CMA type roundhouse in Muy Thai?

[omarthefish]

Originally posted by SifuAbel
"You practically busted a nut over there too at the implication that people should keep routed during sparring. "

Rooted is one thing. Stop-action robo-fu is another.

Yes. I get your point there. I'm coming from a bagua perspective and we are hardly known for "stop action robo-fu".

Either way the statement is bullshizz. I had plenty of root.

o.k. fine. You had plenty of root. You happy now? Don't get yer panties in a bunch. I didn't realize my approval was so important.

[MasterKiller]

Originally posted by SevenStar
thai punches are of the straight variety only, from what I'm told - no hooks or uppercuts. Also, the thai punches angle downward - probably a result of the high guard some use.

In your opinion, is the Western style superior to the traditional Thai way? It seems like hooks and uppercuts are pretty valuable tools. Is there any particular reason why the traditional fighters do not use them?

[SevenStar]

Originally posted by MasterKiller
In your opinion, is the Western style superior to the traditional Thai way? It seems like hooks and uppercuts are pretty valuable tools. Is there any particular reason why the traditional fighters do not use them?

Since I haven't experienced it, I really can't comment. Hooks and uppercuts are definitely valuable tools though. Maybe it's a power issue? the teep is a probing kick, but everything else is powerful - designed to KYTFO. the hook and uppercut aren't power shots. Dunno if that has anything to do with it, just a specualtion...

[omarthefish]

A hook isn't a power shot!?!

I think my hook maybe stronger than my cross. My teacher was a Thai who included both hooks and uppercuts though. I've never heard this before. The difference I saw, as we had kickboxers sharing the gym with us, was in the foot work and in the guard. I never learned a particularly high guard. Both fists were basically at face level, hammerfist facing out towards the kicks.

I thought the blocking style we learned was more effective against a gloveless opponent that what I saw and still see boxers use. We always kept a lead hand considerably ****her forward. Our stance was pretty close to 45 degrees rather than straight on. The punching was affected by this. The bigges influence on the punching style was the way we were taught to co-ordinate it with out stepping and the in-and-out style he favoured. I was surprised at how much power it felt like I was getting extra from hooking on the way out. Pulling my body back away as the hook is nearly landing seems to add some sort of weird centripital force or something.

The biggest difference in the hand work was definately the blocking thouh.

[ShaolinTiger00]

A hook isn't a power shot!?!

Sevenstar and I have had this conversation.

He's correct. Technically all "power" punches come from the rear hand. even though the hook causes more knockouts.

It is a very powerful shot certainly.

[SevenStar]

A good hook causes that head jolting action that makes the world spin - that's what causes the ko - it somehow scrambles the communication between your body and your brain.

[omarthefish]

Well fill me in guys because I haven't had the conversation before.

ST, it's a bit of a red herring for me to bring this up but....hooks can come from the rear hand too you know. I'm guessing your point was more along the lines of a real "power shot" needing to be drivin off the rear leg? Something about structure and all that. But I am going partly just by the effect I have on the bag. I seems like I can bend it just as good if not better with some of my hooks than my crosses. I suspect it has more than a little to do with the extent of my Bagua training. It's very very circular in it's power generation. I spend an awfull lot of my time on the bag even working out how to generate power for hooking, looping type punches from the bai bu-kou bu combination. It means I often land the punches from a very pigeon toed stance.

I also like to get in close enough to use the transition from a square horse to a bow stance for hooks. It sounds weird but I could show you easy enough. The stances just aren't that deep and I'm talking about those really tight hooks to the body that you can throw from a clinch. So it seems to me that you can still get power of the back leg added in and not rely purely on waist power.

[omarthefish]

p.s. the first type I picked up from Bagua but the second type I described is much more Baji type power generation.

[SevenStar]

The cross is a power shot - throw a crow, put some stank on it, and it does damage.

The hook is like the dim mak of boxing - it doesn't require tremendous power to be effective. you can throw alot of power into it off either the front or rear hands, but it doesn't require tremendous power to drop someone with.

[Water Dragon]

I'm right handed, but fight Southpaw. My right hook is definately my most powerful punch.

[SevenStar]

your hook may do more damage, but not soley because of it's power...

When you hit a bag, your hook lands with more impact than your cross?

[omarthefish]

I think so. It's hard to tell for sure though because I can't throw a cross on the really hard part of the bag. A cross definately has more follow through but I am skeptical of the power. I totally get your point, I'm just skeptical.

The way the bag is harder down low and softer higher up makes it hard to compare. I don't have access to a banana bag here.. The bag is pretty big but still. The bag folds more on a cross but it is so clearly because I am hitting the softer upper middle part and my most powerfull hook is NOT a shot to the head. It's a body shot. To the head, I totally agree with you. But if I was to compare a rib shot thrown from in real tight . . . I don't know. I get a pretty good thump that way. To the head, if forearms are allowed, there's a Baji shot that looks like a hook but is actually a strike with the arm that I can bend the bag with more than most guys round kicks. THAT's my most powerfull shot. But that's not technically a hook I guess.

******! I'm sore as **** and now I'm going to have to go back to the gym special today just to try and see if my hook really is more powerfull than my cross. (or not)

[SevenStar]

Originally posted by omarthefish
******! I'm sore as **** and now I'm going to have to go back to the gym special today just to try and see if my hook really is more powerfull than my cross. (or not)

Have fun.