weight lifting vs pure bw

[blooming lotus]

opened an interesting email from mattfury.com today and came across a very interesting point..............

For those folks here lifting as part of a typical regime or means to acquiring "functional strength" ( prettiness as an off-shoot) for best results, would anyone like to give an opinion on why seals and berets lift no weights at all and are, by virtue of nature of position, in supreme physical shape???


In fact, matt himself is an ex world class title holder and claims that his game only improved after the change -over to bwed exercises in lieu. He also gives several other quite convincing examples of where it's worked for others. It is possible that the switch up had little to do with it, and it was in fact a physcological state that developed at the same time, and whether one is subjective to the other or the most responsible for the resulting aheivements is always going to be a subjective argument. Does that make sense? Can anyone provide examples of a reverse trade of regime delivering the same ??......I'm sure someone'll have something but I'd would like to compare notes on this one.

I know alot of people here are die - hard fans of their routines and if we can remain proffessional in this discussion, I think it would be a good time to hash it out

cheers

[FooFighter]

BL:

I am not a grammar and spelling nazi, but please try to write clearly and correctly so people can understand what you are writing. I am having a great problem reading all your posts and it is not funny. If you care about communicating your ideas to others then please try to write better. Since you wrote you were a native english speaker, then there should be no problem unless you are lazy and inconsiderate. My suggestion was not meant to be hurtful or to be funny. I am being practical and care what you have to communicate and if you dont care to write properly, then should I care to listen?

I personally believe everyone should master body weight exercises because it is more functional, especially single arm push ups and single leg squats. Body weight training has it benefits and I can see the benefits however it isnt the holy grail which Matt Furey claims. The problem with Matt Furey and others is their are ignorant of the science Periodization and seeing all proper exercise methodology has its place and no one method is the magic bullet. If people knew how to cycle their training in the long run I hope, they would increase their performance in the long run. I have seen that Furey like many body builders are very ignorant on such matters.

[blooming lotus]

Originally posted by FooFighter
BL:

please try to write clearly and correctly
please try to write better

If you dont care to care to write properly, then I dont care to listen... sounds fair?

I personally everyone should master body weight exercises.........




<to be continue>

lol @ your cuteness...........there was also another mistake in your post but I think it was spelling.............

If you re-read my post, my grammar is perfect and loh and behold, so is my spelling..................even if abbreviated and conversational..........

I'm a forgiving gal though and becuse everyone here does it on occassion, and on this thread we're making a point of NOT getting into trite discussions and irrelevant personal attacks, I'll just forget I saw it

do continue your argument though..............bear in mind though, Matt isn't by any means the only one advocating this training as a one stop training shop. Please continue

[CaptinPickAxe]

proffessional

C'mon, Teach. Professional only has one 'f', but you get an 'A' for effort.

[blooming lotus]

damm that word......I do it all the time..............lol.some habits just die hard ha

[Ford Prefect]

Matt Furey is a snake oil salesmen and a conn artist. He'd sell his mother to make a buck.

[FooFighter]

Ford:

I second that point! I've written this before and I write it again. Matt Furey's products are inferior and I was a very unhappy customer after buying his flexibility tapes and his combat fitness book. I will never buy anything from him again and most of his stuff is misinformation.

[MasterKiller]

Hershell Walker claims he only used (still uses) body weight training, and he was a monster in college, the USFL, and the NFL. He claims he's never touched weights.

His routine consisted of something like 10,000 situps every day, and 1,000 push-ups (I'm speaking from memory, here, so I could have the numbers off). He is a big fan of dynamic tension exercises as well.

He out-ran Darrell Green one year at the NFL Superstars Challenge, and Darrell Green was the fastest man in the NFL for many, many years.

[FooFighter]

To be honest, isolated cases of individuals does not make me believe in anything in particular. For example, logically there are "unknown factors" which I dont know which may contribute to Mr. Walker's personal performance. Moreoever, to use him as example or absolute proof for strict body weight exercises and the inferiority of weight lifting is not reasonable, not a strong argument, and of course not very scientifically sound.

[blooming lotus]

when you're talking about many individuals the argument becomes a case study. Matt furey may be slick, but we are not so much talking about him so much more than in the capacity of a signular of many examples. I generally don't have as much time as I did today, but I'll try to find links to some more examples.

This theory has made sense to me for quite some time, and is how I have trained for several yrs, hence the thread, with guys like Ford, Iron, Toby, possible RTB, etc being so fanatical or dedicated their system, it should be easy to come up with a good discussion .

Has anyone got any links of examples where an a-grade world class title holder has used bw exercises, changed their programme to predominately weights and seen better performance to the extent where they say ( or the math proves)that was what the key factor of the their acheivement was??
As in a reverse of what I gave you.???

[MasterKiller]

Originally posted by FooFighter
To be honest, isolated cases of individuals does not make me believe in anything in particular. For example, logically there are "unknown factors" which I dont know which may contribute to Mr. Walker's personal performance. Moreoever, to use him as example or absolute proof for strict body weight exercises and the inferiority of weight lifting is not reasonable, not a strong argument, and of course not very scientifically sound.

I just threw that info out there. I don't believe I made any claims for or against it's usefullness or superiority to weight training.

By most accounts, Walker is a genetic freak.

[Ford Prefect]

Ok, BL. I'm not fanatical about any system. I use a well-rounded approach the uses bwe's, olympic weightlifting, power lifting, bodybuilding, sprints, Long distance running, agility drills (cones/ladder), kettlebells, clubbells.

If you do only BWE's, you will be missing a lot. If you do only KB's, you will be missing a lot. If you do only, olympic lifting, you will be missing alot. Etc etc. There is no ONE approach that will cover everything or even most things.

[blooming lotus]

Originally posted by Ford Prefect
Ok, BL. I'm not fanatical about any system. I use a well-rounded approach the uses bwe's, olympic weightlifting, power lifting, bodybuilding, sprints, Long distance running, agility drills (cones/ladder), kettlebells, clubbells.

If you do only BWE's, you will be missing a lot. If you do only KB's, you will be missing a lot.


for example???


If you do only, olympic lifting, you will be missing alot. Etc etc. There is no ONE approach that will cover everything or even most things.

Agree.but only for that fact that each individual class athlete has a very real goal for permormance objective, totally unique to themselves, when we get down to nitty gritty and of course these require different methods. There is ample evidence out there to support my arguement and given time hopefully over the course of this thread I'll find some things to share. I trust you'll do the same.

[Merryprankster]

Whooo-hooo!

I love the misinformation train:

"weight lifting makes you slow!"

"weight lifting makes you muscle bound!"

"Horse stance makes you stronger!"

"BWE are better than weights for making you lift more weight!"

ROFL!!!

I LOVE this place!

[blooming lotus]

thought you'd show up :P

So, you'll be posting some links for us then??