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Thread: Adrenal responses and lifting cars

  1. #46
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    MP and FP have taken the correct to a deserted locale, run a train on it, and forced it to star in a series of high-budget posts.
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    What's dp/pp?

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  3. #48
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    pp is post pics.

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  4. #49
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    Originally posted by Merryprankster
    KKM is a notorious internet, martial arts troll from way back, KingKnightMare. He now goes by Masterkiller.
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  5. #50
    Hello Merryprankster and Greetings,

    I am still waiting for an explanation for the needle incident. Your nor Ford's explanation does not cover it. If the explanation you both put forth is valid, then it should address all types of adrenaline induced situations.

    mickey

  6. #51
    Originally posted by Merryprankster

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  7. #52
    Originally posted by Ford Prefect
    Absolute strength: The absolute amount of force your muscles are capable of producing.

    Maximal Strength: The amount of force your muscles can produce voluntarily.

    Strength Defecit: The discrepency between the two.

    The average woman with her lean muscle mass most likely doesn't even have the potential to lift a car. Adrenaline doesn't give you strength. It only breaks down the limits imposed by your CNS (Central Nervous System) to lessen or completely remove your strength deficit.

    The effects of adrenaline on an elite lifter's strength is even less because through years of training, he has lessened his strength deficit and is using a much larger percentage of his absolute strength than a normal man.
    this has always intrigued me. It seems like there should be a way to voluntarily produce maximal strength...there's not though.
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  8. #53
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    I am still waiting for an explanation for the needle incident. Your nor Ford's explanation does not cover it. If the explanation you both put forth is valid, then it should address all types of adrenaline induced situations.
    hello, and our explanation is more than adequate. as i pointed out, adrenaline rush causes peripheral vision loss. however, this has nothing to do with the subject at hand either; namely the strength issue. one can study, articulate and explain the pain killing properties of cocaine, which works through one pathway, without discussing it's rather interesting dopamine effects in the brain. i can adequately express methamphetamine's stimulant effects, without discussing its anticholinergic properties. i can describe opiates' painkilling effects without delving inro their anti-tussive properties, etc. hormones and drugs have different effects on different systems. re: neuromuscular biofeedback, adrenaline can shut down the safety. it's pretty simple.

    consequently, i don't have to explain your needle incident. it's irrelevant to the subject at hand. the effects of adrenaline on every system is not at issue - only that it can explain in a verifiable way, the issue of "increased" strength. if the initial posit had been "Can we find an endocrine reason for my experiences with needles," then you'd have a point. this was not the case.

    if you would like to talk about that instead, we could do that.
    "In the world of martial arts, respect is often a given. In the real world, it must be earned."

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  9. #54
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  10. #55
    Thank you for getting back to me Merryprankster,

    The incident with the needle as a strength related issue. It involved muscles and adrenaline. If your explanation cannot cover that then, and this is what I am really trying to get at, there is a deficit in Western medicine in what is really going on. When you use the terms maximal and absolute strength, you are dealing with limits. It does not consider possibilities that go beyond those limits.

    mickey

  11. #56
    Merryprankster,

    A scenario for you:

    Given: Subjects absolute strength is 800 pounds.

    Subject's loved on is overrun by a 1100 pound car and is trapped under it.

    Subject is able to lift the car.

    Question: What accounts for the difference?

    mickey

  12. #57
    I forgot to add:

    While subject is lifting car, some mad scientist is trying to take a blod sample, but the freakin' needle can't penetrate the skin of subject.

    mickey

  13. #58
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    lol

  14. #59
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    mickey,

    the difference is the difference between maximal and absolute strength.

    if the subject's absolute strength is 800 lbs, then nothing is going to get that person to lift that car. that is all they are capable of lifting un-aided.

    if the person's maximal strength is 800 lbs, then they may be able to lift that car.

    maximal strength is what you can tap into under normal cicumstances. there is a biofeedback mechanism in the body that inhibits muscular contraction because the full force of your exertions would damage your body. it's a safety mechanism. adrenaline can overcome this mechanism, allowing you to use -literally- all your strength. however, that's all you've got, and it frequently results in joint and organ damage. that is your absolute strength.

    absolute strength may be 1200 lbs and that car comes off, however your maximal strength may be 800 lbs.

    BUT, as i said before if your absolute strength is 800 lbs, that car is not coming off unaided, no matter how much adrenaline goes through your system.

    The incident with the needle as a strength related issue. It involved muscles and adrenaline.
    no offense, but, how do you know? the effect may have been unrelated. correlation is not causation.

    as far as the "deficit in western knowledge" that would apply to only the needle. adrenaline's effects on strength and the mechanism of action are well understood...

    which brings us back to square one: the explanation is more than adequate for the subject at hand, regardless of your needle issue.
    "In the world of martial arts, respect is often a given. In the real world, it must be earned."

    "A stupid man's report of what a clever man says is never accurate because he unconsciously translates what he hears into something he can understand. "--Bertrand Russell

    "Liberals - Cosmopolitan critics, men who are the friends of every country save their own. "--Benjamin Disraeli

    "A conservative government is an organised hypocrisy."--Benjamin Disraeli

  15. #60
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    Alright guys I'm not that knowledgable about this other than having a basic knowledge of the whole absolute strength thing (like what we're discussing here).

    So is it correct to say that everyone's absolute strength is genetically determined from birth?

    It would be interesting to see the changes (if any) in absolute strength as a person develops. Like in a 5 year old vs that same person when he's 10, 15, 20, 25, etc.

    Of course, that'd be hard to test without hurting the person.

    It kinda sucks tho how you're kinda limited by your genes. Just like it also sucks when you lift weights for a year to be able to bench 225 once, and some other guy goes to the gym and on his first day he gets a few reps with it.
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