They've called it that for at least 18 years I think (the time I've been around).Originally Posted by MasterKiller
Unlock IS-Dfr. Merge all S-D threads together so it clears 1000 posts!
Unlock IS-Dfr. Let all the S-D threads stand independently.
Keep IS-Dfr locked down. All IS-Dfr posters deserved to be punished.
Delete them all. Let Yama sort them out.
Daper Dan Man
They've called it that for at least 18 years I think (the time I've been around).
Registered User
Yikes!I never thought a form would make me a super fighter. What I meant was that I'll take what I think is useful (punches, kicks, blocks) and discard the stuff I don't find useful. For instance, the side thrust kicks and other "fancy" stuff.
Registered User
Please explain "side thrust kick" as I don't understand what's fancy or unusual about a side kick?Yikes!
"To know you don't know is best.
Not to know you don't know is a flaw.
Therefore, the Sage's not being flawed
Stems from his recognizing a flaw as a flaw.
Therefore, he is flawless."
Registered User
Well i have seen some incredible feats from certain masters in differing styles.
I'm more of a "Thomas" kind of guy(in the biblical sence) i do not believe everything until i actually have seen evidence to support certain claims.
But still most of the "mystical deadly skills" is just plain old train for 40 years day in day out. Nothing mystical about it really. They just worked their ass off for 40 years to do incredible things with their body.
And then again, mystical or not, i still have a huge respect for it!
Registered User
You pretty much step behind your other leg to start the kick. Not something I would do in a fight.
ronin
Have you just started training in Shao-lin Tao? I'm only asking because I use that 'side thrust kick', as you call it, fairly often when I spar. The stepping is to close the distance between you and your opponent. That's it. Nothing fancy about it, and the reason for stepping behind the leg is to retain your balance as well as set your kicking leg for more power. I suggest you try this type of kick on an impact bag, and compare it to a simple front kick. You'll find you have more power behind the side kick because you put both of your hips into it.
There is some pretty fancy moves in Shao-lin Tao kung fu, but they're in the more advance belt levels, and a good teacher will teach you at least some of the practical applications to them. I suggest you read "Book of Five Rings" by Miyamoto Musashi, to learn a proper fighter's mentality. This book helped me out a lot to discern when in a fight to use a particular technique to obtain a certain result and when not to. One thing I think every martial artist can agree on, is when you're in a fight, don't lose your cool and think with your head not with your fists.
Now, I only know a little over 30 forms and half of them are quick and simple, but I do practice them everyday, and I'm constantly thinking about new, effective and practical ways to excecute various techniques.
One final thing to ponder concerning the effective use of your 'side thrust kick'. The kick is designed for power, not quickness and a fight is like playing chess, in order to get the upper hand on your opponent you trap him from a series of moves and excecute. When you see the opening, try a 'side thrust kick' to your opponent's bladder (just below the belt, where your opponents fly zipper is). You might be suprised at how effective that kick can be.
We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, therefore, is not an act but a habit.
- Aristotle
The only way of finding the limits of the possible is by going beyond them into the impossible.
- Arthur C. Clarke
Daper Dan Man
Not necessarily. "Side Thrust Kick" is a side kick, plain and simple. We focus on the heel as the point of impact whic differs from some of the side kicks that strike with the blade of the foot. Also the mechanism of throwing the side thrust kick is to pull your knee across your body before thrusting the kick out. This maximizes the power one can put behind the kick as well as the range. The downside is that the it slows the kick down and it can get over-extended so you need to use it wisely and open the door to the technique first.
What synack is talking about, I'm assuming (always dangerous), is certain sparring techniques (and a couple of basic forms) that have a side thrust kcik follwoing a little skip step etc. Its a foundation to differnt footwork that one can use, but, as I think synack is alluding too, could be a huge telegraph to an experienced fighter.
Registered User
Yes I've just started training with this school. I have some experience in boxing though. (father started to teach me boxing very young)
I tend not to like anything that I think is telegraphed. Just too risky. Being a smaller guy.
I know the kick is for power but I have yet to see a moment for me to use it. But I do enjoy most of the material and will stay with the school for a while.
Daper Dan Man
If you have a boxing background, then you'll have to oppotuntiy to create the perfect time to use it. I'm assuming that you have fast hands and can string together combos (again assuming is always dangerous). Work the head and wait for the opportunity where the elbows flair out slightly. The door is open for a good side kick. Even good fighters will flair their elbows out slightly if they respect the techniques you are thowing at their head. Maybe its because I'm older and slower (so I rely less on hook kicks and roundhouses and more on side kicks and front thrust kicks) but I see openings for a solid low side kick more than any other foot technique to the torso or head of an opponent.
You don't have to telegraph the side kick. I know plenty of people that have excellent side-kicks that you won't see coming.
ronin
The boxing training will be very helpful in your sparring, and one thing you have to realize about sparring, it's not a fight, it's a teaching element so you can implement what you learn when you fight. It's going to seem awkward to use some of the techniques your learning at first, but the more you try to put them in your sparring, the more familiar they'll be. A lot of students don't realize that they can set the tempo of the sparring session with their partner. There's no trophy to be won and no bragging rights to be gained. At the start of the match, tell your sparring partner that you're going to try some new techniques you learned and to slow the pace down a bit. If you're partner is of a higher belt level, he'll understand and can even give you some pointers about successfully using the techniques in question.
We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, therefore, is not an act but a habit.
- Aristotle
The only way of finding the limits of the possible is by going beyond them into the impossible.
- Arthur C. Clarke
Registered User
In my younger days I used the side thrust kick very effectively in sparring, but first you must develop a fast kick with good technique.
You must find a way to create an opening. Anything that will get the opponent to raise their arm or arms (depending upon their stance). My favorite techniques to open the target is to strike or feint to the head. If the opponent raises an arm to cover their head, it will open them up. If you can get them to back peddle at the same time, that helps too. Smart opponents require more finesse and creative means to get them to open up. Obviously you wouldn't try the kick if you do not have the proper opening or skill level to pull it off.
Another technique I liked was a back fist to the head followed by a front leg roundhouse kick followed by a spinning side kick. Once the opponent figures out my pattern I would alter my method. If they just backed out of the way then I would retreat drawing them into what appeared to be my vulnerability. This was just a ploy to draw them close enough for a back kick.
The key is to experiment to see what will work. If you can't go over the wall go around it, go under it, etc. Establish a pattern for your opponent to figure out. When they automatically respond to your pattern they create an opening/vulnerability somewhere else. When you have conditioned them to respond to your pattern, change the pattern and attack the vulnerability your pattern has created in them.
Last edited by Scott R. Brown; 06-26-2007 at 09:08 AM.
Junior Member
Chainwhip,
"It is supposed to be 900 forms, not styles."
Chainwhip..NO STYLE has 900 forms!! Just because it is 900 forms and not styles means little. Chan family lineage Choy Li Fut kung fu has perhaps 200 forms and "arguably probably noone knows all 200. But 900? No. There would not be enough time in one lifetime go learn all 900. There are just not that many years to live. I ""don't buy it. And if SD were real..the offical Shaolin temples have never issued a statement about it. There is not a STYLE called Shaolin..there are places called Shaolin. Styles would be things such as Hung Ga, Wing Chun, CHoy Li Fut, Eagle Claw, Praying Mantis, Monkey,etc.
All of these are styles which contain forms. And I reckon no style contains 900 forms.
"Not all schools wear the gis, Tennessee and Georgia schools wear frog button uniforms. Not that clothes really matter."
In theory that is true..but you can generally determine if a style of kung fu is legit by adherence to tradition. You don' go to schools of Tae Kwon Do and see them wearing Aikido uniforms with those big inflated bottom pants that fan out and yet claim "Yeah..we're Tae Kwon Do"
"GM The'"
The Shaolin temple does not claim to have a sole grandmaster. I don't care if it is "Grandmaster" The or The guy with the wolf man face. If you were to go to either Shaolin temple today and ask them to list a run down of the past "Grandmasters of the S. Temple" they'd look at you like you ate your own head. There are grandmastgers of styles..not temples. You are confusing the title grandmaster with that of the Head Abbott.
. "It is more like he at one time saw the forms and practiced them for a short while. "Now he has notes for a lot of forms and prepares the form off the notes when he is getting ready to teach it."
Another red flag. A professional teacher teaches forms he LEARNED in PERSON by his sifu...not read a series of scripts and then go and "wing it".
"As to the Southern Temple.......GM The' has been to both of the current Southern Temples (rumor has it that a third is in the works)" .
And your point is? So he went there...
"No fights broke out when he got there."
Is this something I should be impressed by? Does this imply as opposed to all the other times when grandmasters of other various kung fu styles have gone To Shaolin and riots broke out? LOL
The temple has embraced Buddhism(read: pacifists)..do you think that ordinarily..the monks would pick fights with visitors?
"At the government run "temple" in Putian they brought the same wushu coach that had been at the Northern Temple for awhile. They are a very nice northern style wu shu school. I'm pretty sure they have nothing to say considering they don't even teach kung-fu."
I'll bet even wu-shu is closer to kung fu than what the SD practices. "DO" is a Japanese/Korean word.
"The Quanzhou Temple that was built by a Japanese group actually does Southern style kung-fu - including sai and tonfa ."
What group? Name them. Tonfa is not a kung fu weapon..it's Japanese. More proof you are confused.
Daper Dan Man
Really? As in Jeet Kune Do? Bruce Lee was either Korean or Japanese? Interesting....
Or maybe its a romanization of a chinese term meaning "the way". As we are tranlating chinese terms into english then the spelling of tao, dao or do seems really silly imo.
Loud City
Well, do you pronounce it "shaolin-doh" or "shaolin-dow"?
I'm pretty sure "Doh" is the cantonese pronounciation, right? So why not Sil Lum Do? That would at least tie in with the "southern temple" lineage.
Last edited by MasterKiller; 06-26-2007 at 10:11 AM.
Daper Dan Man
its pronounced "doh" I couldn't tell you what dilect it's supposed to be. Si Lum would be more correct with regard to the southern lineage.
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