it feels very different from other CLF forms and is very much alike the little Hung Gar I have seen.

Maybe JoeX could elaborate?

//mika

[Gwa Sow Chop]

One huge problem with compilations and generalizations......

One problem, for instance with the form Sup Chi.(or dai sup chi)
I have learnt it from 3 differant lineages, and have 3 TOTALLY different forms.

We are assuming that the forms are the same. But alas it is often not so. The only similarity is in name only.

Dont get me wrong, I am not saying that all the sets are differant in all lineages....just that when lineage A says "Do you do XYZ set?" and they reply "yes we do XYZ also".....it dosent mean anything other than "we also have a set NAMED XYZ".

You really have to compare and visualized the set to see if they are the same. Bec ause they often aren't, especially as you compare the other branches of CLF.

Now, a visual cataloge put together by the interrested parties....that would be better. THEN you can compare
apples with apples.

Train hard

GSC

[Fu-Pow]

Tid Jin Cheong Kuen=Iron Arrow Long Fist
Tuet Jin Kuen= "Escape the Circle" or "Break Holds" Fist

Totally different Chinese Characters.

I actually should have included Tid Jin Cheong Kuen to the list. Originally I thought it was a form that was unique to Doc Fai Wong/Lau Bun lineage but now I see that it is quite common place.

[extrajoseph]

Someone pointed this article out to me when we were talking about Bagua sets, you may find it useful to your research.

http://www.clfma.com/modules.php?op=...rtid=50&page=1

JX

[Fu-Pow]

Thanks for that link XJ.

I edited a few more into the list.

Tid Jin Cheong Kuen
External Yin Yang Sticky Hands
Left-Right Single Leg Kicking form

[SifuX-HSK]

why would anyone want to learn every form in choy lee fut anyway? when would you have the time in your busy schedules to perfect each and every single choy lee fut form? because what it all comes down to is how you use your choy lee fut.

forgive me for coming on strong i am not in a good mood, but this has ignited me to respond. so forgive me in advance.

who cares if one branch has more forms to learn than the other? the buk sing branch supposedly has only 3 clf forms in their teachings, but they are well known for their fighting prowess.
does that make them any less of a clf school?

the chan clan has all these sets and claim they are exclusive to the chan family. first of all they are only exclusive to the chan family because the chan family create these forms and teach them to their people only. therefore, their forms are exclusively chan. but you come to our school you will learn jow yau biu ser, and fu pow will call that an obscure form because it is not on the chan family list of sets.

well, check this out, the chan family sets are the ones obscure because they are not taught in the hung sing schools around the world that have pure fut san hung sing kwoon in their lineages!!!
fu pow, for you to say that anything not chan family sets are obscure is utterly rediculous!!!!!!!! i am sorry for coming on so strong, but ......oh never mind!!!!!!!!!

who can say truthfully and honestly what was created when jeong yim and chan heung began creating forms for their schools.
who is to say that forms were actually taught back then? who is to say that maybe choy lee fut only started out as techniques and was later built from their.

according to the fut san hung sing kwoon, the fut san ping kuen, cheung kuen, and i think it was kau da was created by chan ngau sing himself after the death of jeong hung sing. all three sets were created from one large set called in and out ba gwa given to jeong yim by the green grass monk.

in and out ba kwa contained 1080 moves and chan ngau sing broke it up into 3 forms.

the chan family does not have these forms as we have them. so then who has the obscure forms?

so fu pow, all fingers do not point to the chan family because as you know this is a touchie subject, but chan family clf is NOT the begining, and is NOT the end of Choy Lee Fut. you have all of the true hung sing and buk sing kwoons against the chan family. this battle will not be won this way.

if you want to be true to the choy lee fut your founder chan heung, and my founder jeong hung sing created together you must list all the sets taught from each and every school of choy lee fut or else you will look like a chan family supporter only looking out for the good of the chan family.

if you want to be honest, list my schools sets, the sets from the fut san hung sing kwoon, all the buk sing sets, all singapore hsk sets, macau's sets, indonesia's sets, vietnam's sets, etc, etc.

are you telling me they are not choy lee fut because the sets they have in their lineage were no created by chan heung? did'nt chan heung create these forms himself? is he not a man? a human being? those forms were not handed down to chan heung from god himself!!!!!!

if you created a form, if joseph created a form if i created a form, you better be **** sure it will be choy lee fut cause at least from my end, choy lee fut is all i know. if chan heung, a mere male human being can create forms to advance his "family exclusive system" then anyone creating a form-as long as they do not include techniques from outside systems-is truly creating a "Choy Lee Fut form"!!! who are you to say it is not true clf because it wasn't created by chan heung.

oh well, sorry

frank

[SifuX-HSK]

iron arrow is not taught in the lau bun branch of hung sing choy lee fut.

if doc fai wong teaches it he learned it somewhere else.

another form fu pow forgot to add was um ying ba kwa kuen,
jow yau pow choy
cloud piercing spear,
and much more.

frank

[Ben Gash]

"who cares if one branch has more forms to learn than the other?"
Um, at what point were any of us talking about that?
"why would anyone want to learn every form in choy lee fut anyway?"
Curiosoty? Enjoyment? A challenge? Because they're there?

[CLFNole]

Frank:

Why don't you send Fu Pow your list of forms. I am sure he would add them to the mix. I think he was just compiling a list of CLF forms not Chan Family forms.

Ng Ying Baat Kwa was included and is seen in both lines.

I agree with you 100% that no one needs to know all of these sets nor is anyone likely to learn them all. However just because someone knows lets say 30 sets and another knows 5-10, it doesn't mean either is more CLF or better because of it. I know people who know only a few sets that are very good and some who know a lot sets that are also very good. That being said I know people that know a few sets and suck and others that know a lot of sets and suck.

Bottom line is kung fu is about the individual, not their lineage or pedigree. Its about how much time, effort and sweat they out in to learn, develop and understand our style. Hung sing, buk sing and Chan family, its all CLF, we have the same root system steming from the shaolin tree.

Peace.

[SifuX-HSK]

first of all i agree that learning more sets can be fun and exciting and keep you from being bored. but let me ask a question?.......

can any of you who have learned more than 10 sets now, honestly say you are a master of these forms? do you truly understand these forms inside and out. do you know each and every usage from each set without getting them mixex up?

my big gripe was fu pow saying anything not on the chan's plum blossom list of sets was obscure. that was a pretty single sided comment. what about the buk sing branches sets? what about the hung sing kwoons all around the world, not every school is going to have the same sup ji kau da?!

i wish if he is going to list choy lee fut sets then make a list which includes each and every set from every choy lee fut school out there. i am sure that list will contain more than 400 sets in total with all three branches contributing.

yes in the definition of obscure, a choy lee fut set exclusive to one branch may be obscure...not easily recognizable by another branch, but to say it is only obscure because it is not a chan set makes me mad.

frank

[Sho]

A bit side-tracked, but I was just wondering which particular schools use the name Che Kuen as an equivalent of Ng Lun Choy? I have noticed that Lee Koon Hung's instructional poster is entitled 'Ng Lun Choy', but then again some Hung Sing schools use Che Kuen. So, are they the exact same forms - regardless of the differences between lineages - in a similar way as, for example, the Chan Family Siu Moi Fa Kuen is akin to the Hung Sing Siu Moi Fa Kuen?

[CLFNole]

Certain names are interchangeable.

My sifu, Lee Koon Hung used both names Li Ma/Ng Lun Ma and Che Kuen/Ng Lun Choy. The correct technical names are Ng Lun Ma and Ng Lun Choy. I believe Li Ma and Che Kuen are kind of slang names.

Peace.

[TenTigers]

does anyone know the sets in Buk Sing Choy Lay Fut? I have heard that they only have about 4-5 sets. It would be interesting to see these sets as well.