WC = Pure Ego.....

[Skarbromantis]

Why do WC fighters think there style is the best?

Why is it that WC fighters have the biggest ego's?

Why do WC fighters feel that chain punch's cant be stopped?

Why do WC fighters use Bruce Lee name in regards to their own skill?

Why do Wing Chun fighters think that there is nothing better then WC for the street?

Why is every WC fighter I have ever meet is full of them self, is it part of the system? Do you train to be 'tough guys"?

I think the system is good, except the people who study it come off as "look at me, I study WC, I'm so bad ass", when they are not!

...why....why ...why?

Please Explain...

Skard1

[black and blue]

It starts with their Sifu's saying things like "You know, Wing Chun was developed to beat all other styles"

....

then progresses to, "What I teach is the most efficient and scientific"

.....

and then usually wraps itself up with, "Yip Man was unstoppable man! He once grab a cops gun with his bare hand and with a flick of the wrist bust it up real good!"



For every Wing Chunner who can use it, there are 100 who talk about their deadly Chi Sau ability.... such is life.

[lawrenceofidaho]

Why do WC fighters think there style is the best?

This is hardly a problem unique to Wing Chun.......ANYONE caught in dualistic (us/them, good/bad, right/wrong, black/white) and surface level thinking will be caught in this trap.

Why is it that WC fighters have the biggest ego's?

The "fighters" with the biggest egos, are usually the ones who have never fought before. (Their record doesn't have any losses on it, so they're "undefeated", right?)

Why do WC fighters feel that chain punch's cant be stopped?

That will be a Wing Chun person's experience, but ONLY if they never test it against a skilled & resisting opponent.

Why do WC fighters use Bruce Lee name in regards to their own skill?

Wing Chun people aren't the only ones playing that game. There is even a Mantis master (I can't remember his name, but I think he might be out of New York) that on his website claims he taught Bruce the Mantis style, and that Mantis is what JKD is REALLY based on........

Why do Wing Chun fighters think that there is nothing better then WC for the street?

It seems that every kwoon or dojo that "trains for the street" imagines that there is nothing more "realistic" than what they do.

Why is every WC fighter I have ever meet is full of them self, is it part of the system? Do you train to be 'tough guys"?

I think the system is good, except the people who study it come off as "look at me, I study WC, I'm so bad ass", when they are not!

Mr. Miyagi say; "No such thing as bad student, -only bad teacher."

-Lawrence

[Skarbromantis]

Wing Chun people aren't the only ones playing that game. There is even a Mantis master (I can't remember his name, but I think he might be out of New York) that on his website claims he taught Bruce the Mantis style, and that Mantis is what JKD is REALLY based on........

Thats pretty sad indeed.

My buddy is a WC fighter and we touch hands every weekend, he's pretty skilled, so we have a good time beating each other, he gets me....I get him.... but as for the guys he trains with, total block heads, I have great respect for the system, but not for "WC clowns" who come of way too strong, its sad that "ego" is being taught, within the training.

And I agree, every system has "wannabe badboys" WC just seems to have the most.

Skard1

[Matrix]

Originally posted by Skarbromantis
.... but as for the guys he trains with, total block heads, I have great respect for the system, but not for "WC clowns" who come of way too strong, its sad that "ego" is being taught, within the training.

Scarborough,
So we're all to be judged by this one group in T.O. That doesn't sound reasonable to me. It's a big world out there.

All that stuff about chain punches and Bruce Lee doesn't relate to the Wing Chun I know, so please be careful about using such generalizations. You're probably getting this information from the same guys you're calling "WC clowns". Think about it.....does that make any sense to you?

As for thinking WC is the best. Don't you want to train in the art that is the best one for you?

Egos, tough guys and clowns can be found in every martial art. At least that's been my experience.

Your mileage may vary.

Bill

[Skarbromantis]

I can only speak on what I've seen, and I seen alot inside and outside of T.O, and the "WC clowns" I have mentioned go beyond just the guy's my friend trains with.


And I do understand the "my style is the best" attitude, you should be proud of your style, but what I dont understand is the "you want to touch hands with the mighty WC" ego I see so much.


Skard1

[Ultimatewingchun]

Skarbromantis:

Several reasons for the phenomena you describe:

1) Wing Chun IS an amazing system that utilizes principles, strategies, and techniques that are very involved, complex, and efficient compared to most other systems...particularly so in terms of close contact infighting...where many other systems are either weak or just moderately efficient by comparison.

2) The temptation to ride Bruce Lee's coat-tails and reputation has been too much for many people to resist.

3) Closely related to both reason #1 and #2 is the fact that some people have taken up wing chun because they want to "ride a winning horse"...even if it means "talking" a lot more than "doing".

4) Some people have taken up Wing Chun to ride a winner AND have put in the hard work required (ie.- "doing" quite a bit)...but their ego is such that they are now CONVINCED that they are at the top of the mountain - and are standing there quite alone.

I don't think this phenomena is unique to Wing Chun, however. But because of Bruce Lee's fame...wing chun chest-pounding gets more publicity than most other systems.

[Matrix]

Originally posted by Skarbromantis
And I do understand the "my style is the best" attitude, you should be proud of your style, but what I dont understand is the "you want to touch hands with the mighty WC" ego I see so much.

Just a suggestion. When you see that kind of attitude, smile and keep walking. If they were really any good they wouldn't need to strut around like that. Those who show big ego are really showing lack of self-confidence. Don't buy into that game.

All the best,
Bill

[Skarbromantis]

Ultimatewingchun:

Thank you, I enjoyed reading your post, makes alot of sense.

Skard1

[macaulay]

Ultimate and Matrix are right. The ego crap is an unfortunate byproduct of the current state of MA in general. Too much politics, too much bickering, too much name calling.

WC stands on its own merits, IMHO. When it becomes a diatribe about "my WC and my superior technique and my amazing training" it becomes crap. The techniques and the forms make sense and can be examined logically. No hype needed. No salesmanship needed. No comparison needed.

The "clowns" you refer to are in all styles. Let them talk, they won't kick anyone's ass with their mouth.

I train to be better that I was yesterday, I believe that all of us do. If the motivation is to be better than someone else, who does one train for - the other guy? I train for me. I am not denying my ego, I feel pride when I do well and shame when I do poorly. I'm just a guy trying to do WC properly, to the best of my ability. I don't have to be better than another guy in another style.

WC practitioners are people too and we run the gamut from nice to nasty, just like all humans. I count myself as one of the nice ones. Again, opinions vary.

[yuanfen]

Skarbromantis

Location: Toronto, Scarborough

WC = Pure Ego.....
((Ego is not causally linked witha style or profession.))


Why do WC fighters think there style is the best?

((A different question- why would anyone study what they think is 2nd best? Unless nothing else is available))

Why is it that WC fighters have the biggest ego's?

((Not really. Lots of Steven Seagal egos around too. Lots in football locker rooms too. Mo activity hasa monopoly on egos- the human condition!!))

Why do WC fighters feel that chain punch's cant be stopped?

(( Huh? A WC saying- there is no unstoppable move!!))

Why do WC fighters use Bruce Lee name in regards to their own skill?

(( I dont and I never have))



Please Explain...

(See above- I have been in your neck of the woods-Toronto/Scarborough- wing chun related. As in some other places there is good, bad and ugly wing chun and people too. Dont know about mantis-your call on that))





black and blue

Bone bruised every class

((Why?))




It starts with their Sifu's saying things like "You know, Wing Chun was developed to beat all other styles"

((Creative writing or journalism? Never heard that from sifu or sigung))

....

then progresses to, "What I teach is the most efficient and scientific"

((Huh? See above))

.....

and then usually wraps itself up with, "Yip Man was unstoppable man! He once grab a cops gun with his bare hand and with a flick of the wrist bust it up real good!"

(One passing anecdote doesnt make a story-one swallow does not make Capistrano))



For every Wing Chunner who can use it, there are 100 who talk about their deadly Chi Sau ability.... such is life.

((For every good basketball player there are many who just "dribble".))

joy

[lawrenceofidaho]

The Mantis guy who "taught" Bruce Lee is Gin Foo Mark.
Read the story of Jeet Kune Do's *TRUE* inspiration here;
http://members.aol.com/martyeisen/mantis/Lee.htm

[yuanfen]

I suggest care about "reading" Gin Foon Mark.

He does not speak much English, does not write the stuff attributed to him, does not read what is written "for" him
by others.

His kung fu skills are superb-he is not only a genuine tong long
southern mantis great- he knows hung gar and clf too. Teaches chi gong to strengthen the mantis. Has his own jows of various kinds. Old school. Secret society stuff. Expects loyalties. Chinese
free mason networking. Teaches students close to him very well.
He has hand skills that are quite rare and very good short power.
He is really a kung fu treasure.

Who is out and who is in- in the mantis world- makes wing chun ego interactions look underdeveloped.

Lots of people claim they "taught" Bruce Lee something or the other- success hasa thousand fathers. Jhoon Rhee claims some credit too. Some wc folks other than WSL as well.

And in turn lots of non -wing chun kung fu teachers make pronouncements on wing chun. Nothing new.

[Vyvial]

welll Joy, thanks once again, what else can be said after that.... actually i guess we will see what people have to say.

[Ultimatewingchun]

"Lots of people claim they 'taught' Bruce Lee something or the other...Some wc folks other than WSL as well." (Joy)

It's common knowledge that Bruce Lee learned most of his wing chun from William Cheung AND Wong Shun Leung.

Been written/spoken about many times by a number of different people.

I myself have met both Dan Inosanto and Ted Wong...(Ted Wong sat next to William Cheung and watched my entire Instructor Grade Level 10 test back in 1990).

Both gentlemen confirmed the relationship I just described between Bruce Lee and William Cheung.