Is Shaolin-Do for real?

[bawang]

I take it back.... he is a trash talking blowhard that cant use facts , logic or reason to debate anything and has to use childish antics, name calling and excuses to fill the void ...

no. he speak truth. you are indoctrinated. or you just treat asian culture and martial arts as a joke, a toy for your amusement.

[Empty_Cup]

I hate to say this but HSK's position is not really that unreasonable notwithstanding his sometimes indelicate treatment of his debators.

Though the form could have come from a source outside of HSK's lineage, the possibility that it would be transmitted in exactly the same way such that it would show every marker that DFW put in his book is exceedinly remote. This is especially true if the markers weren't markers that made the form look more northern or southern but were really simply markers to track folks who took the form from the book. Put another way, if SD had the form from another lineage, it wouldn't look like DFW's marked-up form, it would look more southern or something else.

Given that Sin The is an abo****ely proven liar (either under oath at his depositions or to his students) and that our version of the form isn't stylistically different from HSK's lineage but rather exactly the same with the markers put in by DFW, the great weight of the evidence is that Sin The either learned the form from the book or from someone who learned the form with the DFW markers. He's pretty logically sound on this one.

I agree with you if the bold statement above is true. But I thought that was the point of discussion. I have to defer to others like TTM and JP because I haven't learned the form. My understanding is that hsk made a false connection between SD having a form called "Shaolin 5 Animals" and assumed it was the version with markers.

[hskwarrior]

I take it back.... he is a trash talking blowhard that cant use facts , logic or reason to debate anything and has to use childish antics, name calling and excuses to fill the void ...

ttm,

YOU ARE A STRAIGHT UP DISGRUNTLED JOKE WHO CAN'T FATHOM THE FACT THAT HE WAS LIED TO BY SOME GUY FROM INDONESIA WHO CLAIMS A HAIRY MONK AND A NON EXISTENT SHAOLIN TEMPLE.

YOU ARE TOO POOSEY TO SHOW A VIDEO OF YOURSELF DOING OUR FORM. SO, I TAKE IT BACK ABOUT YOU, YOU'RE A DOOFUS.

[hskwarrior]

Don't mind me, just teaching out another form I learned from a book, or I made up.

tooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo ooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

funnnnnnnnny

[Old Noob]

I agree with you if the bold statement above is true. But I thought that was the point of discussion. I have to defer to others like TTM and JP because I haven't learned the form. My understanding is that hsk made a false connection between SD having a form called "Shaolin 5 Animals" and assumed it was the version with markers.

He's said that Jake's version of the form is exactly the same as DFW's, including the markers. He's demurred when asked to say exactly what the markers are under the rationale that he doesn't want to help SD appropriate the full version of their form, which is not entirely unreasonable. Whether to take him at his word is up to each individual but, while I have found HSK to be unreasonable sometimes, I haven't seen him be dishonest in any way.

[Empty_Cup]

He's said that Jake's version of the form is exactly the same as DFW's, including the markers. He's demurred when asked to say exactly what the markers are under the rationale that he doesn't want to help SD appropriate the full version of their form, which is not entirely unreasonable. Whether to take him at his word is up to each individual but, while I have found HSK to be unreasonable sometimes, I haven't seen him be dishonest in any way.

Ah, I see. And has anybody corroborated that Jake's version is the same as SD's version? I know that's where he started but it's also possible Jake changed his practice based on DFW's material. i.e. Jake's practice is not SD's practice of this form.

[pazman]

USSD's fake kung fu is better than Shaolin Do's fake kung fu.

[hskwarrior]

He's said that Jake's version of the form is exactly the same as DFW's, including the markers. He's demurred when asked to say exactly what the markers are under the rationale that he doesn't want to help SD appropriate the full version of their form, which is not entirely unreasonable. Whether to take him at his word is up to each individual but, while I have found HSK to be unreasonable sometimes, I haven't seen him be dishonest in any way.

i know i can be unreasonable. and no, i don't want to share any information about our form because of the way it was learned by some people in Shaolin Do. but thank you for recognizing im being honest.

i value my lineage, my own skills (whatever they are) and what my sifu has taught me. i will protect that will my life. i would gladly assist those who learned the form wrong as long as they admit to how it was learned and how it came to be corrected.

but, no matter what, i'm going to let TTM continue to practice his stolen book with with all of its earmarks. everyone in my lineage will know about this however.

[hskwarrior]

Ah, I see. And has anybody corroborated that Jake's version is the same as SD's version? I know that's where he started but it's also possible Jake changed his practice based on DFW's material. i.e. Jake's practice is not SD's practice of this form.

aaaahhhh you're so full of nonsense. show us the form YOU are referring to? you know why you won't? cause you know the truth, as simple as that.

and the funniest part of all of this is the fact that some of you on this forum are too clueless to know what is karate and what is real kung fu.

kungarate!

[sean_stonehart]

I've met Frank before in SF. He's my uncle in the Hung Sing line of CLF (even if there is separation involved). I've performed on same street as him at the same event... hell I think he was drumming when I was in the lion, not sure since I couldn't see from the back of the lion.

Frank has outlined his "faults" in dealing with people in this type of situation. He doesn't back down from it not apologise for it. It is who he is. I personally may not always agree with how things are addressed, but there's not an issue when it comes to respect of time, energy & knowledge of the materials.

The one thing that needs to be remembered in this... he knows the Futsan Lau Bun Hung Sing CLF & its history. Hands down. Seriously. Any questioning really & truly needs to stop there. It's tantamount to arguing with Chen Xiao Wang about Chen Taiji and you have zero to no experience in it or a pilot on how to land a plane, especially if you never have. There are never absolutes on anything, but when somebody is that in depth & entrenched in that topic... accept what's being said as correct unless proven in concrete otherwise.

It's common knowledge DFW & other sifu who have published books/videos almost always mark the set. It's not a big shocker. What the issue is that the form as practiced by SD is rife with the DFW markers from book (not video given the horrendous playing & transmission of the set), and that SD maintains (towing the line, not individuals) its story about it, and Jake has been openly called while doing nothing to help the cause.

Bottom line is, because Frank's sifu is the head of the Hung Sing CLF line that the form comes from, there's the ultimate word on what is & is not. Is it practiced a little different in DFW's line? Probably & that's fine. They don't lay claim to it as has been done by SD. DFW is quick to point out the relationship between him & Lau Bun & the materials learned.

Just a quick reminder of who's who in this...

[hskwarrior]

I've met Frank before in SF. He's my uncle in the Hung Sing line of CLF (even if there is separation involved). I've performed on same street as him at the same event... hell I think he was drumming when I was in the lion, not sure since I couldn't see from the back of the lion.

Frank has outlined his "faults" in dealing with people in this type of situation. He doesn't back down from it not apologise for it. It is who he is. I personally may not always agree with how things are addressed, but there's not an issue when it comes to respect of time, energy & knowledge of the materials.

The one thing that needs to be remembered in this... he knows the Futsan Lau Bun Hung Sing CLF & its history. Hands down. Seriously. Any questioning really & truly needs to stop there. It's tantamount to arguing with Chen Xiao Wang about Chen Taiji and you have zero to no experience in it or a pilot on how to land a plane, especially if you never have. There are never absolutes on anything, but when somebody is that in depth & entrenched in that topic... accept what's being said as correct unless proven in concrete otherwise.

It's common knowledge DFW & other sifu who have published books/videos almost always mark the set. It's not a big shocker. What the issue is that the form as practiced by SD is rife with the DFW markers from book (not video given the horrendous playing & transmission of the set), and that SD maintains (towing the line, not individuals) its story about it, and Jake has been openly called while doing nothing to help the cause.

Bottom line is, because Frank's sifu is the head of the Hung Sing CLF line that the form comes from, there's the ultimate word on what is & is not. Is it practiced a little different in DFW's line? Probably & that's fine. They don't lay claim to it as has been done by SD. DFW is quick to point out the relationship between him & Lau Bun & the materials learned.

Just a quick reminder of who's who in this...

appreciated. thank you for the honesty. check your pm

i will defend my lineage and its material with all i have. but the one thing i try never to do is talk bad about people's level of skill or experience. i know its all different.

But, sean, if that was you in the video i sent you, you did a great job at the set which i why i still have it up.

[GeneChing]

lol wut

And special mention to pazman for posting the post that got us over the 1K hump. Man, of all the images to do it with. Well played, pazman.

This is a landmark achievement for the Shaolin forum, as well as the KFM forum at large.

Onward to 2K!

[sean_stonehart]

appreciated. thank you for the honesty. check your pm

i will defend my lineage and its material with all i have. but the one thing i try never to do is talk bad about people's level of skill or experience. i know its all different.

But, sean, if that was you in the video i sent you, you did a great job at the set which i why i still have it up.

PM'd back...

CLF Yat Ga...

[kwaichang]

By then we will all be dead and gone HSK, up yours, u want respect earn it, You have no right to hate all just for one or 2 have done. Get a life. KC

[pazman]

1000 has been reached.

Let's close the thread.