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Thread: 2 drops of pee

  1. #46
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    red, actually besides those posts you mention, there are also contributions in regards to Ch'an in teh Shaolin forum and developing the Jows hand forms in the southern forum, but i guess you don't visit those much?

    anyway, just saying. you're keeping your scope a bit narrow there dude, might wanna get a look at the bigger picture.

    Ap- do you know any ghurkas? When was the last time you trained in the Fil?

    I've probably trained with more guys from the fil than you, I don't know for sure, but I'm gonna say probably because I grew up with a lot of guys and my peer and classmate at my last kwoon is from the fil as well and is well versed in his home arts as well as the Kungfu we learned.

    Even guys from the Fil know not to screw with a gun. I'm pretty sure that even the Indo KunTao campers would agree with that as well.

    Come on, I can't believe you are gonna argue this to death.
    Anyway, just saying.

    cheers
    Kung Fu is good for you.

  2. #47
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    You might mention that to the gurkhas of Nepal or the moros of the southern Philippines. I think they've been doing it wrong.
    all i gotta say to that is you can have attached to you a cool sounding name and a fearless sounding style or art. and yes i KNOW ALL TOO WELL about the phillipino culture.
    but a little reality check APO,,,,they got guns over there as well.

    i shivered when i read the name "gurkhas"
    i trembled when i read the name "moros"

    then i saw the name "smith and wesson" and my fear sddlenly went away

    i dont advocate gun violence mind you,,,but i am not so naive as to think that i can stop a bullet with a knife and a cool sounding cultural attachment to my rep.

    PEACE,,,TWS
    It makes me mad when people say I turned and ran like a scared rabbit. Maybe it was like an angry rabbit, who was going to fight in another fight, away from the first fight.

  3. #48
    You might mention that to the gurkhas of Nepal or the moros of the southern Philippines. I think they've been doing it wrong.
    Ap, depends on the time, place, circumstances and the combatants. The moros did beat the gun some of the time but consider that they'd be doped up and did some other things to make them last longer. How many of them lived after winning against a gun? Friend of mine spent time training parts of the Philipino army. While on training missions they would run into rebels and except for one time the fighting was all M-16 on AK-47. Another aquaintence did use his machete often enough in the same locale. My pops went up against a guy with a butcher knife and if memory serves the guy never got within 10 feet of him. Another friend went against a bolo(?) empty handed and got a nice scar across his chest, bolo boy ended up with it in his head. The more I learn the more I learn that there are no absolutes when it comes to combat.
    I quit after getting my first black belt because the school I was a part of was in the process of lowering their standards A painfully honest KC Elbows

    The crap that many schools do is not the crap I was taught or train in or teach.

    Dam nit... it made sense when it was running through my head.

    DM


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  4. #49
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    Originally posted by Judge Pen


    so if I carry a 10 inch knife, then I'm immortal?
    Yeah. I had hard time in math too. Innumeracy is rampant around the world. No it's like Xeno's paradox.

    10% increased by 10% = 11%
    11% increased by 10% = 12.1%

    hm...length of blade in inches = n

    a single increment of better chances for survival could be calculated as: (previous chance)(1.1)

    so . . .

    10 (1.1)n

    therefore, assuming a 1" knife gives you a 10% chance of
    survival, a 10" knife should give you . . . a 25.94% chance of survival. . . ?

  5. #50
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    Originally posted by rogue


    Ap, depends on the time, place, circumstances and the combatants. The moros did beat the gun some of the time but consider that they'd be doped up and did some other things to make them last longer. How many of them lived after winning against a gun? Friend of mine spent time training parts of the Philipino army. While on training missions they would run into rebels and except for one time the fighting was all M-16 on AK-47. Another aquaintence did use his machete often enough in the same locale. My pops went up against a guy with a butcher knife and if memory serves the guy never got within 10 feet of him. Another friend went against a bolo(?) empty handed and got a nice scar across his chest, bolo boy ended up with it in his head. The more I learn the more I learn that there are no absolutes when it comes to combat.
    Right. Obviously neither the moros nor the gurkhas were supermen. But Willow Sword wants to say that gun vs. blade is a foregone conclusion. And it most certainly is not. Clearly the guy with the gun has an advantage. And often, the guy with the blade ends up dying in the process of killing the gun guy. My point is precisely what you said. There are no absolutes. It's a mistake to think "so what if he has a knife; I'll just pull the trigger twice and that's that."
    When you assume, you make an ass out of... pretty much just you, really.

  6. #51
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    ap-

    statistically speaking, it is a forgone conclusion.

    i.e 99.999% of the time, the gun is gonna kill the knife.

    particularly at the distance and structure of the setup shown in ryan's article.

    man, people get shot raising wallets over their head in some places!

    you think a leo is gonna let some thug get even partially that close with a blade? Or would you? I wouldn't, that guy would have a hole in him faster than he could say "hole".

    cheers
    Kung Fu is good for you.

  7. #52
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    Wasn't there a post here about the 21-foot rule or something? About how an attacker (with a knife) can cover 21 feet before a pistol can be pulled and shot?
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  8. #53
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    Originally posted by The Willow Sword


    all i gotta say to that is you can have attached to you a cool sounding name and a fearless sounding style or art. and yes i KNOW ALL TOO WELL about the phillipino culture.
    but a little reality check APO,,,,they got guns over there as well.

    i shivered when i read the name "gurkhas"
    i trembled when i read the name "moros"

    then i saw the name "smith and wesson" and my fear sddlenly went away

    i dont advocate gun violence mind you,,,but i am not so naive as to think that i can stop a bullet with a knife and a cool sounding cultural attachment to my rep.

    PEACE,,,TWS
    My point has nothing to do with cool sounding names. But historical accounts (as opposed to mythical) of large knives having a viable and effective role in relatively modern warfare.

    Oh, and bravo for showing no fear of a machete wielding bad guy from the safety of Austin, Texas.

    When you assume, you make an ass out of... pretty much just you, really.

  9. #54
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    i.e 99.999% of the time, the gun is gonna kill the knife.
    will you do some freakin research already?! This is DEAD WRONG
    _______________
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  10. #55
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    red-

    you got some of that research handy that says a knife beats a gun?

    links? more than one source?

    thanks
    Kung Fu is good for you.

  11. #56
    Wasn't there a post here about the 21-foot rule or something? About how an attacker (with a knife) can cover 21 feet before a pistol can be pulled and shot?
    The average person can cover 20 ft in about a second. The premise has some problems with it though. When people use this argument the gun is holstered and the knife is out. You could just as well say a gun or stick can beat a knife before it's deployed.
    Anyways do you want to rush a real gun? If you think you can go buy an inexpensive Airsoft pistol, some safety goggles and see how you do.
    I've rarely won when going for a gun outside of the distance from my finger tip to my elbow. Further than that I've never beat it even against an untrained person who was willing to pull the trigger. A gun can be trained to be deployed and pointed at the agressor in under a second, with him moving closer it makes it even easier to hit him. It takes practice and a good rig though.

    No absolutes, a gun can stove pipe, have a safety on and other things.
    I quit after getting my first black belt because the school I was a part of was in the process of lowering their standards A painfully honest KC Elbows

    The crap that many schools do is not the crap I was taught or train in or teach.

    Dam nit... it made sense when it was running through my head.

    DM


    People love Iron Crotch. They can't get enough Iron Crotch. We all ride the Iron Crotch for the exposure. Gene

    Find the safety flaw in the training. Rory Miller.

  12. #57
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    Oh, and bravo for showing no fear of a machete wielding bad guy from the safety of Austin, Texas.

    Absolutely right,,,because anyone doing that here would get taken down real quick by the Texas rangers. and the county i live in "Williamson county"? affectionately referred to as "Willco",,,those red neck cops and their shot guns would deal with it quite well.

    Maybe you need all those machete weiding skills in the jungles of the philipines or the mountains of nepal,,,but when it comes to the urban jungle and the concrete jungles of the USA,,,,guess what prevails?

    im sure that in history there are accounts of knife or sword or machete or unarmed people dealing with a gun effectively,,but it is hardly a viable statistic Ap. in fact the statistics go the other way around. thats just the way it is. Sheesus christos al mighty on a fuggin rubber crutch when are people gonna start waking up to the FACT that this is not the Movies?


    PEACE,,,TWS
    It makes me mad when people say I turned and ran like a scared rabbit. Maybe it was like an angry rabbit, who was going to fight in another fight, away from the first fight.

  13. #58
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    Originally posted by red5angel


    will you do some freakin research already?! This is DEAD WRONG

    I dont know man. those people that hold their guns sideways..... they look pretty fricking cool when they do it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Psycho Mantis View Post
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  14. #59
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    Originally posted by The Willow Sword



    Absolutely right,,,because anyone doing that here would get taken down real quick by the Texas rangers. and the county i live in "Williamson county"? affectionately referred to as "Willco",,,those red neck cops and their shot guns would deal with it quite well.

    Maybe you need all those machete weiding skills in the jungles of the philipines or the mountains of nepal,,,but when it comes to the urban jungle and the concrete jungles of the USA,,,,guess what prevails?

    im sure that in history there are accounts of knife or sword or machete or unarmed people dealing with a gun effectively,,but it is hardly a viable statistic Ap. in fact the statistics go the other way around. thats just the way it is. Sheesus christos al mighty on a fuggin rubber crutch when are people gonna start waking up to the FACT that this is not the Movies?


    PEACE,,,TWS
    Okay, let's forget about historical accounts and movies for a second and get back to the root of Kung Lek's original objection. The pictures in Richard Ryan's article. Two guys facing off. IN KNIFE RANGE. One guy has a knife. One guy has a gun.

    How would they get into that range in the first place? Why wouldn't the gun guy shoot the knife guy when they were further apart?

    I can think of some fairly obvious reasons. Especially in your "concrete jungle of the USA." Neither of them is walking around with weapon drawn. They draw weapons when they're close by. In a bar, at a ball game, whatever. They're in knife range and both guys pull their weapons. What, precisely, is preventing the knife guy from winning that altercation?

    Not once have I stated that the gun guy is doomed. I've even said that he's in the better position. Clearly the gun is a better weapon in most instances. But the original objection was to the pictures. Two guys at a range that allowed both to use their weapons. Gun guy is better off stepping backward and keeping distance. Knife guy is better off stepping forward and closing distance.

    I'm sure the stats favour the gun guy. I'm SURE they do. But if I were the gun guy and the knife guy were that close (or within the 20-foot mark), I wouldn't be treating it with the nonchalance that you seem to advocate. Yeah, of course I'd pull the trigger. But it's still a fight.
    When you assume, you make an ass out of... pretty much just you, really.

  15. #60
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    Lightbulb here is a statistic for you AP

    8 times out of 10 the guy with the gun aims for the head.

    Peace,,TWS
    It makes me mad when people say I turned and ran like a scared rabbit. Maybe it was like an angry rabbit, who was going to fight in another fight, away from the first fight.

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