Is Shaolin-Do for real?

[hskwarrior]

naw, i'm workin on some pk for now!

you get cat **** out there?

Found a spot much better on my wallet but the quality is out of this world.

[Judge Pen]

The sd school is the video you linked is run by mike reid. He is a excellent teacher who has put in a lot of research and practice. He invited tim nance who is he person teaching in the video. I think he has a lot to offer. Very skilled.

Thanks for sharing your training video from your school. Some good stuff...

Too bad these discussions get lost in the white noise.

[themeecer]

Too bad these discussions get lost in the white noise.

Ain't that the truth. I hated that the Mullin's forum shut down. We need a forum where SD brothers and past brothers can discuss training techniques and other SD related topics, without so many distractions. I wouldn't necessarily want it exclusive to SD posters, though. I still want to hear what my other martial arts brothers have to say because there is a lot that can be learned from them. Oh well .. wait another year and there will be a whole new set of trolls.

[brucereiter]

Too bad these discussions get lost in the white noise.

Yep it is too bad. I have tried to talk about and share a lot of information on this thread. Each time I do it seems to be ignored for the lovely ad hominium attacks that fly back and fourth between a few of the active posters.

[tattooedmonk]

Ain't that the truth. I hated that the Mullin's forum shut down. We need a forum where SD brothers and past brothers can discuss training techniques and other SD related topics, without so many distractions. I wouldn't necessarily want it exclusive to SD posters, though. I still want to hear what my other martial arts brothers have to say because there is a lot that can be learned from them. Oh well .. wait another year and there will be a whole new set of trolls.

Funny you should bring this up....I am starting a forum for all things shaolin...anyone interested? My webmaster has built me a really nice martial arts website...so I asked if we could attach a forum to it .....at the first of the year I will let you guys know about it. It will be exclusive and all members will have to be approved first to avoid all this crap....with low to zero tolerance in place for all rules and courtesies. You all can pm me about this too.

[brucereiter]

As many of you here know I practice the internal sd stuff as taught in atl... Most of it has zero verifiable connection to Shaolin but there is one thing in the internal program that did and this is I chin Ching. I have researched many variation of I chin Ching (yi Jin jing) some have a 100 or more postures and other systems of it has 10 or 20 postures.

The sd version has 49 postures.
It is a variation of yoga and shares many common asanas to yoga that you have probably sceen. Of coarse I do not have any faith in the story sin the gives about this 49 posture system of I chin Ching but the fact is it exists and I learned it or at least a variation of it along with tai chi CHUAN and I have found it to be a great asset in building certain attributes in strength and flexibility etc that have been very helpful to my tai chi CHUAN practice. My teacher chose to teach It along side tai chi CHUAN as part of his curriculum.

Sin the claims to have had to "master" I chin Ching before learning other arts.
I would like to know more about the history and practice of ie chin Ching.
I do not think that sin the made this up. I also do not think that this Ie chin Ching was passed down by a hairy monk... But I do think I must have been learned somewhere and therefore practiced by someone else too.

What are your thoughts.

[Shaolindynasty]

Actually to be fair some of the stuff presented in this video isnt horrible http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7v7i37wzeDU
I've seen students of "legit" sifus do worse. the techniques presented by the intstructor can be workable if given a proper training format and the techniques were streamlined a little with some of the fancier or less efficient techniques removed. at the very least they are working to apply their techniques. These guys may be the exception in shaolin do but they seem like an average school that I would be judging at a chicago tourny.

I have a questions about the techniques presented in this video and how they realate to the overall practice of shaolin do. What are the main stragies employed by SD? the reason I ask is because each of the arts it has "borrowed" from have their own unique structure designed to employ a specific combative strategy. How does SD attempt to combine these and what exactly are the overall principles of the system?

[brucereiter]

Agenda/reason for posting on this thread.

Before typing something on this thread why not ask your self if the comment will be of value? If it is not of value and giving benefit to others then why say it.

I want to correct misinformation where I can, I want to lean more about the martial arts I practice and I want to learn as much about th history and methods o the material I choose to still practice that I learn while I was actively involved with sd.

Try to take the middle road. This goes to the lovers and haters of sd. Often times your extreme view of things will be blurred by lack of information and blanket statements will simply be inaccurate and cause you to sound uninformed.

Sin the has been "outed". Unless you are not able to accept reality this must be accepted, sin the lied about many parts of his martial arts history calling all of it into question. Unless he gave me a compelling reason I would not want to have any future involvement with him but this does not mean that I don't or should no value some of the things I learned as a result of sin the's actions.

If you like It or not some people who learned under that system are great people and very skilled martial artists. They should be judged solely on their actions and the content of their character and not be judged on sin the's bull****.

[brucereiter]

I have a questions about the techniques presented in this video and how they realate to the overall practice of shaolin do. What are the main stragies employed by SD? the reason I ask is because each of the arts it has "borrowed" from have their own unique structure designed to employ a specific combative strategy. How does SD attempt to combine these and what exactly are the overall principles of the system?

I think wookie was actually at that class so he might speak specifically about what was shown in that video.

I can only speak about the internal stuff since that is what I studied...
That is a great question ...

On a basic level l think most sd students do not get taught to seperate the specific strategies of each art and tend to blur the arts together.

There are many exceptions though and these exceptions are students who question, test and practice their material. There are also a few teachers in the system who encourage this.

I know one thing that has affected me even with things I did not Learn well it gave me at least a idea or a familiarity with the way people can move, a kind of exposer to possibilities if hat makes sense.

Long story short is I think "sd" intends to make you familiar with many things and for most you will only be god at a few but at least you have exposer and familiarity with a broad range of styles.

[Syn7]

If you guys want to have a good discussion on SD you may want your first move to be posting in a thread whose name doesn't insinuate that your style is questionable.

I'm sure people will troll you anyways, but it will be less. I for one couldn't be bothered to follow any of you around for any reason. Honestly, I don't care about SD or it's legitimacy. I just like to pick a side and argue it as best I can. Shit, maybe next time I'll even take up your cause, just 'cause.

Just make an SD discussion thread and ignore all challenges. Simple, no? Your posts only get buried because you people make the choice to engage others. That's on you guys. We've all pretty much explained our intentions and reasons for being here. Time for you guys to get over it. We don't respect SD and we question any and all of it because of the sheer amount of bullshit surrounding your GM. Nothing unique or unfair about it. Just go look up the Doo Wai threads. Sin The isn't being singled out or anything. You guys just needed to widen your perspective. Clean that sand out the vijayjay and re-engage or move on. But quit fucking crying about it.

Refer to the quote attributed to my name in Scott Browns sig. Seriously, you guys sound like a bunch of whiney lil bitches. Get over it already.

[Syn7]

and for the record, I would consider allowing yourself to be lied to because you want to believe, shows a lack of character. Teaching material you know is false(FOR ANY REASON) shows a lack of character. Not admitting simple truths to yourself shows a lack of character.

For you older guys, don't lie. You saw Bruce Lee movies and Kung Fu TV show and were delighted to find Sin The. So delighted that he passed a ridiculous lie over to you and you chose to accept it. A lie that was very easy to confirm. Granted, the net makes it easier, but there is a ton of material from the 70's and sooner in print that cast serious doubt on anything your teacher said. Not only that, but he stole from published materials that NONE OF YOU even bothered to look for because you had faith. That's on you. Don't get mad that people will consider you ridiculous. You did that! HSK didn't do that, wenshu didn't do that. YOU DID THAT!


You can call me a dickhead all you want. But I am more in control of my own world than anyone duped by Sin The. Anyone duped by anyone, for that matter.

[bodhi warrior]

As many of you here know I practice the internal sd stuff as taught in atl... Most of it has zero verifiable connection to Shaolin but there is one thing in the internal program that did and this is I chin Ching. I have researched many variation of I chin Ching (yi Jin jing) some have a 100 or more postures and other systems of it has 10 or 20 postures.

The sd version has 49 postures.
It is a variation of yoga and shares many common asanas to yoga that you have probably sceen. Of coarse I do not have any faith in the story sin the gives about this 49 posture system of I chin Ching but the fact is it exists and I learned it or at least a variation of it along with tai chi CHUAN and I have found it to be a great asset in building certain attributes in strength and flexibility etc that have been very helpful to my tai chi CHUAN practice. My teacher chose to teach It along side tai chi CHUAN as part of his curriculum.

Sin the claims to have had to "master" I chin Ching before learning other arts.
I would like to know more about the history and practice of ie chin Ching.
I do not think that sin the made this up. I also do not think that this Ie chin Ching was passed down by a hairy monk... But I do think I must have been learned somewhere and therefore practiced by someone else too.

What are your thoughts.

I don't know much about the history. But if someone can do all 49 postures 49 times each, they'd be super man. I mean its tough!

[Leto]

As many of you here know I practice the internal sd stuff as taught in atl... Most of it has zero verifiable connection to Shaolin but there is one thing in the internal program that did and this is I chin Ching. I have researched many variation of I chin Ching (yi Jin jing) some have a 100 or more postures and other systems of it has 10 or 20 postures.

The sd version has 49 postures.
It is a variation of yoga and shares many common asanas to yoga that you have probably sceen. Of coarse I do not have any faith in the story sin the gives about this 49 posture system of I chin Ching but the fact is it exists and I learned it or at least a variation of it along with tai chi CHUAN and I have found it to be a great asset in building certain attributes in strength and flexibility etc that have been very helpful to my tai chi CHUAN practice. My teacher chose to teach It along side tai chi CHUAN as part of his curriculum.

Sin the claims to have had to "master" I chin Ching before learning other arts.
I would like to know more about the history and practice of ie chin Ching.
I do not think that sin the made this up. I also do not think that this Ie chin Ching was passed down by a hairy monk... But I do think I must have been learned somewhere and therefore practiced by someone else too.

What are your thoughts.

Do you mean the history of specifically the 49 posture I chin ching, or of I chin ching in general? The most commonly known I chin ching is 12 postures. The standardized version in China today is practiced quite differently from the SD 49 posture version. There are a couple of similar postures, but mostly it is widely different. The SD version has much more difficult and demanding exercises. The modern standard version has intermediate movements which let the postures flow from one to the next, it is practiced continuously. The I Chin Ching is first seen in a document from the 1600's which describes the twelve postures, and has pictures. There is a short section mentioning it in Meier Shahar's "The Shaolin Monastery" book. There is not a lot of commonality. SD's number four posture that is performed like "crushing a boulder" is most similar to the traditional version's first posture of wei tuo presents the staff (or however you want to translate it). Number five "laughing buddha" in SD is closest to the third traditional posture in appearance (which is also a part of wei tuo presenting something), but it has different emphasis. The second traditional posture (yet another part of wei tuo presenting), is arms outstretched to the sides with palms out, like SD's number three. So SD has analogues of the first three traditional postures one after the other, with the first two in different order (and without the transitional movements allowing the flow between them). SD's number eight with arms stretched out in front is a similar ending posture to the traditional sixth posture, but it is emphasized differently, it isn't exactly the same. SD's nineteen and twenty look like variations of a transitional movement seen in the traditional seventh posture, "nine ghosts drawing swords". SD's number seven, bending forward and pressing the palms down to he ground, is similar to a transitional part of the twelfth traditional posture "swinging the tail", where you are also bent forward with palms pressing down. Another similarity is use of dynamic tension. I feel like the fact that many of SD's I chin ching postures are similar to yoga postures indicates that that is probably what they are. Other of the 49 which aren't directly from yoga I suspect are just good exercises/stretches that the designer wanted to train. Overall, it is much more of a workout than the traditional version. But I don't see much evidence that it came from learning and adapting the original yi jin jing, it is practiced so differently. It isn't even as though the traditional version is a subset of the SD version, since SD doesn't include most of the traditional postures, and doesn't have the transitional movements linking them.
I call the SD version "Indonesian Yi Jin Jing" to differentiate it from the traditional yi jin jing.

[OldandUsed]

@tattoomonk....re the forum. Yes, I am in.

[brucereiter]

Hi Leto,

I am asking more about the 49 posture ie chin Ching. It is one of the things I kept after I left the system. I find it to be very valuable.

Interesting comparisons, Thank you for the information.