Wanna Fight? - Real Mentality?

[YongChun]

Interesting reading about the Thai training method. That's why they won against all the Kung Fu fighters and Japanese fighters in the 70's. A sophisticated art without the hard work that the Thais put in, won't do the job in the Ring.

[SevenStar]

Originally posted by Wilson
[B]QUESTION: People who really want to FIGHT- what do they flock to? I'm not asking why....I'm asking what, today, do they flock to? My answer is Muay Thai & BJJ or some MMA style

The real question on this forum should be - why do they flock to that?

My answer - Because of the mentality, the toughness, of the TRAINING.

I would say training and training methods. When done properly,that instills the other two that you mentioned. I have a saying - tma train for a possibility, whereas we train for an inevitablilty.

you MAY have to use your skill in the street. I WILL have to use mine in the ring. Consequently, I will likely have more focus because I will have to fight. no maybe about it.

[Miles Teg]

Great article!
The other day I watched a Thai boxing fight and I must say it was **** impressive. It seems to be a very complete art. The throws that they use are very quick and effective. There are also way more tools and techniques that Thai boxers can use.


Yong Chun
"A sophisticated art without the hard work that the Thais put in, won't do the job in the Ring."

Hmmm, I would say that the chances of beating a Thai boxer are just as slim "out of the ring" than "in the ring".

[YongChun]

Originally posted by Miles Teg


Yong Chun
"A sophisticated art without the hard work that the Thais put in, won't do the job in the Ring."

Hmmm, I would say that the chances of beating a Thai boxer are just as slim "out of the ring" than "in the ring".

True enough. Ray

[SevenStar]

Originally posted by t_niehoff
IME WCK has distinct advantages when fighting MMAists, boxers, etc., particularly in that they are not experienced in dealing with what we do (yet) since they never face it.

Don't forget that that coin can be flipped over. Also, don't forget that "having more tools" doesn't necessarily translate to a distinct advantage.

[SevenStar]

Originally posted by AmanuJRY
IMHO, the individual puts it there. The individual has to have the goal and drive to have the 'Bad ass mentality', and many do not. You say 'those who want to fight', and FWIW there is a smaller percentage of WCers that adopt the 'want to fight' mentality and use the 'will fight if I have to' one. Where is the acceptance of fighting as a goal? That is where you will find the ones who want to train in WC to be good at fighting.

Why must it be an individual thing though? Wouldn't WC as a whole benefit more if it was a characteristic of all schools?

[AmanuJRY]

Originally posted by SevenStar
Why must it be an individual thing though? Wouldn't WC as a whole benefit more if it was a characteristic of all schools?

Because, ultimatly MA training is an individual, developmental expreience. Each person who studies will have their own opinions, reasons, attitudes, etc. for why they are studying whatever art they are studying. Schools vary in 'attitude' because instructors vary in 'attitude'. If you ask me, this won't change, even if there are WC people who develop the characteristic that YOU are looking for there will be those who develop the characteristic that OTHERS are looking for (whatever that is...good or bad).

So, IMHO, it is up to the individual to do this. And if that individual starts a school and passes this to others, it becomes their individual thing.

[black and blue]

When you go watch a Thai boxing training session you are left in no doubt as to what it will be like to train there: hard work, sweat, pain, injury.

When you go to Kwoon and check out some Wing Chun, what do you see? Well, by and large.... some forms, co-operative drills, no blood, little sweat, no sparring, lots of talking about theory and efficiency.

Tough chaps and lasses go learn Thai Boxing and learn to fight - softies go learn Wing Chun and think they can fight.

Note: There are, of course, some Wing Chun schools that train hard.... its just that the majority of the people who post on this forum, for example, don't train there.

[Miles Teg]

......... not that theres anything wrong with that right B & B?



Remember these guys live a very poverty striken life. They are not doing this for self defense, nor are they doing it for self accomplishment, or just because they like it or even because they want to be a bad ass.


No no no these guys, as pointed out in the article, have made a life out of this and thrown all other opportunities for a living out the window. Also notice I said "for a living". Yes, this is what these guys do for a living to survive.

We simply do not have the pressures that these guys have. The reason we do M.A is for self accomplishment and simply because we enjoy doing them. Some people claim it is for street survival. But I think this is a pretty lame reason. You want to train hard fine, you want to train soft fine.

[black and blue]

Sure.

But I was talking about the Thai boxing camps etc I'd seen in the UK, Thailand (lived in Bangkok for a couple of years) and Eastern Europe.

Every single one I've visited trained very hard - regardless of whether the people training were professional (ie. doing it to make money) or just did it for the H.ell of it.

Now, most of the WCK kwoons I've visited..................


Sure (again) if people want to train soft, err, good for them. But lets not call it a martial art. Lets call a social event. You meet your friends, have a light workout, talk , talk some more, do a little Chi Sau, go for a beer afterwards (Okay, I concede the latter is potential training for a real encounter - might even provide a real encounter).

[Miles Teg]

Well what are you trying to achieve by training hard?

[black and blue]

The ability to actually use the art. Violent encounters are never soft

I completely agree that soft, slow and steady training should exist. But this should, surely, only be one part of your training. Its like learning the dynamics of a punch. You learn the technique and how it is supported by structure, how it travels along a certain path, how energy is used and released.... but when all is said and done, it is useless unless you start hitting focus mitts, the heavy bag, a partner padded up etc. The dynamics differ sometimes.

As for "mentality" during training.... you just can't beat the XingYi mentality: Complete destruction, from the moment the fight begins the aim is to not stop until your opponent is pounded into the floor and begging for their Momma!



Softly softly catchee a smack in the face

[Jeff Bussey]

I agree with B & B.
I personally think that you'll fight the way you train. If people talk too much in class, then hopefully they'll be able to talk their way out of a fight

J

[Wilson]

You definitely fight the way you train, no doubt. But even talking to those people on this forum who don't want to fight, I believe hard training will build the mentallity of a fighter, which will help you in other areas of life. If you push yourself during training, you will learn to push yourself elsewhere. This is part of the learning process of martial arts - otherwise, it's dance class. This is part of bettering yourself.

I'm reading a book on Aikido now (its good to learn from other points of view, right?) which has very, very little in it regarding Aikido technique. Instead, its focus is on the harmany the aikidoka pursues with the universe. It stresses training as the process towards a better self - physically, mentally, spiritually.....not a way to get to an end necessarily. I bring this up because Aikido is not thought of as a "fighters" art, yet the top people in the art stress training very hard. Not to necessarily be a fighter, although this might be a result, but to also learn about yourself in the process.

All in all, regardless of what you want out of your art, you have to give it your all. Otherwise, I believe you're not doing martial arts. This is ok too, just realize what it is and what's it's not.

[yellowpikachu]

Originally posted by Wilson
You definitely fight the way you train, no doubt. But even talking to those people on this forum who don't want to fight, I believe hard training will build the mentallity of a fighter,.......

IMHO,

Hard training will build the mentallity..... all are great.



simple questions I have heard in SEA are

what is your weapon? Do you have one? How destructive is it?
How fast can you exercute? Will you dare to exercute to completion ?

the rest about mental training, philosophy, martial art....... that is not applicable there. Because it is about Survival. not about thinking about the art.

It is very simple that, does one has the weapon or weapons and methodology to destroy others, does one's body can sustain others weapon incase got hit and not destroy. the rest is thinking too much.


But then, does one wants to live that way? I pray that everyone in the world doesnt have to. Because the whole thing just reicarnate over and over again with hate and revenge, one guy gets drop and lost, one is going to revenge. one's friends is going to help revenge, one's school is going to fight, one's tribe is going to going to war.... no end of lost and win. and everyone's life force is consume by the anger and hatret.

I have heard cases that even within school people go sparing and kill others due to emotional uncontrol. then regret for a whole life in denial of self...because that keen emotion to teach others a lesson or to show who is better or bad as.. fighter. and after decade, when one got old, one has fear that the other party is sending some young guy to get one. living in those shadow....and distrust... it is a true account.

with practicing the C artery choke count for how many seconds and the kneeing to the head....ect stuffs ... these days in the pop martial art. I am praying no body become vegitable and sue the heck out of the style founder.. and the person. It is very inconsiderate to practice those C artery choke stuffs in sparing because if one doesnt know other's physical condition, one can accidentally black out and kill others. that is a no no but these days people seems to think macho. just my opinion.


one the other hand, it is an evident that the Chinese martial art form or set even such as SLT is purposely train to not complete the "move". the ancestors remove the "finish up" or "completion" move to avoid accident. This is to promote as the chinese saying said, " touch is time to stop, win or lost is clear shown". instead of real destroying. That has to do with Mo Dak. which is a different way of life then the bad ass... everything go stuffs.

Another question is also that, if you know other will do what he/she thinks "just to exercute his/her superior technics" to choke you. and even if you might got into black out or even by accident cause you brain dead is not a concern.
The question then is will you spare him/her with your biu jee which "you also are " just" to exercute your technics"? and not thinking the consequence?

Is these above still an art? or it is a type of mental sickness teaching which promote not thinking about consequence.





life is more than just for that. no need to create a loop and one get into looping......

If one wants to get high about fighting, just get some action movies to watch. In real life, damage cannot be reverse. Bad ass.. is not equal to hero and macho.

But then that is just pikachu thought because pikachu value happy then hate. But then the pikachu also has a electric Zap shock weapon... life is a paradox. Pika Pika.