Unlock IS-Dfr. Merge all S-D threads together so it clears 1000 posts!
Unlock IS-Dfr. Let all the S-D threads stand independently.
Keep IS-Dfr locked down. All IS-Dfr posters deserved to be punished.
Delete them all. Let Yama sort them out.
Registered User
BW
@"Wook" I believe was speaking of the Short Form in his post?
<QUOTE>
LOL. Not a good story for the sake of credentials. I wonder how anyone can say CMC's Yang short form is "Shaolin" while GM The' gives two separate origins for it, one of which involves this "crazy" (a generic "Wong") Chinese dude
I do wonder, though ,why there's no stepping in cloud hands postures
<QUOTE>
Cheng man chings short form is our tai chi 64, with some differences, not tai chi 24.Originally Posted by OTD
Registered User
Doh' !
Senior Moment
as Rosanne Rosanadanna would say "Nevermind!"
Oops.........
Lol. I know the feeling. On the 64 version on cloud hands, I have modified the way I do it to be more like a silk reeling practice while keeping the same stances.
Daper Dan Man
I was taught 24 with "cloud hands" as my teacher put it. Then I saw 24 done by others and saw that that posture was incorrect.
For better to learn by
This statement is inaccurate as I understand it. The story I have always heard is that after challenging an internal MA and getting beaten, GMS asked GMI about it and that's when GMI began teaching him internal styles.
After seeing the specialties of the Chung Yen teachers I actually believe it's highly likely GMS learned his internal styles directly from them.
Daper Dan Man
I've heard both stories which just goes to show that there are so many untruths told that we will never know what is true.
For better to learn by
???
"cloud hands" or "wave hands like clouds" begins at 2:28 in this clip.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TBvF6...e_gdata_player
For better to learn by
Ah, I had never heard the other story. I agree these two are inconsistent.
Daper Dan Man
Yes. That's how I do it now, but I was taught differently. But that posture was called "cloud hands" by the teacher that taught me 24 (for the record it was not Garry Mullins).
servant o the Secret Fire
I also was taught cloud hands incorrectly in the 24 form, in Colorado, everyone in CSC does it incorrectly, as far as I know. I observed the master in Boise teaching it incorrectly as well, even though he's not under the Soards anymore. I corrected myself after studying the books by Yang Cheng Fu and Cheng Man Ching.
On an unrelated topic (black tiger), has anyone seen this before? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zMZ_SZUmsUU
Very interesting to me. I can see the relationship to the forms we were taught, even has the ditang techniques.
"I am a servant of the Secret Fire, wielder of the flame of Anor. The dark fire will not avail you, flame of Udun! Go back to the shadow, you cannot pass!"
For better to learn by
Maybe I don't understand what point you're making. That posture IS called cloud hands...
http://learning-tai-chi.info/images/...0tai%20chi.gif
Master of Chu Bagua
Goes for many forms--especially core forms. There is much in SD that has a ring of authenticity. And many people can use the forms as well as most styles. Which is why the storytelling is frustrating.
But as far as I can tell, SD's version of crane is rather unique--it's much faster and less "stationary" than every other fukien crane form in existence. Most fujian crane resembles only the first 4 movements of Se Meng Tao Lian. 14th and 15th are beautiful forms--but I can see no correlation to any other crane of any other style, so I don't assume that they were "learned by book." Whenever I come to such scenarios, I assume that these are a marker of originality---the Tai Peng system, 3 brown belt birds (which do have small elements resembling eagle claw in them--I met/trained briefly with a student of Sifu Rodriquez of Ying Jow Pai in Atlanta before the Sifu died [RIP], and he called our huge circling bird motions--which end in a broken leg stance--a "flower"), etc. The more exceptional the form, the more original, I think.
There are a billion family styles in existence. I assume that some of SD's forms were part of family styles taught at Chung Yen. Others....have no idea, since I have no evidence to call them one way or the other.
One could also make the case that GM Ie, who supposedly used martial arts as a way of fighting himself out of an opium addiction, couldn't remember the forms as they were taught him in his youth, and therefore supplemented some stuff with whatever he wished. Who knows....
As for internal MA, not sure, but not too concerned. I've never had a reason to question my teacher's skills. I just question the stories of the SD tradition.
Last edited by Shaolin Wookie; 11-11-2012 at 08:09 PM.
Master of Chu Bagua
The other thing to consider is that Hiang The' did learn more in Indonesia than his brother, and before their falling out this could have been a medium of exchange.
Hiang has more Tai Peng and dagger work.
This leads me to believe that the daggers and Tai Peng systems are Chung Yen legit. Where the two correlate in the basic curriculum, I assume that this was also copied from Chung Yen.
The first time I taught a college course, I went back to what I remembered as a student rather than trying to construct a whole course from scratch. Later on I refined it, but it I think most teachers do the same.
Speculation is never a science, but such assumptions are not farfetched. Again, inductive logic isn't perfect, but it's all we have to go on short of a revision of stories by Sin THe' himself.
Last edited by Shaolin Wookie; 11-11-2012 at 08:18 PM.
凸 囧 凸
Petty insults are orders of magnitude more honorable than anyone who continues to defend Shaolin Do and its founder, the liar and fraud Sin The.
Defenders of Shaolin Do are in no position whatsoever to claim any kind of honorable higher ground. Every single one of you who has defended the liar and fraud Sin The is tainted by dishonor by that very fact alone. Furthermore you have all engaged in the very pettiness you now deem beneath you in defense of the obscenity spit upon the face of Chinese martial arts that is Shaolin Do.
Had you honestly been interested in "actual information" and "insight" you wouldn't have wasted years of your life studying Shaolin Do.
And I am still waiting to see the purported "Shaolin Do can actually kick ass" footage.
Posting Permissions
Reply With Quote