Fights go to the ground

[Rayfield]

My Kung Fu training would be considered a traditional style. We study alot of forms and do a great deal of forms during a training session. Its all about memory and doing the form exactly right. We are very intense on stances and I have to admit the stance training has made me very stable and strong in the lower body. Now, having said that, I have been in a few street fights. The style I practice is all about avoiding incoming attackes and counter attacks. We do not go into ground fighting at all. The logic behind this is simple, the opponent should be beaten before the fight gets that far or anyone trying to take you down leaves alot exposed. Although I have never been in a fight since I started training in Kung Fu, I just keep telling myself that all fights go to the ground. Never have I seen a fight or been in a fight that didnt go to the ground. Has anyone here been in or witnessed a real street fight that didnt go to the ground? Just want some feed back becuase im thinking I may need a new style to train in. I want something that is gonna benefit me in real life fighting. I can see how someof our counter attacks would prevent the fight from hitting the floor but its gotta work first. If you miss or screw up somethings got to give. So again I ask, have you ever been in or seen a fight that didnt go to the ground?

Ray

[SevenStar]

Originally posted by Rayfield
anyone trying to take you down leaves alot exposed.

that's one of the most incorrect statements I've ever heard. If you know how to take someone down, very little is exposed.

To comment on your post and answer your question though, yes, I've seen fights that have not gone to the ground. And yes, I would consider training in something else. I wouldn't quit what you are doing now - by all means, stick with it - but it wouldn't hurt to cross train with some grapplers.

[Ray Pina]

When I was a kid growing up I had my share fair of scraps and I can homestly say I can't recall one going to the ground. With that said, I've seen friends take guys down to the ground, tie them up, and knee their heads.

Fights do go to the ground. Even if you are well trained, you can be taken to the ground or you can slip and fall ..... you must have a ground game plan, and you must train it.

Ask your teacher if he has one and if the school trains it. Listen carefuly to what he says. If he tries to dismiss it or talk around it, you can be sure it's something he's unfamiliar or uncomfortable with. If he plops down and asks you to mount him and show you some stuff, then you're on your way already.

Listen carefully to teacher/senior talk -- schools tend to have a collective mindset. Then be honest without yourself with the impression that you get.

Good luck,
Ray Pina

[Dark Knight]

As far as going to the ground, Rany Couture says that you shouldnt go to the ground if you dont want to. But he was a top wrestler before UFC. He trained to stop it.

If you are not training with grapplers, you will prob not satop them from taking you down. I see non-grapplers practice on each other what they think a grappler would do. But they dont have the training.

As far as on the street. Fighting a good grappler ins like fighting a good dighter in any style. They prob are not looking for fights in the street and you will not encounter it as much.

Of all the drunken jerks I have seen, I have met only a few trained ones (maybe in being a jerk, but not in fighting)

What works in the street is different for everyone. There is no one ultimate style that fits everyone. I met a TKD Black Belt that couldnt kick higher than his waist. TKD was not for him, the same ofr any style.

Train hard, train realistically and you will have an advantage over the majority of people you will encounter.

But if you want to be a grappler, train with them so you know what to expect (trying it out on each other from a video doesnt cut it)

[Yaksha]

A person goes to the ground when they're knocked out or are too beaten or crippled to stand. I've seen fights like that. Nearly every fight I've ever seen on the ground involved one guy on the ground and the other guy kicking him in the head.


Why do you practice so many forms? I'm concerned you're not getting very good training. . .

Traditional martial arts tend towards training a constant flow of spontaneous movement. Sometimes its through push hands or two man sets and always through sparring. But too many forms are not good.

Oh yeah, and painful stances for hours.

[macaulay]

Yaksha,

A fight is unpredictable and violent. It may go to the ground or not. It depends on a lot of factors. Train to handle the unexpected. The others in this thread are correct.

A side note,
You write things that confuse me like "I'm concerned you're not getting very good training. . . " and your thread about streetfighting.

Train hard and believe in yourself and your teacher. If you know that you are capable of handling the situation, what do you have to prove?

[Yaksha]

If I seem confusing, maybe its because I'm confused.

[brothernumber9]

"If I seem confusing, maybe its because I'm confused."

Yaksha has taken the most correctedness of the correct raised it above his head on a tall cliff and named it MUFASA.

[Sumatie]

I have seen a lot of fights in my time as well. In my experience about half of fights I have seen went to the ground. The fascinating thing is that the best punchers always seemed to avoid the ground, unless they were up against someone of approximate equal ability, then it is always down to a lucky punch or throw that has ended the fight before a ground struggle. In my opinion if you are fast enough on your feet and ferocious enough in your attack you can normally avoid a ground fight, but why leave that to chance. If you can't beat your opponent on your feet then, you had better be able to beat him on the ground and vice versa, because you never know what the consequence of your own and your opponents actions will be.

[QuaiJohnCain]

Originally posted by Yaksha
Why do you practice so many forms? I'm concerned you're not getting very good training. . .

Oh yeah, and painful stances for hours.

You know, I hear this alot from beginners. Ten years later, they still wonder why they can't do what thier teacher can...

[Banjos_dad]

Who was it that said, 'Sure all fights wind up on the ground...for ONE of the fighters anyway.'

Food for thought, with a side order of knuckle sandwiches.

When you spar, practice kicks from the ground, scissors, etc. whatever you can do.
You guys do spar don't you??? No one ever falls or gets swept

[reemul]

There is no telling where a fight can go. If your system is lagit, you should be able to practice within the confines of your training against grapplers and yeild techniques that prevent you going to the ground. It does depend on whether your school is for real or just another fraud, but for the most part it depends on you. If you suck, you suck, and there is no way around that except to train.

I may recall incorrectly, but if you are student of 2 years, I would say you are still a beginner and don't know much.

I am what you consider a traditional practioner, but I have friends who study JKD, BJJ, Taikwando. All of these friends afford me some respect because they understand that in the end it is the mettle of the practioner that determines the outcome and mine has been tested.

[LEGEND]

"So again I ask, have you ever been in or seen a fight that didnt go to the ground?"

YUP. 50/50. Some fight ends with someone getting KO or simply both tiring and are seperated. Others with someone getting taken down or thrown down. Bouncers/police officers prefer to throw you to the ground to get SMOTHER you. Since u haven't been in many real fights...I suggest u go to your local best buy and purchase STREET FIGHTs 1 and 2 or Ghetto Brawl. I have been in numerous real fights in my time being the only asian guy growing up in mostly a black neighborhood. It SUCKED. Regarding your form training...I encourage you to go to a sparring club and put on some gear( headgear/mma gloves or boxing gloves ) and spar with some guys.

[LEGEND]

"I may recall incorrectly, but if you are student of 2 years, I would say you are still a beginner and don't know much."

Absolutely ridiculous. After training for 2 years u should be able to handle yourself in a real fight. There are HS wrestlers after 2 months of training can slam the hell out a average berate joe.

[SevenStar]

Originally posted by LEGEND
"I may recall incorrectly, but if you are student of 2 years, I would say you are still a beginner and don't know much."

Absolutely ridiculous. After training for 2 years u should be able to handle yourself in a real fight. There are HS wrestlers after 2 months of training can slam the hell out a average berate joe.

agreed.