Old Yang Form

[PQS]

How many different versions are there of this form? I have just started learning Tai Chi and I think the instructor teaches "medium frame" and when I look in books as a guide they all seem to be in a different order.
I think my instructor studied under Sifu Gin Soon Chu

Regards
Peter

[Ma_Xu_Zha]

i just posted this on another board some vcd and videos i recently bought and observed .

Yang variations study:
what i purchases to survey this past few months were-

1. guang ping 1st form (no 2nd cannon fist is available right now) basically it has apparent chen movements and a few interesting variations of part horse mane, fair maiden play shuttles, 7 stars ride tiger, brush knee, and jump kick.

2. Imperial Yang Taijiquan- both Li Zheng's and Xiao Tieseng 'old frame' were the same form, li zheng is a bit older and more refined. it contains alot of rear leg weighted stances and some chen-like and wu-like postures. the imperial 'small frame' seemed a shorter and faster version of the old frame with same type of postures while the chang chuan or 'longfist' form was faster more agile, more fajing and had even bagua walking in it!!

3. Middle frame taijiquan of Yang jianhao- by wang Dianzhen. 13 animal shapes- each resembled linear sections of the yang long form or repeated single postures like grasp birl tail, part horse mane, brush knee, kick section, fair maiden. the postures look more comfortable and open compared to the other forms, but its not da jia (large frame).

4. the 64 yang spear form by jiang jie-ye (aka video man of every style-no shame in the game) probably got this form in china and brought in back to the states probably from someone more legit than himself (wang chouyu). i wanted to see what it compared to with the 24 spear i learned from my yang teacher xianhao. it didnt resemble it at all. it seemed more like shaolin/lohand spear. it has figure 8's, jumps, fast pace, quick turns. no taiji flavor, but interesting in its own right. some of the spear movements of this form were the same as those by wang dianzhen who studied with the yang jian hao lineage.

5. earl montagui's yang lu chan old form. (had to see why everyone either hates or loves this guy) this was nothing like the other old frame forms and recent research suggests this might be a form related to Chen pan ling who studied with yang shou hao and yang chen fu, the wu's, and chen's at one point. and that what the form looked like a different expression of those styles. there is plently of fajing, and different variatins of part horse mane, brush knee, fair maiden play shuttles, strike tiger. he has a second video on small and large san shou i felt covers some good self defense.

total assesment- might be good to have in your yang library if you like to see other variations.

final assesment- better to practice with a great master one thing really well, stick to a legit lineage than the hybrid styles.

stay true to the form...

matt

[bamboo_ leaf]

(final assesment- better to practice with a great master one thing really well, stick to a legit lineage than the hybrid styles.)

but what if the great master practiced and teaches one of those hybrid styles? he might even be the one that created it. what then?


I think the best course is to find and practice with some one or style that best exemplifies ones own understanding of taiji. that is unless one is really looking for historical methods based on the major family styles.

As your understanding grows the concept of what is and is not taiji will change, hopefully this is reflected in ones practice or search for better examples of what one is looking for.

[Palmer]

Originally posted by Ma_Xu_Zha
i just posted this on another board some vcd and videos i recently bought and observed .

total assesment- might be good to have in your yang library if you like to see other variations.

final assesment- better to practice with a great master one thing really well, stick to a legit lineage than the hybrid styles.

matt

Thats a great assesment as long as you do not consider guang ping a 'hybrid' version of Yang style. It is a legit lineage. Although you probably wont findit taught at your local health club.

[Ma_Xu_Zha]

the principles of taijiquan are ever lasting no matter what style-

Its good to practice with teachers that are accountable or part of the lineage. teachers arent video tapes and vcd's.

yang family member yang jun is now in seattle area and they have centers around usa now. the style is often called dai jia or big frame directly from yang chen fu.

As far as other yang taijiquan goes here in the usa cheng man ching taiji is very popular some of the main instructors i can think of are ben lo, william cc chen, abraham lui, robert smith represent his teaching so its good to study from them or their students that have those teachers blessing to teach. some call this a middle frame form coming from influences of yang chen fu and yang chien hou.

there is also guang ping has been is america for some time now from Kou Yien Ling. henry look is one teacher i can think offhand, my teacher was Dr. John Shear who learned in San fransico back in the 60's. some people call this the old yang frame from yang pan hao.

Michuan yangjia taiji from Wang Yien Nian's students has gotten some publicity and a few teachers now in the usa. some people think of this as middle frame since it came from yang jian hou teaching to zhang qi lin.

there are other teachers around usa that are from major organizations of traditional taiji from places like beijing, shanghai, hong kong- just to name a few...these might be students of fu zhong wen's - he weiqi , yang sau ching- gin soon chu. I am sure they are da jia forms.

There are several people who are now part of the chen taiji lineages that host many seminars from the 4 main guardians and other chen masters. chen xiaowang, chen zhen lei, wang xian, feng zhiqiang, and zhu tien cai ususally do annual and bi annual seminars now. within chen taijiquan there is old frame called "lao jia" and new frame called "xin jia" there are other styles as well called 'zhao bao' and 'xiao jia' to name a few.

[Palmer]

As far as Guang Ping, Sifu David Chin and his student Sifu Tim Smith also teach in Raleigh/Fayetteville NC.