View Poll Results: What to do about the 'Is Shaolin-Do for real?' thread

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  • Unlock IS-Dfr. Merge all S-D threads together so it clears 1000 posts!

    22 38.60%
  • Unlock IS-Dfr. Let all the S-D threads stand independently.

    13 22.81%
  • Keep IS-Dfr locked down. All IS-Dfr posters deserved to be punished.

    5 8.77%
  • Delete them all. Let Yama sort them out.

    17 29.82%
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Thread: Is Shaolin-Do for real?

  1. #19501
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    @Old Noob - That's fine, we're cool.

  2. #19502
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    Quote Originally Posted by Old Noob View Post
    if I was doing a form that was lifted from another lineage, there's a legitimate argument that one who wanted to truly learn that form should seek out the originator. Having said that, I've elected to stay at my current rank well beyond when they would have promoted me. At my current rank, almost all of the material is the made-up stuff and not the stolen stuff. Ironically, I couldn't get that stuff anywhere else (precisely because it was either made up or taught to Sin and Hang in Indonesia) and, like many on this thread who have left SD, I find that material very useful whether it's Kung Fu, Kun Tao, or Crazy Old Man Just Made This Up Fu.
    In the end, every MAist makes the ultimate choice on what constitutes their own practice.

    I would point out that, regarding random forms lifted from various legitimate systems, even seeking out an actual qualified teacher of a style to learn the form is meaningless without a good working knowledge of the system itself. A form taken from a system is not the style/system; it's only a piece, a small piece. For instance, lifting a Tanglang form and, say, a CLF or other form is not practicing Tanglang or CLF, but merely an attempt (very poor attempts) at mimicking some movements from said forms.
    Last edited by Jimbo; 10-10-2013 at 02:00 PM.

  3. #19503
    Quote Originally Posted by Jimbo View Post
    In the end, every MAist makes the ultimate choice on what constitutes their own practice.

    I would point out that, regarding random forms lifted from various legitimate systems, even seeking out an actual qualified teacher of a style to learn the form is meaningless without a good working knowledge of the system itself. A form taken from a system is not the style/system; it's only a piece, a small piece. For instance, lifting a Tanglang form and, say, a CLF or other form is not practicing Tanglang or CLF, but merely an attempt (very poor attempts) at mimicking some movements from said forms.
    I can't really disagree with you either. I was never a big form collector anyway. I just know that I've faired well against other stylists incorporating what I've learned in SD. I don't really see how that is too controversial.

  4. #19504
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
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    America
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    1,860

    so

    One mans gold is another mans shizen. If you learn a "Real" Kung fu but cant use it then it is Shizen even if its so called real, But if you learn some SD and can use it then it is gold. It is what you make it not how you define it, as far as losing the Dream real MA is just a dream any way.
    A Fool is Born every Day !

  5. #19505
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    378
    MA's arguing is like hearing Mormons trying to convert Catholics.

  6. #19506
    I can't really disagree with you either. I was never a big form collector anyway. I just know that I've faired well against other stylists incorporating what I've learned in SD. I don't really see how that is too controversial.
    the controversy is about now whether you are any good because out of all the SD video's of sparing......it's sub par

  7. #19507
    One mans gold is another mans shizen. If you learn a "Real" Kung fu but cant use it then it is Shizen even if its so called real, But if you learn some SD and can use it then it is gold. It is what you make it not how you define it, as far as losing the Dream real MA is just a dream any way.
    anyway you paint it, you guys are frauds. frauds stemming from frauds only to make more frauds.......for shame.

  8. #19508
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    Mar 2005
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    snipper

    and I assume you have never lied or misrepresented yourself EVER?
    A Fool is Born every Day !

  9. #19509
    and I assume you have never lied or misrepresented yourself EVER?
    Sniper is more like it. and NO....lies get discovered. like the lies spread via Shaolin Do......

  10. #19510
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    Colorado Springs, CO
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    Quote Originally Posted by bawang View Post
    lots of shaolin do people have called sin the a fraud and acknowledged shaolin do as made up. BUT they say they still train shaolin do.

    acknowledging sin the for teaching fake shaolin is a good chance to start over and learn the real one. but NONE of you guys have done it. that's what saddens me.
    That isn't true at all. I left right before the whole EM Soards issue, and before the school split off stuff, and way before Sin The admitting he made stuff up. I did it because I wasn't getting what I thought I was. It wasn't because my teacher was bad, because he wasn't. I wasn't because I didn't like the people. I still do, they are my martial arts family. It just wasn't what I was looking for.

    I'm glad I did because I am way more comfortable with my current material. Please don't lump all SDers (former or current) together Bawang.

    Do I regret training in that style? Not really, sometimes I wonder if I had done better research where I would have ended up. But it's a moot point now.

    As an aside, I think that people who do have the material from the outside sources should probably get them revised by someone from that style if they can. For example, I learned Dragon Pa Kua at an EM seminar. Now that I am training with a Fu style teacher when I get to that point I will ask as many questions and get as many corrections as possible.
    Although the changes are infinite, the principles are the same.
    - Wang Tsung Yueh

    To win one hundred victories in one hundred battles is not the highest skill. To subdue the enemy without fighting is the highest skill.
    - Sun Tzu

    Boards don't hit back.
    - Bruce Lee

  11. #19511
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    ?

    Stolen or not Made up or not , the question still remains, and we can all speculate, but where did the Original Material and Forms come from ? The ones that were taught from the beginning. We all have opinions but we know what they are like@. Everyone has one. Proof is in the puddin they say. There is Long fist, Hua's, The Tai chi, the Pakua , etc that all has roots in Traditional Ma from China ?
    A Fool is Born every Day !

  12. #19512
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    Knoxville Tennessee
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    Quote Originally Posted by bawang View Post
    lots of shaolin do people have called sin the a fraud and acknowledged shaolin do as made up. BUT they say they still train shaolin do.

    acknowledging sin the for teaching fake shaolin is a good chance to start over and learn the real one. but NONE of you guys have done it. that's what saddens me.
    Please shed more tears. Seriously, though, not everyone has an opportunity to train because of the areas they live. Personally I'd love to find a teacher in my area that focused on xingyi. Your opportunities are often limited to where you live. Not everyone can move for the sole purpose of training.
    Quote Originally Posted by Oso View Post
    AND, yea, a good bit of it is about whether you can fight with what you know...kinda all of it is about that.

  13. #19513
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    Quote Originally Posted by bawang View Post
    its better to do real shaolin badly than do fake shaolin well.
    I disagree. Assuming that fake shaolin can be effective in self-defense (and SD is as many have said and those who have met me outside of the forum will concede) then I'd rather be able to protect myself then do the real stuff poorly and get hurt in a fight.

    It's like comparing spam to a diseased cow. I'd rather eat good spam if those were my only two choices.
    Quote Originally Posted by Oso View Post
    AND, yea, a good bit of it is about whether you can fight with what you know...kinda all of it is about that.

  14. #19514
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
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    America
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    Austin

    Hey JP every year in Austin Tx there is the Spamorama. U can guess what that is . I have heard it is good? Not for me though. Spam soup, fried spam etc. Thats like Shaolinorama, there is so many different aspects of just one form or system like Hsing Ie who knows what is right anymore?
    A Fool is Born every Day !

  15. #19515
    Quote Originally Posted by Judge Pen View Post
    Please shed more tears. Seriously, though, not everyone has an opportunity to train because of the areas they live. Personally I'd love to find a teacher in my area that focused on xingyi. Your opportunities are often limited to where you live. Not everyone can move for the sole purpose of training.
    lern fram youtoob mang
    Quote Originally Posted by Judge Pen View Post
    It's like comparing spam to a diseased cow. I'd rather eat good spam if those were my only two choices.
    shaolin do is the diseased cow mang

    25th generation inner door disciple of Chen Style Practical Wombat Method
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