Adrenal responses and lifting cars

[mickey]

There definitely is a connection here. The adrenals are not interpreted separately from the kidneys in Chinese medicine. In some of the Chinese styles that developed during times of war (developed to accelerate skills in a short period of time) the chi of the kidneys were tapped like a faucet through various internal exercises. The five element method of internal development and other meditation practices, requiring a protracted period of training, were neglected.

mickey

[mickey]

Those internal practices for the short cut were classified under wai kung.

mickey

[blooming lotus]

Originally posted by mickey
Greetings,

I gave Ford's explanations much thought before responding. I completely disagree; especially with his example if the elite weightlifter. Under a high stress (adrenaline inducing) situation, that person should be that much stronger.

Ford's analysis does not explain a six year old's ability to keep an injection needle from piercing through his skin.

mickey

I think that can be explained....when I saw the wheel of life tour, I noticed that when they did the spear balancing tricks / stunts that the points ( un-noticable to the untrained eye ) were places that can a. be protected with correct diaphram control and B. are dim mak free zones ( ie: not as easily suseptible to damage )

as for the pcp and resulting strength...are you trying to tell us here that this is not a nueralogical reaction.....?????

It still comes from volition volumised through the drug-induced beleif they can do whatever display of stregth you're seeing....like dutch courage..but it's still all nueral - muscular and it all comes back to volition ......


and qi....

[mickey]

Hi blooming lotus,

I've got news for you(smiling). I was that six year old. And that was long before I ever heard of Iron Shirt, Golden Bell, Achilles, or Fong Si Yu.

mickey

[blooming lotus]

ok...( smiling also)


but ...ahhh........the rest of your point???? like phsiologically or in western terms????

[mickey]

Hi,

My point is that Ford's explanation does not cover everything that can occur as a result of the adrenal response. Therefore it is not valid.

mickey

[mickey]

to continue:

I only share my experiences to help people where I can. That was my initial purpose for joining this forum. I really did not want to talk about the needle incident because I thought that I had said enough to encourage people to look a little deeper than the surface. And you know what? Mentioning it still may not help that.

mickey

[blooming lotus]

people will find internal practice and be ready to accept it intellectually and emotionally when they are......they'll find it or they won't...arguing is fruitless

[Serpent]

My god, bl has found a kindred spirit in mickey.

Or has she made another id so that at least one person will agree with her?

[blooming lotus]

you look forwad to chatting with me right...

lol.....

thx for following me around the boards, but I'm kinda busy at the moment....


I'm flattered though....really

compliment accepted

[Ford Prefect]

KKM?

[Merryprankster]

pcp does not induce any neuromuscular--or, indeed, neurological response. it is classified as a disassociative. it removes the ability of your mind to connect cause and effect. you may attempt to call this "neurological reaction," but that would completely inaccurate, as pcp has no effect on the nerves - it does not cause them to do anything biologically different. it only removes awareness of the world. consequently, your body's inhibitions disappear - hence the "increased strength," which is not an increase at all. in mechanical terms, you've haven't souped up the engine, you've just removed the restrictor plate from the accelerator. so no - there is no "increase in strength." your body is no more capable than it ever was, you're just taking the safety off. as far as volition, i would venture to say there is less...there is a significant difference between not believing you can't do something and believe you can.

mickey is wrong about ford's explanation. it is completely adequate for the issue at hand. there are a host of other adrenal responses; pupil dilation, increased heart rate, raise in blood pressure, constriction of blood vessels, increased breathing, increased muscle tension, reduction of peripheral vision....

however, the question is "how do they get 'increased strength?' the answer is, they don't. if your body were an engine, and it put out 90 hp at max load, adrenaline would simply allow you to tap in to all 90 hp. however, it doesn't create a 300 hp engine. there is NO increase in your strength.

Under a high stress (adrenaline inducing) situation, that person should be that much stronger.

see above. the difference is that instead of a 90 hp engine, you're STARTING with a 200 hp one. so of course they are stronger. not only that, but it's a high performance one; the difference between what they are capable of doing with a restrictor plate in place might be only 10 hp, because it's designed with performance - squeezing every ounce of oomph out of it already - in mind adrenaline only maximizes your potential and these guys train practically to that all the time anyway - there's not much reserve to call on because they can already tap into most of what they have. conversely, the normal person is the run of the mill 90 hp - and they might only be optimized for say 70 hp, so they get 20 hp out of the deal.

In other words, as ford pointed out, the deficit is greater for the normal person, but the elite athlete can output more. further, the elite athlete is less likely to injure themselves - 10 hp for that guy only represents about 5% over the redline - whereas 20 hp is nearly 35% over the redline for the less in shape person....and as everybody knows, the more you blow by specs, the greater chance of breakdown.

don't like engines? use beer glasses or anything with a failure limit...

Once again, i'm not suggesting that chi doesn't exist, that's not really the point here; i'm showing that you don't need it to explain this as there is a biofeedback mechanism, well known and understood, which handles this already.

[Merryprankster]

Iron,

The bowl thing is suction, pure and simple. They use their abs to push air out of the bowl, and it sticks to their belly. Notice that they always get somebody to pull the bowl from the end? If that guy stuck his finger between the bowl and the abs, it would come right off because the seal is broken.

I once had some VERY credulous individual tell me that the reason you can't do that is because it interrupts the chi flow. Ummm... no, it lets air into the bowl, equalizes the pressure and the bowl falls off.

Every single one of the monk's demonstrations can be explained by simple physics. every one. this doesn't disprove chi, but it certainly says we don't need it to understand these demonstrations.

now, you can complicate these tricks by claiming chi if you like, but then, i can argue that they are the result of intelligent microscopic life forms that like monks and help hold the bowl in place....

[Merryprankster]

all i can say is dp/pp.

[Nick Forrer]

Hi MP

I always wondered why it is that so called demonstrations of chi/iron shirt involve having bricks/poles smashed over parts of your body which are naturally tough and can be toughened further (like the skull/arms/torso) and never over the face (say). Im pretty sure that If I were to smash a monk in the face with a brick his nose would break.